christian and have aspergers

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I don't blame you. There's no mention of the rapture anywhere in the bible, anyway.



It doesn't work that way, Keniichi. Wishing and praying seldom leads to anything except disappointment. You need to do the legwork here; get out there, meet people, and be ready for the moment when the right person turns up. And be open minded - they may not be Christian or aspie (in some cases, maybe not even female, but I suspect you'd know if that were the case).

I'm a Lutheran, and my faith's theology adamantly refutes any notion of a rapture or any of that other end time theology so popular in evangelical circles.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Yes I do get out but still its a nice prayer dream of mine.

I am a Christian with Aspergers too. We recently had an article about it in one of our magazines, and an interview with an Aspie at one of our conventions.

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102008329

There's also an autobiography written by one of our members with Aspergers. It talks a lot about the difficulties of the two together, and how one of the ways he coped was by spending time with older people who understood better.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Feelings-Un ... 187&sr=8-1

I didn't realize that Lutherans don't believe the Bible.

We do, hence we don't buy into that end times theology. Rather, we believe the thousand year earthly rule of Christ is an indeterminate period of time (not a literal thousand years) between Christ's ascension and his return - or in other words, the here and now. His kingdom is the invisible church - that is, all true believers, regardless of denomination - as well as the inner kingdom in each believers heart.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

In other words, you don't believe the Bible. No problem...

I do agree with you on the invisible church thing, though. I don't know if you've seen the movie "Stigmata," but there is a quote that sums this up neatly in a kind of esoteric way, though I dislike some of the gnostic overtones of it (sourced from the Gospel of Thomas). The idea is that the kingdom of heaven is everywhere and not confined to churches.

When I read the gospels' description of the kingdom of heaven, Jesus seems to use the term in different senses. At the moment, my favorite is a reference to Elijah when Jesus tells a man to go home and settle his affairs because "he who puts his hand to the plow and turns back isn't fit for the kingdom." Jesus doesn't seem to be saying that such people who aren't "fit" are going to hell necessarily, but rather that they aren't ready for the WORK of the kingdom. How can you join and be an active participant in God's kingdom if you have to wait for heaven to get there, i.e. when you're dead? God's kingdom is already here.

Yes, we do believe the Bible, just not the popular, evangelical interpretation of it. And we do believe that there will be a return by Christ to usher in a new heaven and earth - it's just not the thousand years, or the so called tribulation leading up to it.
And nope, never saw Stigmata.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

i'm guessing the people that don't have a problem with the thousand years being an indefinite amount of time have not been watching mankind destroy the earth to the point that we may not even last another generation.
and then we have the NWO's goals of depopulating the earth down to 500 million, and they have enough infrastructure built to pull it off today.
the human-animal hybrids we're making now are sufficient alone to say we're in the days of Noah, you don't even have to look at a star chart.

i think one of the mistakes we make is assuming everything in Revelation is literal, and has to happen consecutively.
the number of big fish in the ocean is down to 10% of what it was 50 years ago.
half the clouds in the sky in some places are due to chem trails.
if you've had a vaccine in the last 10 years then you probably have contaminated R dna in you.

If a major city is sacrificed soon to seal the false peace treaty Obama may have signed with Israel on july 9 2009, 1260 days prior to dec 20, 2012, then yeah i'd say we're half way through that peace treaty. i suppose its possible that the 7 year tribulation would be offset by an unknown number of years.

Not just the mayans folks, there's a long list of other peoples that have 2012 prophecies .
like for instance, the seal on the back of the dollar.
or the great pyramid of giza.
Issac Newton. Jewish mystics. the Catholics used to teach it up till the 1800's or something.
when they found 4 bodies under Ben Franklin's house, they stopped digging... this is how humans respond to information they can't handle.
your sacred founding fathers were not men of God they were mostly free masons, and you might ask yourself, who's God is that on the back of the dollar?
how can it be an accident that 1776 is the start of the 13th bactun of the mayan calender? and its 4000 years off from the Jewish calender in 2016?
(i have read of a debate regarding how if the world really ends in 2016 then mans days are 6000 years and the Jewish calender is off by the difference)

my philosophy is that 50/2000 enter the Kingdom, this was the number given to a few who have had near death experiences and given second chances. the rest are saved from hell if "they know not what they do"
you can go onto youtube and find a number of people who have had visions of only 1 or 2 people raptured out of their church.
but was it a rapture, or was it showing them who is truely saved?

