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donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 3:08 pm

phil777 wrote:
According to "La Presse"(daily french journal here in Quebec) of Friday 29th, there was an article about him that said that he was pretty insane. Considered himself a "Crusader Templar" on a mission to fight the islamisation of Europe, the low fertility rates, and mostly the "nordic" race's. o.O

Apparently, in his manifesto (which doubled as a diary), he even proposed a slew of measures that would have taken away most women's rights.

If i recall correctly (iirc), he even called most of his female friends "prostitutes" as some point.

He also made two fake companies in order to get credit to buy his explosives. Rent a farm to fabricate them, played video games, including one that apparently trained him in shooting combat. The owner told him at some point that she'd come visit, upon which he even contemplated the option to kill her if she found out about his stuff. Thankfully for her (somewhat), the visit came the next day, or the one after, which gave him time to hide his stuff.


It sounds to me like he suffers delusions of grandeur. He probably saw himself as destined for great things but had a pathological idea of what 'great things' are. Someone who has delusions of grandeur, it's very possible for them to act in calculating, rational-seeming ways while at the same time being completely nuts.

It sucks that not only him, but all those people, ended up being victims of his mental illness.



Kraichgauer
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30 Jul 2011, 3:09 pm

phil777 wrote:
According to "La Presse"(daily french journal here in Quebec) of Friday 29th, there was an article about him that said that he was pretty insane. Considered himself a "Crusader Templar" on a mission to fight the islamisation of Europe, the low fertility rates, and mostly the "nordic" race's. o.O

Apparently, in his manifesto (which doubled as a diary), he even proposed a slew of measures that would have taken away most women's rights.

If i recall correctly (iirc), he even called most of his female friends "prostitutes" as some point.

He also made two fake companies in order to get credit to buy his explosives. Rent a farm to fabricate them, played video games, including one that apparently trained him in shooting combat. The owner told him at some point that she'd come visit, upon which he even contemplated the option to kill her if she found out about his stuff. Thankfully for her (somewhat), the visit came the next day, or the one after, which gave him time to hide his stuff.


Misogynist, too; lovely. I would think he knows that traditional Islam is just as anti-woman as him.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Sweetleaf
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30 Jul 2011, 3:10 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Yes that is true, but in neither case you cannot claim this guy in Norway or Hitler are not at all to blame...they could have chosen better paths but did not. So yes they are guilty of the crimes they commited.

And from the sound of it this guy killed a bunch of kids to prove muslims were a plauge of some sort on Norway, how does killing a bunch of people make them look bad? it actually makes anyone who thinks the way he does look bad.


Oh I don't mean you can't blame them at all, I'm just saying we shouldn't hate them because they were just doing what millions of people created the energy for to happen. Instead of spending our energy hating them, we should be more compassionate and look into our own beliefs. Putting Hitler or Breivik to death wouldn't solve anything, imo all it would do is absolve ourselves of the little hatreds we hold in our heart, except it wouldn't really do that, it would just make us feel better.

And I agree all acts of violence and terrorism are counter-productive and really only help the opposing side in the end.

I just don't see evil as a thing that originates from human beings, I see it as a sickness that spreads from one person to others. In this case the evil originated in the discord between European and Middle eastern peoples, spread to Breivik and then spread to those poor people he shot. I think rather than saying "I hate Breivik and want him to die, but feel sorry for the victims" we should feel sorry for everyone affected by evil.


I do not hate either, however I still would not be sad if someone was to shoot that norwegian terrorist...he kind of has it coming since the maximum penalty in Norway is 20 years in prison. I just don't think it is fair to say he was 'insane' and not responsible for his actions.......I have quite a few mental problems and i know the difference between things I can control and things I cannot control. I am not going to plan out something I cannot control and then carry it out, that is not how it works....but if something startles me and sets my PTSD off for instance and I happened to react violently that would be different.



donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 3:11 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

Misogynist, too; lovely. I would think he knows that traditional Islam is just as anti-woman as him.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Probably was rejected by women who found him (correctly) creepy, could explain why he killed so many teenage girls.



Sweetleaf
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30 Jul 2011, 3:11 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
phil777 wrote:
According to "La Presse"(daily french journal here in Quebec) of Friday 29th, there was an article about him that said that he was pretty insane. Considered himself a "Crusader Templar" on a mission to fight the islamisation of Europe, the low fertility rates, and mostly the "nordic" race's. o.O

Apparently, in his manifesto (which doubled as a diary), he even proposed a slew of measures that would have taken away most women's rights.

If i recall correctly (iirc), he even called most of his female friends "prostitutes" as some point.

He also made two fake companies in order to get credit to buy his explosives. Rent a farm to fabricate them, played video games, including one that apparently trained him in shooting combat. The owner told him at some point that she'd come visit, upon which he even contemplated the option to kill her if she found out about his stuff. Thankfully for her (somewhat), the visit came the next day, or the one after, which gave him time to hide his stuff.


It sounds to me like he suffers delusions of grandeur. He probably saw himself as destined for great things but had a pathological idea of what 'great things' are. Someone who has delusions of grandeur, it's very possible for them to act in calculating, rational-seeming ways while at the same time being completely nuts.

It sucks that not only him, but all those people, ended up being victims of his mental illness.


Well I do not see terrorism or extremism as mental illness, those are thigns people choose.



donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 3:14 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:

Well I do not see terrorism or extremism as mental illness, those are thigns people choose.


So basically you would say they're normal, but just plain evil and need to die and be hated by law abiding people?



Kraichgauer
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30 Jul 2011, 3:17 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Misogynist, too; lovely. I would think he knows that traditional Islam is just as anti-woman as him.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Probably was rejected by women who found him (correctly) creepy, could explain why he killed so many teenage girls.


