I think Aspergeans should NOT have children

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You go, Kitsy!! !

You know what's funny? Without NT's we would not know that we are autistic, it would be nothing to compare, so what's the big anger about NT's? The concept of autistic only exists in the context of NT world.

Last edited by cerasela on 08 Oct 2007, 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I am not an "authority" except in that I do quite a bit of research in the field due to my current collegiate path. The differences are in speech and socialization. Speech develops normally, if not early, in Aspies. Socialization is usually problematic but attainable in Aspies. They frequently attempt to "fit in" socially, but due to weakened social skills, make many mistakes along the way. And I am angry. I am so tired of people acting like one group is "better" than the other because of genetics. Don't people understand? Genetics is a roll of the dice. How did my husband's parents end up with an Aspie when there is NO previous autism or asperger's in the family? We did extensive research.There is not one that was considered even "unusual" by the family. In my case, I cannot trace my genes...I am adopted. I was reared by nts. It was, and is, a nightmare. They were considered by this society to be great parents...other than I was punished harshly for stimming, for speaking differently, for sensory issues, and for social faux pas. I was punished, in essence, for my disability. Nice parenting. However, I took a child who is severely autistic (in their opinion, not mine) that they said would never talk, who they wanted on tons of meds to stop the meltdowns and taught him to sign, then to talk. He now speaks in sentences and can communicate feelings. He wears very specialized clothing and I am very aware of the sensory problems BECAUSE of my aspie status. He can now attend school and is showing great promise in music. My eldest daughter with Asperger's is flourishing, again because of my personal experiences and knowledge of Asperger's and Autism. It was my diagnosis, as well as my children's, that lead to a major in Psychology with a duel minor in neurosciene and communicative disorders. I am working on a PhD. I plan to teach in a professorship at Princeton (where I will finish my PhD) and do research into the Autism Spectrum. I currently am working through my college on helping to change the DSM-IV diagnostics for Asperger's and developing one specifically for adults, seeing as the problems seen are different.
I am sorry I come across as angry but I deal with a LOT of ignorance at my University as well as within my community and my family. My son and daughters are frequently referred to as "ret*d" though their intelligence is far higher than most people's. I am spoken to as if dumb frequently. A disability does not mean less worthwhile. This world needs to change their opinion of those who are different.

I think we are all here because we wanted a place where nobody judges us, you can discuss, vent, rant, smile, whatever...nobody is trying to work on their PhD thesis here...you were a little dramatic and I have enough drama in my life to find drama at Wrong Planet...There is just enough arrogance in the real world, please don't be arrogant here. And don't be angry with me, I am just being honest, I can see you type at the speed of light...I am not trying to upset you, but your post made me think like this.

Now very sincerely, thank you for your efforts to change things about Autism and Asperger, I can see that you are really passionate and willing to put yourself on the line, that's excellent! Congratulations on your work. I hope that you can change things at a high level.

I agree. Not one group or the other is better. We all need each other; NT's, Autistics, Asperegers... How (or where) we end up on the spectrum (or not) is a genetic crap shoot. Some are more of a "blend" than others.

You are a very pessimistic person.

Of course some people with very low social skills will be placed in the special education classes, but that doesn't necessarily make them dumb. I would guess that many Aspies would be placed in the Special Ed classes because of their low social skills and nothing to do what-so-ever with academic criteria. Not to mention: You are grading peoples intelligence by what classes they took in high school?

It's okay to think that people with AS shouldn't reproduce and it is perfectly fine to have your opinion that way.

HOWEVER, DON'T MAKE YOURSELF LOOK LIKE A FOOL BY POSTING IN AN ONLINE FORUM "YOU ARE ALL ret*ds BECAUSE YOU ARE .0000003% AUTISTIC, AND YOU SHOULD NEVER REPRODUCE."

It kinds of makes other people dislike you; maybe even hate you. It is also very childish and immature.

Brian, I did not command anyone to do anything; I just expressed my opinion. Read all the messages in this thread and you will find that a few are from people who actually claim to share my opinion. So I have an unpopular opinion and my view of the world is different from that of most people. So what? Isn't that what being an aspergean is all about?

And just for the record, I did not call anyone a ret*d nor speculated on the severity of their condition.

hmm, I'm not you or anything but sometimes I say things the wrong way and it appears to be much harsher than intended. Is that the case for you? If not you are sounding alot like people that hate others for being different. Are you just mirroring how others have made you feel?

Yes, I have had NTs snap at me over "innocent" comments I have made.



