Homosexuality

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camphortree
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12 Aug 2007, 2:08 pm

does god reward moronically persisting with an argument that makes no sense?

Hadron
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12 Aug 2007, 2:11 pm

camphortree wrote:

does god reward moronically persisting with an argument that makes no sense?

He rewards many things. Some more than others.

Ragtime
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12 Aug 2007, 2:13 pm

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Actually, you have mentioned that you DO care that the Bible damns gays. And that complaint of yours is precisely why I addressed the fact that the Bible DOES NOT DAMN all gays as modern society defines them. YOU ARE WRONG ABOUT THAT.

I was accused by you and others of being anti-gay because I'm a Christian. Well, I'm here to tell you that the Bible DOES NOT speak against all gays as you and modern society define gays. So, you're wrong; I'm not anti-gay in the sense and scope you claim.

But you expect them to just live a straight life.

No, I expect them to be straight. That means don't sexually interact or plan such with members of your own sex. Those modernly-allegedly gay people are in the clear with God.

Sopho wrote:

If they are gay, why can't they be with the person/people they want to be with?

Why can't pedophiles be with the people they want to be with?

Sopho wrote:

You are anti-gay relationships.

I'm also anti-fornication for everyone, which is why I sit here year after year with no sex. I don't hypocritically make some excuse to personally get out of obeying God. I hold myself to that very difficult morality.

1. That's not straight. I might give up on having a relationship. I'm not planning one, I might have one though. But one day I might just give up. That doesn't make me straight.

The point is that God looks acceptingly upon people with gay urges. Just not those who can't control them. A rapist is doing the physical act he's wired to do, but he's not reining-in his desires appropriately -- therfore he's guilty, not because he had sexual urges.

Sopho wrote:

3. You can do what you want. I should be able to as well though.

Well that's a rather broad-sweeping statement. My religion binds me HIGHER than the law does. Want an example? The law freely lets me have affairs other men's wives, but there's no way in hell I'd let myself do that. Following our bodily urges to all possible conclusions is neither sane, nor a right.

Sopho wrote:

You at least were able to be with who you wanted to be with though. According to you, I never can.

You can be with them. Just don't f**k them. You don't want to anyway.

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Last edited by Ragtime on 12 Aug 2007, 2:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sopho
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12 Aug 2007, 2:19 pm

Ragtime wrote:

The point is that the God looks acceptingly upon people with gay urges. Just not those who can't control them. A rapist is doing the physical act he's wired to do, but he's not reining-in his desires appropriately -- therfore he's guilty, not because he had sexual urges.

I can control my urges easily. I'm not raping anyone. Again: CONSENT.

Ragtime wrote:

I never said it does. I didn't mean anything at all.

Ragtime wrote:

You can be with them. Just don't f**k them. You don't want to anyway.

When did I say I didn't want to have sex?!
I can't marry them, so my relationship would not be protected legally.

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12 Aug 2007, 2:22 pm

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

No, I didn't say you're abnormal in thinking this, I said you're abnormal in your personal sexuality as you've defined it on WP.

What do you mean?
If you mean because most people are straight, then yes.

No, I mean the whole thing -- your whole personal sexual profile is strange. It's so unusual that it makes little sense to me at all. I can imagine being gay, as I've mentioned, but I can't imagine being you.

You can't imagine being gay because you're not gay.

As I've mentioned, I have been mentally gay before, and it seemed VERY natural at the time. I was quite enthusiatic about it, too. So yes, I can WELL imagine it, thank you very much. However, I'm not anymore, and thinking about men-on-men makes me physically sick.

Sopho wrote:

Just like I can't imagine being straight. I could try, but I'd never get it right.
Of course you can't imagine being me, you're not me. I can't imagine being you.
What's so strange about me?

I don't mean your entire self, just your sense of
1) not wanting to marry someone of the opposite sex, but being okay with marrying a woman in a man's body
2) in such a relationship, you'd never, ever, ever want to use said person's penis
3) you want a romantic relationship, but not a sexual one
4) you think romantic relationships are independent of the pursuit of sex
That's about all I can remember.

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greenblue
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12 Aug 2007, 2:22 pm

Ragtime wrote:

greenblue wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

greenblue wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Well, we've reached page 80, and have accomplished ostensibly nothing. Congrats all around.

Only because you're too stupid to understand what sexuality actually is. :roll:

Actually, you're the one who seems rather abnormal in that department.

No I'm not. Most people would accept that one's sexuality is determined by who they're attracted to, not who they have sex with.

Define "most people". Most people in the U.K.? Most people in the western world? Most people in the northern hemispere? What? And you haven't interacted with many people.

How about Professionals, Scientists, Doctors, Psychiatrists, Psychologists, Sexologists? I believe most of sexologists or very likely all of them in the world agree with it.

Well, I don't trust the opinions of "sexologists". Sex and moral issues go hand-in-hand, and their "morality" definitions vary widely from the Bible's.

That's why some people are ignorants about sexuality because they reject the information, they don't wanna know.

The Bible has plenty to say on sexuality, specifically morals, but not only. I'll take God's Word over sexologists, thank you very much.

I would actually prefer sexologists over the bible, because:

1. It was written several of years ago, people didn't have enough information and answers to things like we have today, especially when it comes to sexuality.