Maybe. Or maybe it's just a part of the psychological makeup of a social misfit like him.
I recall how reading how Tom Blanck, an old west outlaw in the 1890's Pacific Northwest, was described as strongly disliking women. In a jailhouse interview, he told a Seattle newsman that the only love of his life was with a gun.
I think hating women just comes naturally to men with anti-social personality disorders.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 3:18 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
donnie_darko wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Misogynist, too; lovely. I would think he knows that traditional Islam is just as anti-woman as him.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Probably was rejected by women who found him (correctly) creepy, could explain why he killed so many teenage girls.


Maybe. Or maybe it's just a part of the psychological makeup of a social misfit like him.
I recall how reading how Tom Blanck, an old west outlaw in the 1890's Pacific Northwest, was described as strongly disliking women. In a jailhouse interview, he told a Seattle newsman that the only love of his life was with a gun.
I think hating women just comes naturally to men with anti-social personality disorders.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


True ... I mean I am rejected constantly but I still love women.



Kraichgauer
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30 Jul 2011, 3:22 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
donnie_darko wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Misogynist, too; lovely. I would think he knows that traditional Islam is just as anti-woman as him.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Probably was rejected by women who found him (correctly) creepy, could explain why he killed so many teenage girls.


Maybe. Or maybe it's just a part of the psychological makeup of a social misfit like him.
I recall how reading how Tom Blanck, an old west outlaw in the 1890's Pacific Northwest, was described as strongly disliking women. In a jailhouse interview, he told a Seattle newsman that the only love of his life was with a gun.
I think hating women just comes naturally to men with anti-social personality disorders.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


True ... I mean I am rejected constantly but I still love women.


You're preaching to the choir, here. Before I met my wife, dates, let alone intimacies with the opposite sex were few and far between. Still, I never wanted to hurt women.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



phil777
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30 Jul 2011, 3:24 pm

Amusingly, the article also said that he bragged about being chaste during the whole time his "mission" lasted (obviously because it would distract him / undermine his projects), but bought the services of two "high-quality" escorts in another country before doing the deed. Saying that a few minutes of depravity would seem minimal compared to the grandeur of his martyr.

He also seemed to watch Dexter and find it amusing that someone could be a law-abiding citizen by day and a serial killer by night. I reckon reading he kind of envied that.



donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 3:26 pm

phil777 wrote:
Amusingly, the article also said that he bragged about being chaste during the whole time his "mission" lasted (obviously because it would distract him / undermine his projects), but bought the services of two "high-quality" escorts in another country before doing the deed. Saying that a few minutes of depravity would seem minimal compared to the grandeur of his martyr.

He also seemed to watch Dexter and find it amusing that someone could be a law-abiding citizen by day and a serial killer by night. I reckon reading he kind of envied that.


TBH Dexter to me is just as evil as any other serial killer. So what if the people he's killing are baddies ... he still gets off on it and doesn't really have feelings for other people. While I do enjoy the show, I think the message of the show is pretty effed up and probably has inspired a lot of people to do bad things.



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30 Jul 2011, 3:46 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
phil777 wrote:
Amusingly, the article also said that he bragged about being chaste during the whole time his "mission" lasted (obviously because it would distract him / undermine his projects), but bought the services of two "high-quality" escorts in another country before doing the deed. Saying that a few minutes of depravity would seem minimal compared to the grandeur of his martyr.

He also seemed to watch Dexter and find it amusing that someone could be a law-abiding citizen by day and a serial killer by night. I reckon reading he kind of envied that.


TBH Dexter to me is just as evil as any other serial killer. So what if the people he's killing are baddies ... he still gets off on it and doesn't really have feelings for other people. While I do enjoy the show, I think the message of the show is pretty effed up and probably has inspired a lot of people to do bad things.


Years before Dexter ever hit the airwaves, I had attended a poetry reading where one local poet read a work with the recurring line, "I'm a serial killer of serial killers." The show has always brought that poem back to mind through the years.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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30 Jul 2011, 4:18 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:

Well I do not see terrorism or extremism as mental illness, those are thigns people choose.


So basically you would say they're normal, but just plain evil and need to die and be hated by law abiding people?


Where did I say anything about hate...I just think it is possible for anyone to become an extremist or terrorist, they don't have to have a mental condition. If anything claiming none of these people should be held responsible for what they did only adds more stigma to people who really do suffer from mental problems and have to put a lot of effort into not doing something totally f*cked up.

Also I suppose it is a little bit hard for me to pity someone who shoots a bunch of kids......especially when I have PTSD because some guy decided it would be cool to come in my school and shoot a girl, as far as anyone can tell that dude did not really have a specific mental disorder just made a horrible choice.



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30 Jul 2011, 4:19 pm

donnie_darko wrote:

How can someone NOT be insane if they shoot dozens of kids? Do you really believe some people are just 'plain evil'? What does that even mean anyways?



donnie_darko wrote:

TBH Dexter to me is just as evil as any other serial killer.


:roll:


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donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 4:22 pm

anna-banana wrote:
donnie_darko wrote:

How can someone NOT be insane if they shoot dozens of kids? Do you really believe some people are just 'plain evil'? What does that even mean anyways?



donnie_darko wrote:

TBH Dexter to me is just as evil as any other serial killer.


:roll:


i didn't say Dexter was evil, I said he is as much 'evil' as any other killer is.



donnie_darko
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30 Jul 2011, 4:23 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Also I suppose it is a little bit hard for me to pity someone who shoots a bunch of kids......especially when I have PTSD because some guy decided it would be cool to come in my school and shoot a girl, as far as anyone can tell that dude did not really have a specific mental disorder just made a horrible choice.


But maybe he did ... wouldn't it make you feel better to know that he was in a way not truly responsible, than to just believe he was demonic? Sorry to hear about that BTW.