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skafather84
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02 Oct 2009, 12:01 pm

Don't give the racist too much attention.


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MissConstrue
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02 Oct 2009, 12:32 pm

Well according to the future population stats in Europe, immigration may be a good thing afterall..... :wink:

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg2 ... rinks.html


Population: Europe's problems will grow as it shrinks

29 September 2009 by Reiner Klingholz
Magazine issue 2727. Subscribe and get 4 free issues.
EUROPE, where the so-called population explosion got under way in the 18th century, is once again playing a pioneering role in demographic development. The continent has the lowest fertility rate and the most elderly population in the world, and this population will soon start to shrink. All this makes it a front runner in a demographic trend that sooner or later will reach most of the world.

Pioneers have to advance through difficult terrain. Economists are already fretting over the problem of how social security systems will cope when the post-war baby boomers start collecting their pensions in 2015. In hyper-ageing countries like Italy and Germany, where 1 in 7 people will be over 80 in 2050, it is unclear how a shrinking group of young people can generate the wealth needed to support the growing cohort of elderly citizens. Europe's competitiveness could fall behind younger and growing populations in other world regions.

On the face of it, fewer people seems like good news for the environment. The population of Germany, Europe's most populous country, will shrink by at least 8 million by 2050 and this trend is set to be replicated in many of its neighbours. Remote rural areas, mainly in central and eastern Europe, might become depopulated over time. This should benefit biodiversity as displaced plant and animal species recolonise their old terrain. Given that the world population is still growing by about 200,000 people a day, and the ecological footprint of the human race already lies beyond the limits of sustainability, fewer European mega-consumers will be a blessing for the health of the planet - and fewer North Americans would be even better.

But look a little deeper, and the picture becomes more complicated. Decreasing population does not necessarily promise environmental benefits. The cost per head of population for infrastructure such as sewage systems or electricity supply increases when population numbers go down, making clean water and non-polluting energy even more expensive than they are today.

So can Europe overcome its demographic and ecological challenges at the same time? The solution might be found in a rarely discussed concept: demographic sustainability.

High population growth, such as that now taking place in many African countries, is not sustainable. But very low fertility rates are unsustainable too. It will be hard for countries with persistently low fertility to remain competitive, creative and wealthy enough to keep ahead of their country's environmental challenges. What is needed is a middle ground.

A demographically sustainable Europe needs to have a stable or slowly shrinking population as the existing infrastructure operates most efficiently when the number of inhabitants remains fairly constant. What would it take to achieve this? At present, the average fertility rate in Europe is 1.5 children per woman, and in countries below this line there is an urgent need for family policies to encourage women to have more children. Countries with fertility rates above 1.8, including France, the UK and Sweden, do not need further pro-birth policies as immigration will fill the demographic gap.

Europe's biggest challenge is to survive the peak of ageing, which will come around 2045. After that the baby-boom generation will leave the population pyramid, and Europe will enter a new phase of its demographic journey.

Until then, it is important to focus less on human quantity and more on human capacity; not on how many people there are, but on how productively they live their lives. Working life must be extended and Europe must invest heavily in education, as fewer young brains will have to deliver increased creativity and productivity. Every member of society will be needed, so Europe cannot afford to allow marginalised, socially underprivileged groups to languish.

Countries that learn to live in prosperity with an ageing, stagnant population, or even one that is shrinking, will be the trendsetters for a sustainable future. Europe has the chance to develop a blueprint for these modern societies - for economies that found their wealth and well-being not on growth but on stability.




As for the overpopulated U.S. I guess it's time to kick the immigrants out.....:?


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skafather84
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02 Oct 2009, 12:49 pm

MissConstrue wrote:
As for the overpopulated U.S. I guess it's time to kick the immigrants out.....:?


The economy is doing so bad, some of them are leaving on their own. I think we recently reported our first negative immigration recently? (Not sure, I heard it over the radio and you know how that is).


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02 Oct 2009, 12:55 pm

why are people more worried of the wrong deeds of other peoples when their own peoples do the wrong deeds just as often?

all the time

foreigners do crime. natives do crime.
foreigners get the jobs. natives get the jobs.
foreigners buy groceries. natives by groceries.
foreigners watch tv. natives watch tv.
foreigners murder and rape. natives murder and rape.

ancient ape-fears, "invading tribes" we have to protect our deer and our antilope, we can reasonably know this, but as a collective we turn into apes again. that is "we" as a species, not as a person.

im above it all 8)


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Henriksson
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02 Oct 2009, 1:06 pm

I think it has done my country a great favour. Without immigration, the population would be shrinking after all. With a population of a mere 9 million, that's the last thing Sweden needs. It definitely is not a trend that should be stopped, rather it should be increased.


