Who will you vote for in the 42nd Canadian Federal Election?

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I wasn't necessarily referring to racism. Though the BQ/PQ has been known to make racially charged comments, such as what Master_Pedant brought up, or Parizeau's blaming "the ethnic vote" for the loss of the 95 referendum. One thing you should consider is that the BQ is nationalist and also has socialist leanings. This makes me nervous as "National Socialism" is... well you do the math. I was more referring to the bigotry that is inherent in the "language protection bills". Bigotry does not have to be about skin color



The Bloc certainly is a dead end



I cannot condone a film that puts cold blooded killers in a positive light. Yeah, they're human, they love their families, but they are killers and they are terrorists. And as for accuracy, Laporte was murdered, the film did not show this. It showed him committing suicide. I may be mistaken about the film though, it could be another one I am thinking of. All I know is that I had students who I was tutoring who showed me their notes from history class and their teachers were telling them the FLQ did not kill Laporte and that he "committed suicide"



Where do these statistics come from? The OLF? I don't trust them, at all. Of course they're going to say the language is threatened. If the false crisis disappears, so to will their funding, as well as a convenient "cash cow" for Quebecois votes. I know many, many young French Montrealers who are very much part of the French culture. The old fogies responsible for much of the bigotry hate hearing young Quebecois use their slang that includes English words ("c'est smooth, la... puis apres I bought pack of smokes" etc). The funny part is a lot of them are unaware the words are of English origin. I watch French television and you cannot honestly blame English media for introducing new words. French media has plenty of the Quebecois dialect. If they were so concerned with the language they would be trying to maintain the Parisian standard. They aren't. They're just blowing smoke in everyone's ass. Why is it wrong for people to want to be educated in English if they want to? Do you really feel that the government should tell you where you can or can't send your children to school? Where do you draw the line? Are they going to fine you for watching and reading English media/books next? It is invasive and insulting to French and English alike. I also question whether these "statistics" take into account the large amounts of immigrants the QC government lets in who are not native French speakers. But in any case the language is not in decline



I know the historical context. If you are suggesting that I want all signs in English, that is a blatant straw man argument. I am suggesting no such thing. There should be no laws controlling what language is put on signs. It is insulting and offensive that English has to be smaller and beneath French or even not presented at all. If 101 were repealed the signs would not suddenly change to all English. It would probably affect the rest of Quebec outside Montreal very little. The difference is that small businesses owned by English people would be free to put an English sign up without fear of being penalized for it



If he actually thought that, which I doubt, he sure did a good job driving most of the Anglos out of the province after 1980. It might have been good for the French language, that government, but it was not good for business. In case you were unaware, many large businesses left or pulled investments out of Quebec because of his government



I've studied the movement in depth for well over a decade. I read Vigile.net often enough to know that the separatist movement as it stands is false. Every people deserves the right to self-determination, but the BQ is really not interested in separatism. They are cynical bigots who utilize the political past to maintain a grip on the collective consciousness of Quebec. If separatism is really necessary, the BQ will not be the ones to get it done. Its too profitable for them having the province and its people in a state of limbo as it is now



Tollorin is from Quebec city so I am unsurprised by his views on separatism. You are correct though, French is not threatened here. That whole argument falls flat and is just a political ploy. Just like the abortion debate in the US. Nobody is ever going to actually ban abortion, simply because it is a huge issue that maintains attention and thus votes and funding. The same thing goes for separatism and the "danger" to the French language



Its ironic that you support a "fortress mentality" when it comes to this language issue yet at the same time you will argue for large scale immigration which many people feel threatens our culture. In truth, both situations are overblown and inaccurate. Canadian culture is not threatened by immigrants any more than the French language and culture are threatened by the few hundred thousand Anglos out of 8,000,000 or so people in this province. Fortress mentality is what drives people to do horrible things in the name of protecting their culture. It is the mentality of ignorance

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yFElFVVFpk[/youtube]

Gee! You Canadian dudes have so many choices. I am filled with choice-envy.

ruveyn

Don't be fooled, a first-past the post system means there really are only two choices

He's right. =/ The choices posted there haven't been listed in "hierarchical" order, since quite a lot of those parties are minoritary and you hardly ever hear of them in the news. =/

edit : ok, maybe they are somewhat in order, since see the "top 4" listed at the start, meh.

What do I know? I am just a dump-a** yank.

ruveyn

Yet some Canadians know more about the American political system than you guys know about us in return. =/

edit: to be fair though, Americans are in campaign mode so often compared to us. <.<

Yes. A bad habit we have here in the U.S. Being in a "super-power" encourages one to ignore what is going on elsewhere. Shame on us. Shame on U.S.

ruveyn

I'd not say shame, just pity. It's a matter of being civil and learn about your neighbor to get along with him/her. =/

Well in reality the US is a nation that has a great amount of intelligent people. But most people in the world don't give a lick about geography or the politics next door. The big difference is Americans are much more visible and thus get more of this kind of negative attention. How many Canadians do you figure can name all 50 states + all the dependencies or whatever you'd call them? Other than myself I actually know no Canadians who can... I don't think its a big deal personally

One thing about the US that has occurred to me are the parallels in attitude between your country and the civilization of China for much of history. Considering themselves the center of the world they looked down on elsewhere and made little effort to understand the outside world. They grew to a certain point of extreme advancement and then stayed there as in truth there is no "center" of the world; much like our magnetic poles the great places of innovation move across the globe to where the opportunities are seized and acted upon. The US has this attitude and will be left behind for a time, at the mercy of other powers, if not militarily, then economically. China-US economic relations are a good example of this. Maybe not a certainty but there need to be serious changes in the politics of your country and mine as well

Chiming in to say that my dad has pretty good geographic knowledge of the States (I'm still struggling towards the Midwest). Can even tell the capitals (which I'm not quite there yet). ^.- He's quite suprising.

Been his dream to ride across the USA on his motorcycle. :p (Doesn't drive a Harley though)

Nice, I'm proud of your dad. I think proportionally Canadians probably have greater knowledge of America than the reverse, but tbh I haven't seen any real statistics to back that up other than my experiences and the experiences of many others I have spoken to or read posts from. Would be an interesting project to undertake though to find out

We have made a virtue of necessity.

Only the most callow nationalist fails to recognize that we could not exist as we do without the patronage and protection of the United States. So it behoves us to be all the more familiar with the politics, geography, culture and daily affairs of our neighbors. We may pride ourselves on being your most important trading partner, your largest energy supplier, a rescuer of hostages and a safe harbour for aircraft. But we cannot forget that your role in our national prosperity is vastly larger than our role in yours.

So we tend to be oversensitive. Maybe our friendship "goes without saying" (a phrase that still rankles in some quarters, btw) but it's still nice to be mentioned.

Notwithstanding all of this, some of us can take our status as metaphorical headgear with a certain sang-froid.

http://satwcomic.com/awesome-hats
http://satwcomic.com/matter-of-perspective

But the choices vary from riding to riding (for ruveyn - "riding" is a slang word for "electoral district").

Sometimes it's a race between Conservatives and New Democrats, in other ridings it's a race between Liberals and Conservatives, and in at least one it's a race between a Green and Conservative.