What will it take to convert you from atheism?

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ruveyn
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24 May 2011, 8:11 am

I want to see God display Itself clearly, visibly and unambiguously. In such a way as not to require prophets or preachers.

No one doubts a tornado when the see and hear it. I wish God to manifest Itself just as clearly.

ruveyn



pandabear
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24 May 2011, 8:12 am

I'd gladly convert from Atheism, for, say, a million bucks.

But, if you expect regular church attendance, better make that 20 million.



sartresue
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24 May 2011, 8:24 am

pandabear wrote:
I'd gladly convert from Atheism, for, say, a million bucks.

But, if you expect regular church attendance, better make that 20 million.


Divine dollars topic

I'll take religion for One Billion Dollars in Bullion Gold. :P


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Moog
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24 May 2011, 8:26 am

I'm not an atheist.


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Philologos
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24 May 2011, 8:47 am

If as Philalogon I had responded to this, I would have said that I would have to be faced with critical data, percepts which could not be counterfeited and which pointed more clearly to a divine entity than to anything else. If in an expansive mood, I might have gone on to say that the probability of my being convinced by human testimony or argument was near nil. I was and remain Doubting Thomas, I have to see for myself, if someone tries to talk me into a belief [other than by simply pointing me to the data] I back away.

Today, as Philologos Palaeologos [Christianus sum], I need to add, it likely for most of the respondents as for me requires a direct input of data from a divine entity.



Fnord
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24 May 2011, 9:03 am

Even though I am a Theist, I'll play "Devil's Advocate" on this one.

joerojas87 wrote:
What will it take to convert you from atheism?
That would take a miracle.
joerojas87 wrote:
If a Christian can give a rational explanation...
That would BE a miracle! :lol:
joerojas87 wrote:
If god who is believed to be by virtually all religions...
Appeal to Popularity (Argumentum ad Populum) is a fallacy of reason. Just because "Everybody" believes thus-and-such, it does not follow that the belief is valid. If this is all that your argument is based on, then your argument has already failed - epically.
joerojas87 wrote:
... an all powerful and all knowing being, then by those virtues god already knows what the future holds for us because he knows everything.
Evidence, please?
joerojas87 wrote:
Despite this knowledge, god created the initial conditions for us from which suffering would inevitably occur; regardless if we believe we have free will, from gods perspective everything is deterministic.
Evidence, please?
joerojas87 wrote:
God created a world in which he already knew would lead to pain and suffering.
Evidence, please?
joerojas87 wrote:
Also, this would mean god knew that most of us would die sinners and inevitably burn in the hell in which he himself created.
Evidence, please?
joerojas87 wrote:
Basically, god created a world for us with the certainty of suffering, and a hell in which most of us would burn in for all eternity.
Evidence, please?
joerojas87 wrote:
Are some of us destined by god to suffer either on earth or in hell.
This one parses like an interrogative, but lacks a terminating question mark. Is it a question or a claim?
joerojas87 wrote:
How could such a benevolent god be so evil?
How could a mortal, finite being ever question, or even comprehend, an immortal, infinite being?

Your entire argument fails due to a false initial premise, baseless assumptions, missing evidence, and a lack of a correlative summation that draws it all together.

Grade: D-


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Last edited by Fnord on 24 May 2011, 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Moog
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24 May 2011, 9:05 am

Is there an 'Evidence, please?' T-shirt available? If not, there should be.


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Ya_Mad_Bra
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24 May 2011, 9:21 am

It would take your god and all you religious people to die first and perpanently, before there will be a possible chance o me converting, which I doubt.



pandabear
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24 May 2011, 9:40 am

Moog wrote:
Is there an 'Evidence, please?' T-shirt available? If not, there should be.


You could wear this one.

Image



01001011
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24 May 2011, 9:47 am

leejosepho wrote:
01001011 wrote:
Define what is 'God' first?

Quote:
"Much to our relief, we discovered we did not need to consider another's conception of God. Our own conception, however inadequate (or limited), was sufficient ...
"When, therefore, we speak to you of God, we mean your own conception of God."
("A.A.", the book, pages 46-47)


Nope. I don't believe the word god has any sensible meaning.

Forget about evidence.



leejosepho
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24 May 2011, 10:21 am

01001011 wrote:
leejosepho wrote:
01001011 wrote:
Define what is 'God' first?

Quote:
"Much to our relief, we discovered we did not need to consider another's conception of God. Our own conception, however inadequate (or limited), was sufficient ...
"When, therefore, we speak to you of God, we mean your own conception of God."
("A.A.", the book, pages 46-47)


Nope. I don't believe the word god has any sensible meaning.

Forget about evidence.

No evidence had been suggested or offered. Rather, it is simply impossible to actually, accurately and/or comprehensively "Define what is 'God'" before having a discussion either about or related to same.


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Philologos
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24 May 2011, 11:23 am

Moog wrote:
Is there an 'Evidence, please?' T-shirt available? If not, there should be.


I do not have sufficient data to answer that question.

Answering question with question:

Would you accept a t-shirt in a language other than English?

Semirelated assertion:

When I needed a t-shirt bearing a certain proverb on front and back - had to be there - I had it made. Cheap enough.



Awesomelyglorious
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24 May 2011, 11:27 am

01001011 wrote:
Nope. I don't believe the word god has any sensible meaning.

Forget about evidence.

I think that approach is outright ridiculous. I mean, this is not to be too harsh, but if we took you sensibly do you believe that ANY term has sensible meanings? I mean, there is no rigorous definition for what a dog is, should regard dogs as non-existent? This isn't to say it is reasonable to regard God as existent and non-contradictory, just.... I am skeptical towards your language-based skepticism.



AceOfSpades
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24 May 2011, 12:08 pm

1) Proof of God
2) Proof of my sanity upon seeing proof of God



Moog
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24 May 2011, 12:15 pm

AceOfSpades wrote:
1) Proof of God
2) Proof of my sanity upon seeing proof of God


Proof of God's sanity not required


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AceOfSpades
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24 May 2011, 12:57 pm

Moog wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
1) Proof of God
2) Proof of my sanity upon seeing proof of God


Proof of God's sanity not required
Well he must have multiple personality disorder if he thinks he's a 3 in 1 package. That's just my armchair diagnosis though, so I'd have to refer him to a psychiatrist for real proof which leads me to #3:

3) Referral to a psychiatrist with the result of a negative diagnosis.