Many people who call themselves Christians cannot even agree on who's hands the earth is in.
some say it is in the hands of the evil one. others say Jesus conquered all, and the church is what delays God's judgement.

many are going to find out they are wrong.

now consider that if you study history, only 1% or less ever have an idea of what the governments plan to do.
if there was a global bank holiday tomorrow, and everyone's bank accounts were frozen, I would be willing to bet a fair chunk of change that less than 1/100 would not be surprised.

this time however, a global bank holiday will have "Biblical" effects on humanity, and unless we see something supernatural happen, the dollar will be killed by 2014 through hyperinflation, or it will be killed at the end of the year, as i would speculate, when it was intended to be killed.

most of the NWO's plans were showed to you in the opening and closing ceremonies of the Olympics.

Lutherans believe in the Bible, just not in a literal interpretation of it. They believe that many of the stories are parables or "dumbed down" versions of a truth too complicated to be otherwise understood. Add to this the fact that the Bible has been through several translations, and a belief that it was not divinely inspired, and you can see why Lutherans have no trouble taking much of the Bible with a grain of salt. This makes Lutherans more accepting of ideas like evolution - they never took Genesis literally, anyway.

Agreed. And, for the record, I don't believe EVERYTHING in Revelation is literal. It's not even the only eschatological writing in the Bible, and the images that play out are even clearly stated to be symbolic of something else MOST OF THE TIME. The trouble is when the imagery is NOT qualified as representative of something else. Dragons, beasts with 7 heads, the whore of Babylon, the lady clothed with the sun who gives birth...those are things already theologically clear in the mind of early Christians and SHOULD be clear to us today. The millennial kingdom is tricky because the adversary (Satan) is stated to be under lock and key during this time and would therefore pose no influence over those living during this time. This can't be a prophecy that has already been fulfilled or is in process because there has yet to be a time when the influence of evil over humanity and creation isn't seen. There certainly hasn't been any primary bodily resurrection involving dead saints, and even believers continue to experience physical death.

yep, and if you're not sober now, you're going to be when you read this:
http://www.stevequayle.com/index.php?s=33&d=115

That's not very factual. Every reliable translation out there uses pretty much the same source documents--the Masoretic Text (though some translators disagree on some portions of the text as to whether the MT is more reliable or whether the Septuagint is to be favored...sometimes having an alternate but more recent ancient source helps clarify meaning to archaic or idiomatic expressions. Some scholars might even debate on which source is older, the MT or the LXX. But the point is modern translations typically go back to these and other ancient manuscripts. These sources are within 95% agreement with each other, which that questionable 5% being things like scribal errors--and I mean errors like confusing similar letters for each other and the ancient equivalent of misplacing a decimal as well as questioning whether some texts originated as margin notes, etc. It's a TINY portion of the entire text, and it never changes the meaning of the body of work). There are some translations I find questionable: The latest NIV, the Good News Bible, the Message, and (of course) the NWT. The NKJV is basically a King Jimmy with updated language conventions, making it an easier read, and also includes source material that was unavailable at the time the Authorized Version was written. As I've often said, I like the HSCB, and I've heard really good things about the ESV. I don't think the "several translations" bit is even really all that true, nor does the fact that numerous translations exist really make all that much difference as to whether the Bible is true or not. It just makes a difference when we're talking about a specific translation, especially if the translators have an agenda (which they do in at least one case).


If it's not divinely inspired, what's the value in accepting it as a guiding text? If you can't believe it, why use it? If the Bible is in error, then you have the problem of Jesus not being who He claimed to be and who His disciples claimed He was and who we claim Him to be. Christianity could just as easily be wrong, so what point is there in even adopting Christianity as your personal faith? If the Bible IS divinely inspired, then you have a strong case in favor of Christ.

I used to ba a "born-again" christian for years, but I left the faith after they were casting a demon out of me. They said my stimming(and other forms of my "difference") was demonic and they were cast the demon out of me so I could be "free" and stop it.

My own Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod does take the Bible more literally than say the more theologically liberal Evangelical Lutheran Church in America does, but no mainstream Lutherans in either church body takes Revelations for a major book meant to be taken word for word. We are of the opinion that most of the book has already occurred in the 1st century AD. If evangelicals feel that means we aren't real Christians, then that's they're business. They already seem to think we're going to hell for practicing infant baptism, and for believing in the real presence in the Lords Supper.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

That's where religion gets you, ignorant and superstitious. If they weren't superstitious and ignorant they would have known you were autistic and not possessed.