Why do we need them?

Post Reply New Topic

I am not sure about that, it seems to be a pretty good picture of how consumer culture works....and yeah it bothers me a bit, I just don't see why people strive for all that crap.....Why can't I just be a normal person who does not care or get disturbed by the way things are going.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_living

Learn to live simply and encourage others to do it too.

I have nothing against putting technology to use and such, so that is not quite what I was thinking. I have an issue with the way things are ran, not quite the same thing as just wanting more simplicity.

^^^ You don't have to be a luddite to live simply.

By reducing your consumption to the bare minimum and buying things second hand, you can greatly reduce your need to work/participate in the corrupt consumer-driven economy...

You aren't going to change the system, but you can opt-out and live a better, happier life.

And what will that accomplish? Besides my chronic depression and PTSD is not going away so I won't have a happy life anyways.

Freegan lifestyle topic

http://vimeo.com/4423506[youtube]http://vimeo.com/4423506[/youtube]

This is a good video, and explains a simpler lifestyle. I might try this way at some point.

I think the answer is simply to encourage people to be less materialistic, and less gullible. We live in this illusion we have freedom, but I can't even leave the United States without obtaining permission from the government (passport).

Thank you all for the imput, but aren't any of you getting that I am not talking about just opting out...anyone can do that, but all the problems don't just go away because you opt out you just don't think about them anymore. most people have already opted out by giving in to this terrible society and government/economic system while distracting themselves with consumer culture. If someone has a t.v to distract them why are they going to bother going outside and seeing how things really are?

I do not have any idea what I could even do about any of it, for now I have just completely accepted that I completely disagree with the way things are. and as someone earlier pointed out there is not much I can do or say without possibly being penalized for promoting revolution..apprantly

Well I do encourage that but it seems like that is not enough.

People are stubborn!

Its not even that they are stubberon just distracted by all the crap.

True. Most people don't like the system, they just see replacing or even improving it as impossible or too risky.

That's a really tall order though. You're trying to think of a fair distribution to people who - in essence - earn nothing by not working. To not work and be supported, for it to be fair to the earners (on the human motivational structure available) those who don't work would need to have less - a bit like everyone's given something but the earners get something plus.

As we're seeing right now as well, you can only give so much before a company or government runs itself into bankruptcy. Fiat money was an attempt to decouple that - doesn't work. You can't generate wealth out of thin air, it can be generated from the production of goods or commonly used intellectual property but not from just pushing numbers around with a wand like we've been doing for a long time.

I think to really fix that problem - we'd need to obliterate the need for status. To do that we'd need to stop human procreation and replace it by government creating people. Competition would need to be obliterated as well - multiplayer games even would need to be illegal to get the point across. No one's better than the next, all have the same identities, all are the same. Outliers would, in that society be punished or secluded in something like a jail, especially if they can't help outlying.

That's the trouble with this kind of speculation though. We can trade one nightmare for a nightmare of greater or lesser preference. That's it though. We don't have options. Being human - for all breathing - means we're f***ed. I know you probably won't like that answer, heck you might even accuse me of being a foot soldier - fine, if it feels good do it though I'd warn you it won't change a thing. I think the danger that people who aren't in that boat face is that they're attempting to both shoulder their responsibilities and on top of that shoulder the damage that people who believe that these responsibilities are evil (ie. the people who would openly oppose work, law, systems, etc. and act on it) and if that number of dissidents against people trying to hold the system up gets too unbalanced - we're looking at a post-apocalyptic kind of world or something a bit like what Somalia's had with warlords or, worse yet, a real dictator or despot. Power vacuums don't last long before they fill and usually when there is a power vacuum its the most brutal who win.

My advice to you - you just need to get used to being human and get used to what it means to be human and to be a part of a society. If you would choose to say get a sustenance farm, grow all your own food, make all your own clothing, and keep your connections with government and other people limited to paying property taxes - you can do that, just that this is about as much as you can get away without squatting in a national park or someone else similar where you can be arrested.

Sucks doesn't it?

I think the anger of people who oppose welfare is tragically displaced. We have more than enough food and stuff for everyone, it's not the people on public aid who are causing the economic problems, it's greed at the top. If there is surplus, then why must everybody work?

Most people like to work because having a job gives you a sense of pride (even though I hate working, I like having a job because there's something awesome about making your own money), if some people would rather just be slackers, and there's enough to go around, why not just let them? Most slackers are pretty easy-going and harmless people.

The trouble with not working is that its impossible for those who don't work not to enjoy a significantly lower status and fewer options for it. If people are ready to make that trade off that's one thing, if they aren't then its another.

Well that's okay. I think if you don't wanna work, you shouldn't except to be rich - but nobody on welfare really lives that well. I mean people have gotta get real about that.

I think the aversion to welfare has to do with the days when we were hunter-gatherers. Back then people didn't have to work that hard actually, but aside from elders and young kids, everyone was expected to do their part. If you didn't do your part, you were risking the tribe go hungry, so obviously that would cause anger and frustration.

Nowadays though, we're not struggling to survive, things are so abundant, that we need to put that outdated instinct behind us.