Sen. Bernie Sanders - The War Against Working Families

Page 2 of 10 [ 147 posts ] Go to page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 10 Next

Previous topic | Next topic

xenon13
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 13 Dec 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,638

05 Dec 2010, 1:31 am

psychohist wrote:

There's a war against working families, all right, but the people waging it are the ones who want to tax the families that work to support families on welfare that don't work.

Then tax the rich for that as it's the rich bosses who insist on a Reserve Army of Labour to keep wages down and workplace discipline up. They claim of course that it's to fight inflation... Non-Accelerating Inflation Rate of Unemployment they call it - Milton Friedman's NAIRU - "Full employment" at 6%!

Master_Pedant
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,903

05 Dec 2010, 2:39 am

Orwell wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Isn't he a self-avowed socialist?

Yes, although his notion of "socialism" is influenced by the skewed use of the term in American political discourse. He does not fit the historical definition of socialism.

Bernie Sanders seems to be more of a leftwing social democrat than a true socialist.

_________________
http://www.voterocky.org/

marshall
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,752
Location: Turkey

05 Dec 2010, 4:05 am

Inuyasha wrote:

Isn't he a self-avowed socialist?

Also isn't the top 1% paying the majority of taxes. Additionally there aren't as many rich people as there used to be.

I like what he did on some of the transparency stuff, but he's way off his rocker on this. This is blatent class warfare.

You're right. It is class warfare. Yet right-wingers have no moral or ethical defense against his arguments. You simply want to shut people up by screaming "socialist" or "class warfare" and refusing to even discuss certain things.

skafather84
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 20 Mar 2006
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,848
Location: New Orleans, LA

05 Dec 2010, 4:10 am

marshall wrote:

You're right. It is class warfare.

Waged by the upper class against the rest of us. Sadly, they have more of a means to convince the dunces that they're the victim despite that they obviously aren't (the Israel strategy).

_________________
Wherever they burn books they will also, in the end, burn human beings. ~Heinrich Heine, Almansor, 1823

?I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs or insanity for everyone, but they've always worked for me.? - Hunter S. Thompson

number5
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Age: 46
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,691
Location: sunny philadelphia

05 Dec 2010, 9:30 am

skafather84 wrote:

marshall wrote:

You're right. It is class warfare.

Waged by the upper class against the rest of us. Sadly, they have more of a means to convince the dunces that they're the victim despite that they obviously aren't (the Israel strategy).

Case and point:

ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 88
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

05 Dec 2010, 11:06 am

Same old, same old. In any market economy the few will out-own the many. Even in the Soviet Union the Aparachiks owned (i.e. controlled) most of the economy, not the sons of labor.

ruveyn

psychohist
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 23 Feb 2010
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,623
Location: Somerville, MA, USA

05 Dec 2010, 11:42 am

marshall wrote:

Yet right-wingers have no moral or ethical defense against his arguments.

Right wingers? Most of the billionaires are Democrats, and for good reason. It's the Democrats that work to maintain a byzantine tax system that allows the billionaires to get away with paying lower rates than working professionals through dodges like double deductions for charitable donation of appreciated stock, which allows them to avoid paying any tax at all if they want to.

marshall
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,752
Location: Turkey

05 Dec 2010, 11:55 am

psychohist wrote:

marshall wrote:

Yet right-wingers have no moral or ethical defense against his arguments.

That's completely irrelevent and you must know there are many wealthy people who would support reforming the tax system even if it meant paying higher taxes themselves.

Inuyasha
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,745

05 Dec 2010, 2:25 pm

marshall wrote:

psychohist wrote:

marshall wrote:

Yet right-wingers have no moral or ethical defense against his arguments.

That's completely irrelevent and you must know there are many wealthy people who would support reforming the tax system even if it meant paying higher taxes themselves.

The problem is practically 50% of Americans don't pay income tax. If everyone payed the same percent of their income to the government, then people would demand more responsibility. People should stop looking at the rich as a piggy bank.

If some rich people want to pay more taxes, how about they make donations to the Federal Government instead of trying to force other people to pay more.

Quartz11
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 Mar 2010
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,237
Location: New England

05 Dec 2010, 2:30 pm

Master_Pedant wrote:

Orwell wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Isn't he a self-avowed socialist?

Yes, although his notion of "socialism" is influenced by the skewed use of the term in American political discourse. He does not fit the historical definition of socialism.

Bernie Sanders seems to be more of a leftwing social democrat than a true socialist.

He calls himself a Democratic socialist, and is not a Marxist socialist.

I consider him to be one of the few honestly good politicians in America today.

Inuyasha
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,745

05 Dec 2010, 2:36 pm

Quartz11 wrote:

Master_Pedant wrote:

Orwell wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Isn't he a self-avowed socialist?

Yes, although his notion of "socialism" is influenced by the skewed use of the term in American political discourse. He does not fit the historical definition of socialism.

Bernie Sanders seems to be more of a leftwing social democrat than a true socialist.

He calls himself a Democratic socialist, and is not a Marxist socialist.

I consider him to be one of the few honestly good politicians in America today.

Democratic Socialist = Marxist socialist

They just call it something else so people miss the warning signs. As to honesty, he is one of the few politicians that is honest. However he is also severely misguided.

Tollorin
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,178
Location: Sherbrooke, Québec, Canada

05 Dec 2010, 2:48 pm

Orwell wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

Isn't he a self-avowed socialist?

Yes, although his notion of "socialism" is influenced by the skewed use of the term in American political discourse. He does not fit the historical definition of socialism.

Quote:

Also isn't the top 1% paying the majority of taxes.

The top 1% pays a large portion of taxes, but that is obviously because they control a large portion of the wealth. They actually pay considerably less than their fair share if you compare their share of the total national wealth to their share of the tax burden.

Quote:

Additionally there aren't as many rich people as there used to be.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. The gap between rich and poor in America has grown dramatically in recent decades.

Quote:

I like what he did on some of the transparency stuff, but he's way off his rocker on this. This is blatent class warfare.

Is it not class warfare to systematically shift the tax burden from the rich to the middle class? Is it not class warfare to balance the budget off the backs of the poorest Americans while giving yet more tax breaks to the ultra-rich?

So, there is still some sane peoples in this world. :wink:

_________________
Down with speculators!! !

Inuyasha
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,745

05 Dec 2010, 3:00 pm

I'm going to point out that poor people have never created jobs for people. At what point does it become wrong on taxing rich people? 70%, 80%, 90%, 100% of their income. Get a clue, the people you are proposing to hike taxes on are the people that own small businesses, they are the very people you want to hire people.

pandabear
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,402

05 Dec 2010, 3:05 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

I'm going to point out that poor people have never created jobs for people.

Not true. Poor people buy things from rich people. If poor people had no money at all, then rich people would also become poorer.

Suppose you were rich and owned an apartment building. If no-one had any money to pay your rent, then you would become poor, too.

Inuyasha
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,745

05 Dec 2010, 3:17 pm

True, however a lot of people aren't hiring because they are afraid of what their taxes are going to be in addition to the costs from Obamacare.

number5
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Age: 46
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,691
Location: sunny philadelphia

05 Dec 2010, 4:20 pm

What shred of evidence even exists to supports the idea that tax cuts for the rich create jobs? The past 30 years or so have shown, quite conclusively, that trickle down economics is total bullsh*t.

Page 2 of 10 [ 147 posts ] Go to page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 10 Next

Jump to:

Sen. Bernie Sanders - The War Against Working Families Post Reply New Topic

Sen. Bernie Sanders - The War Against Working Families