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MissConstrue
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02 Oct 2009, 1:07 pm

skafather84 wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
As for the overpopulated U.S. I guess it's time to kick the immigrants out.....:?


The economy is doing so bad, some of them are leaving on their own. I think we recently reported our first negative immigration recently? (Not sure, I heard it over the radio and you know how that is).


Yeah so many immigrants, I wonder which is currently the most hated here....

Oh wait...it's them dixies from the south of course... :wink:


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Orwell
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02 Oct 2009, 1:29 pm

MisterBBB wrote:
Really? My information is that half the male afro americans are either on the dole or in jail.

Most African immigrants to the US are actually extremely hard-working, productive members of society. The majority of African Americans are descended from slaves who were imported to America (ie they didn't immigrate) and many of the problems we face with them are because of a social structure that disadvantages blacks and keeps many of them in poverty.

Immigration has always been a net benefit to America. When Germany got anti-Semitic, America got some rather bright Jewish scientists.


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ascan
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02 Oct 2009, 1:58 pm

ruveyn wrote:
MisterBBB wrote:
In Europe we face mass-immigration from non-western countries. Countries with an often very different culture and mentality. The result: crime, unsafety, unemployment.
Is this the way?


That same situation made the United States prosperous. On balance immigration has promoted the economic welfare of the United States.

ruveyn

Well, it didn't do much for the indigenous N American population, ruveyn. Over here, I can see many European cultures going the same way as the Sioux.



ascan
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02 Oct 2009, 1:59 pm

MisterBBB wrote:
In Europe we face mass-immigration from non-western countries. Countries with an often very different culture and mentality. The result: crime, unsafety, unemployment.
Is this the way?

Vote BNP -- the only option.



MissConstrue
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02 Oct 2009, 2:30 pm

ascan wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
MisterBBB wrote:
In Europe we face mass-immigration from non-western countries. Countries with an often very different culture and mentality. The result: crime, unsafety, unemployment.
Is this the way?


That same situation made the United States prosperous. On balance immigration has promoted the economic welfare of the United States.

ruveyn

Well, it didn't do much for the indigenous N American population, ruveyn. Over here, I can see many European cultures going the same way as the Sioux.


Oh no....you mean there's European genocide going on over there?


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Henriksson
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02 Oct 2009, 2:32 pm

MissConstrue wrote:
ascan wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
MisterBBB wrote:
In Europe we face mass-immigration from non-western countries. Countries with an often very different culture and mentality. The result: crime, unsafety, unemployment.
Is this the way?


That same situation made the United States prosperous. On balance immigration has promoted the economic welfare of the United States.

ruveyn

Well, it didn't do much for the indigenous N American population, ruveyn. Over here, I can see many European cultures going the same way as the Sioux.


Oh no....you mean there's European genocide going on over there?

I can swear the Arabs are handing out smallpox blankets to us every day. :P


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MissConstrue
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02 Oct 2009, 2:46 pm

Henriksson wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
ascan wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
MisterBBB wrote:
In Europe we face mass-immigration from non-western countries. Countries with an often very different culture and mentality. The result: crime, unsafety, unemployment.
Is this the way?


That same situation made the United States prosperous. On balance immigration has promoted the economic welfare of the United States.

ruveyn

Well, it didn't do much for the indigenous N American population, ruveyn. Over here, I can see many European cultures going the same way as the Sioux.


Oh no....you mean there's European genocide going on over there?

I can swear the Arabs are handing out smallpox blankets to us every day. :P


Well in that case something must be done lest history repeats itself like an infestation of migrant rats carrying the bubonic plague.

This calls for another crusade only this time it will be called The European Braves! :ninja:


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MisterBBB
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02 Oct 2009, 4:33 pm

Who is this skafather? He needs psychiatric assistance.


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TitusLucretiusCarus
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02 Oct 2009, 4:36 pm

*yawn* here comes ascan. fan-tastic.



skafather84
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02 Oct 2009, 4:46 pm

MisterBBB wrote:
Who is this skafather? He needs psychiatric assistance.



How very communist of you to suggest that.


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claire-333
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02 Oct 2009, 4:52 pm

MisterBBB wrote:
Who is this skafather? He needs psychiatric assistance.
Uncool.