2. It is based on a culture that existed in which the gender roles were to favor men and not women, therefore women didn't have much rigths, men also were suppose to be in a certain way, to be "man". I doubt sexuality would be too accurate coming from times and views like that.

Of course things and interpretation about it have changed over time, the bible originaly condemns oral sex for example, now I see you personally don't, so it shows that some things are viewed today differently, than several years ago, I think this antigay thing should be changed as well.

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12 Aug 2007, 2:26 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Then you were never gay to begin with.

Ragtime wrote:

1. I doubt I would ever marry a transgendered woman, I just said I'd never rule it out. I doubt I'd be physically attracted to them.
2. a. If they're transgendered, they wouldn't want to have sex with me like that anyway, b. Of course I wouldn't, I'm not into that kind of thing, just like most straight men don't like the idea of having a penis stuck into them.
3. I never said I didn't want a sexual relationship! f*****g hell, read what I say! I said I'd be happy to have a non-sexual relationship if that was what she wanted and I loved her. I would prefer a sexual relationship though, but I could live without it.
4. Well, they are. For me at least. I can be romantically attracted to someone and not have sex with them if we were together.

Ragtime
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12 Aug 2007, 2:28 pm

greenblue wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

greenblue wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

It specifies both masculine-personality gay men and feminine-personality gay men, and condemns them both on the basis of gay sexual activity.

It's funny you mention this, you just remind us about the gender roles that existed at that time, and how women were viewed and were suppose to be, and how men were suppose to be.

Are you saying there's no difference between men and women?

Then what the hell are we discussing here?

LOL
Another funny thing you say.

You know what I mean, I suppose you are kidding, right? I don't think you are being serious, aren't you?

No. lol

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Ragtime
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12 Aug 2007, 2:30 pm

camphortree wrote:

does god reward moronically persisting with an argument that makes no sense?

That's actually a very complex question, even though it was meant facetiously.

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camphortree
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12 Aug 2007, 2:31 pm

Ragtime wrote:

camphortree wrote:

does god reward moronically persisting with an argument that makes no sense?

That's actually a very complex question, even though it was meant facetiously.

thanks

greenblue
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12 Aug 2007, 2:34 pm

Ragtime wrote:

You first were comparing homosexuality with pedophilia, now rapists in general as well?
Those two are bad because children and women, and men as well, are being hurt, harm and damaged.

Two gay couple having a consensual relationship doesn't harm anyone, there is a big difference, homosexual relationships DON'T HARM ANYONE, just as straight relationships don't harm anyone either as long there is CONSENT.

This is easy to understand, actually. The rapists argument has no value.

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Last edited by greenblue on 12 Aug 2007, 2:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ragtime
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12 Aug 2007, 2:35 pm

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

I can control my urges easily. I'm not raping anyone. Again: CONSENT.

Soph... it's an ANALOGY. (Poor Soph.)

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

I never said it does. I didn't mean anything at all.

I'm just saying.

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

You can be with them. Just don't f**k them. You don't want to anyway.

When did I say I didn't want to have sex?!

Well, you said you'd be fine with not having sex. To me, that means you don't actively want to have sex.

Sopho wrote:

I can't marry them, so my relationship would not be protected legally.

Oh well. Just try and get the votes. Beyond that you can't rightfully protest. We're legally bound by the respective governments under which we live, so yelling at people for more rights than are voted for is just babyish.

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Ragtime
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12 Aug 2007, 2:37 pm

Sopho wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

greenblue wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

It specifies both masculine-personality gay men and feminine-personality gay men, and condemns them both on the basis of gay sexual activity.

It's funny you mention this, you just remind us about the gender roles that existed at that time, and how women were viewed and were suppose to be, and how men were suppose to be.

Are you saying there's no difference between men and women?

Then what the hell are we discussing here?

There are no differences that are universal to EVERY man or EVERY woman. You can't say X, Y and Z apply to every woman. Everyone as an INDIVIDUAL is different.

Then you don't absolutely-only want to be with a woman, case closed.

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Sopho
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12 Aug 2007, 2:38 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Soph... it's an ANALOGY. (Poor Soph.)

I get that it's an analogy (albeit a s**t one), I was pointing out that there's a big flaw in your analogy.

Ragtime wrote:

Well, you said you'd be fine with not having sex. To me, that means you don't actively want to have sex.

To you it might mean that, but to me it doesn't. Lots of people want sex, but are prepared to live without it. I think the person I love and care about it much more important than getting sex. Stop making even more stupid assumptions about me.

greenblue
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12 Aug 2007, 2:39 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Sopho wrote:

greenblue wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

It specifies both masculine-personality gay men and feminine-personality gay men, and condemns them both on the basis of gay sexual activity.

It's funny you mention this, you just remind us about the gender roles that existed at that time, and how women were viewed and were suppose to be, and how men were suppose to be.

Yeah, who cares whether they man is feminine or masculine?

God.

I didn't know God was sexist, I suppose the God from the bible might be.

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Last edited by greenblue on 12 Aug 2007, 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sopho
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12 Aug 2007, 2:40 pm

Ragtime wrote:

yelling at people for more rights than are voted for is just babyish.

I never voted for homophobic Christian conservatives though.
And fighting for you rights is babyish? ROFL shut up.

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