I don't dislike aspergeans more than I dislike myself.

Okay just wanted to ask before assuming. I can relate to self loathing at times but after analyzing everything it doesn't make me suddenly want to develop a cheerleader-esque attitude. What I'm really trying to say is *hugs*

Heres a thought. Suggesting that aspies shouldnt breed is implying that they shouldnt exist, and as a lot of us ARE aspies, that implies WE should not exist, that we are an aberration, something to be stamped out, something that is wrong.

Any wonder that people get a teensy bit offended about the subject?

EXACTLY! That is exactly why I get so offended. When I get offended, I tend to say things in ways that I don't mean them. I am treated like I should not exist, that my children should not exist, and it hurts and offends me greatly. This world seems to be well on its way to something akin to Kurt Vonnegut's "Harrison Bergeron" where only exact equality is allowed and individuality is punishable by death. They would "hinder" the athletic and the intelligent to make them exactly average and raise up those who were beneath. Those that couldn't be..."disappeared". Would we disappear in that society? People today are threatened by those who are different in any way. Though life has been hard for me because of my asperger's I love life and appreciate my differences...my children's too. My neurotypical brother suffers because he is very intelligent and was made fun of for that. My neurotypical son faces teasing over his intelligence and his superior sporting abilities. It doesn't matter what the difference is, people judge you and make fun. I am teased even at this level in college! It is asinine. I see what they have to offer me; why can they not see what I may offer them?

And I apologize for coming across as egotistical or arrogant. When I am hurt or angry, it is a defense mechanism I cope with; I feel the need to "prove" I have a right to exist and be It is very difficult to overcome years of being treated as though you do not have the right to be here at all. I do not mean to be. I have nothing to be arrogant about. Anything I have, any talent I posses, was a gift from God and not my own anyways. I am who He determined I should be. I just felt threatened so I bit back. My social mistakes usually are because...everything can seem threatening depending on the situation. Since I have no chance at reading voice or face here, (like it would help in person!) I could not tell the true reason behind this posting.

If you feel you should not have kids, don't have them. My sister-in-law is not having children by choice and she has nothing wrong with her. She simply does not wish to be a mother. Or, if you want kids but are afraid to raise an Autie/aspie, adopt. There are thousands of children in need of good homes. However, there is no guarantee there...I am adopted and aspie.

Again, a thousand apologies if any offense was taken by anyone here.

Actually it really isn't irresponsible. The fact that these message boards are free and open means that the consensus of the message boards will by and large tell posters what is acceptible and what is not. Now of course if there is something really serious such as criminal behavior, intentional defamation, or falsely impersonating other posters that's a whole different matter. But if we always relied on the administrator to protect us how could we learn to develop the message board savvy to be able to protect ourselves? If Evilmonkey wants to post nonsense statements he/she should feel free to do so but I also feel Evilmonkey does so at his/her own risk.

CockneyRebel,

I was in a "special ed" class in first grade because I didn't speak English. However, I learned more in that class than I ever learned in my life. I wound up reading at fifth grade level by the end of first grade. I don't think I would have realized my potential if I had been in a regular classroom.

I scored high on verbal tests, so I am definitely not "ret*d" in that respect. I am very shy, bookish and an introvert. I consider myself somewhat of a nerd.

Mw,

If you had said that you felt *you* should not breed because of your condition, you would have my full support (particularly as someone who had to make a similar decision for different reasons), but instead you you decided that NONE of us should breed.

I am sorry but that decision is not for you to make.

M

I can see how it would be easier to not read someone's post before replying.

I never said Einstein's work was worthless. I never said that a persons life work is meaningless because of a disability. I was saying that from a population genetics standpoint, seeing as though we lack natural predators to thin our numbers, voluntary celibacy is the only way to ensure that defective genes do not permeate into the population. "Should the guy with a genetic defect have no children?" Not if he cares about future generations. His 1 child will over generations ensure that the genetic defect multiplies into the generation through genetic drift.

You speak about Aspies being the next step in evolution; but evolution isn't simply about making sure that positive mutations are passed on, but that deletrious mutations are eliminated out of the gene pool.

I'm not talking about 'norms' I'm talking about measurable standards of success and biological fitness. I haven't said anything about concentrations camps or mistreating those who are different. I am merely asking that people exercise responsibility when it comes to reproduction and ask themselves whether making more copies of themselves is truly going to be better for humanity.

You have taken my statements completely out of context and set up a straw man to attack.