Western society and degradation of women

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I don't think our culture is degrading to women any more than it is to men. If I were a woman I'd certainly prefer to western culture to any where else.

What about conservative Christian culture? Women seem to be treated as equals. Unlike Catholics where women can't take certain positions like being a priest.

Western Societies to some degree or other are degrading to all human beings.

Comparing different cultures and 'grading' them is like comparing apples and oranges.

In some cases tens of thousands of years of disparate development with no direct contact and little or no indirect contact shapes communities so differently that comparison by modern standards and values is pointless. Societies that may have only had a few hundred years of contact, time to reflect and then assimilate any new values into their own shouldn't be expected to 'catch up' quickly, nor should societies made wary by traumatic or at the very least unpleasant first encounters be expected to.

A Fable.

Two men meet at a high col while on a pilgrimage to the summit of a holy mountain.
The first man introduces himself and announces that he comes from the far away coast where the land is open and water a part of life, The second does the same except he comes from the other side of the ranges from a place deep in the jungle.
The first man asks, 'by what path did you travel here'?
The second replies, 'I came by the forest paths'.
'Really, oh my friend, were you not afraid of the wild animals, the tiger for one the cobra for another'?
'Oh no, I am used to the jungles and forests and I know how to avoid such danger. But what of you my friend? you traveled by river and then across the wide open country did you not? were you not afraid of robbers or animals?
'No, no, no, why would I I am used to such things and know how to avoid such dangers'....

In my experience human beings are quite adaptable, given reason and time we will always copy that which we see as more successful or enjoyable in others actions. Perhaps the reason we are not adopting each others ways is because none of us see much to be commended in the other. Partly this may be because of our cultural blinkers our respective starting places around the base of the holy mountain - so to speak.

True Islamic culture does not denigrate women particularly, however other cultural hangovers of a pre-Islamic origin often run in conflict with these 'newer' ideals, eg, female circumcision which is a tribal African tradition specific to some African Moslems.

Male circumcision in the west?
Chastity belts?
Pack rape by soldiers, cops, sports teams, gangs of thugs...?

Peace j

Traditional culture is no excuse for mistreating people. It may be exceedingly difficult to change but that does not mean it should not be changed.

for those who keep saying that, well, we're not as bad as those other guys over there, let me make this clear: not being last in line does not necessarily mean that you're the winner, ok?

Another thing: while non-violent porn might not lead to more aggression against women, there is evidence that violent porn does so. In addition, porn gives men a false idea of what women want in sex and what women want in a relationship:
http://www.salon.com/life/feature/2009/ ... n_star_not