Exploring satanism

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Yes, because force has proven to work so well in society.

Whether or not 'Islam' is a warring religion or not, doesnt matter to me (I see it as 'rough' as well, but I see 'religion' as much the general problem (more then nationality is)), but do you think killing their leaders is going to change their minds and open their hearts to democracy (democracy meaning Bushes dictatorship democracy)?

I dont think you have to 'force' anyone to do anything. A person will only except a new idea when he/she understands it. They do not understand anything past religion because they dont GET anything but that but to kill them all, well, thats exactly what we fear them doing to us. In reality, saying 'kill all their leaders' is the exact same as them say it towards us, right or wrong

And Christianity isn't "rough"? There are christian extremists too, look at the abortion clinic bombing (eric rudolph). Hell they've only taken over the republican party and passed I don't know how many legislative documents around THEIR secular religion.
Point is, the religion itself isn't so bad, it's the extremists. And you have those here too. You shouldn't judge a whole people based on the extremist ones. That in itself is a racist attitude.

Instead of fighting between religions, why don't sensible people come together to stop religious extremism, in any form, be it christian, muslim, or atheist (seeing as these are now the big 3 extremists hosts of beliefs)?

In fact the only thing I have issues with, isn't against 1 particular religion, it's against all of them, religion point blank is the enemy of freedom. Because it shackles peoples' minds and it creates war. Or hell, for that matter, conventionalism is the enemy of peace. This is why I'm so strongly anti-conventionalist, unless one is being forced to a label through oppressive or suppressive, discriminative means (because then it would be dumb not to acknowledge the root of their problem).

I honestly think if people got comfortable not following a label we'd live in a more free thinking, happy society. I mean it would be a start.

What I wrote: "I see it as 'rough' as well, but I see 'religion' as much the general problem"

This is why I specifically added "religion" in a general sense because, yes, Christianity is "rough," as well. Its not just "Islam" thats the problem, its pretty much all the 'in your face' religions. Its funny, Jehovahs and Christians and whatever, they sell to you. Take, now, Buddhism - People SEEK it, they aren't pressured into it. Buddhism is the 'fluke' religion and I HATE calling it a religion because I HATE it being associated with crap.

I agree on the 'labels' aspect of life. I'm glad you said you had issues with all 'religions' but didnt say "belief." I think people can believe a cow is 'God,' doesnt matter to me, but when those who believe start forcing others in ANY way, then I want nothing to do with them.

Yeah, that also goes for other types of labels such as liberal or conservative, or socialist, or feminist, etc.

I'll have to say McJeff's stand does come off to me as very "Us vs. Them", this kind of mentality is what leads to wars. I do agree the ones who helped set up 9/11 should be punished, but that also includes president Bush. It's no secret Bush and BinLaden families have long had close ties in the oil industry, and everything seems to point dead at Bush having a hand in setting it up, along with BinLaden. Did you know BinLaden and Al Qeida were on the CIA payroll ? And Bush adm blocked every single attempt of an independant agency investigating 9/11, which tells you he had something to hide.
I do think he tried to become a dictator, all the pieces were right there on the table. 9/11 did several things for the attempt to establish a police state:
1- restored blind faith in a system gone bad
2- restored blind faith into a corrupt president
3- invoked fear into the masses, which was used to declare war on, and to establish a common scapegoat (is this sounding familiar?)
4- Pushing religious extremism to counter democracy with theocracy (hell just watch the 700 club)-- supporting issues include the 10 commandments on the court ground, the controversy over "under god" in the pledge of allegiance at school (which has now been resolved), picketing to shut down any business or religious institution that didn't fit strictly christian requirements, civilian tax funds being sent to the church for faith-based initiative. Currently the religious right in America is loosing some grounds, but theyr not giving up, and Jeb Bush is running for the 2012 elections.
5. Provided an excuse to highten security, which in turn was used as a half-arsed attempt to justify the Patriot Act, the single most unpatriotic thing that has ever been passed through our legislative system. This gave the government the ability to spy on civilians.

Ok you must have posted this one while i was typing my last message... But though, islam is no more extreme than christianity, it's the ones who take it too far that give it a bad name. One religion is just as good or bad as the next. Islam in it's true form doesn't preach intolerance or hatred or extremism, and neither does christianity in it's truest form.
All religions have a few good ideas, still I think society would be better off if they didn't need religion or a label as a crutch.

My God....

This thread is like a train wreck.

Choo choo

I've read his bible many times. For the most part, aside for his garbled old English, I tend to like his logic. He loses me when he resorts to the old sexist garbage making women responsible for men's sexuality & burdens us with having to dress in his version of provocative & play an old cliche role. why the hell should I have to dress to arouse HIM? Why don't male Satanists share this obligation & have to dress in a manner arousing to women? The old mysogeny re-surfaces. What about gay & lesbian Satnists. must hey also wear all that crazy leather/vinly/cheap lace/fish-net/gawdy makeup LaVey likes?!? SCREW HIM! If he likes black vinyl micro-minis, fish-nets & stilettos, let him wear them himself! (Yes, I know the man is dead!) I'm going to wear what I'm going to wear!

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I've always felt that religion was a means of controlling people, going so far back as that religious law was actually a precursor to government in the modern concept. In order to maintain this control, religion had to oppose actions that disrupted the status quo: violence in it's more lethal forms and sexuality in general. In return, religion had provided answers to unanswerable questions that, barring further evidence, appear ficticious to me. I believe the world would be better off if we leaned more toward obeying our impulses instead of repressing them. But that's just my feeble effort to get things back on topic.

What impulses?

I agree on the religion - I kind of saw it as an early form of 'law' to follow. I believe there will be a day when people realize they dont need a religion or a government to control their actions (its called responsibility)

In essence, satanism is ego worship(satan is the ego).

If everyone thinks of themselves only, how can this world be a better place to live?

Actually, the present captitalist society is the epitome of satanism.

Its not "thinking of yourself" but its improving and listening to yourself. And if it isnt, then it IS ego and a crap "religion" or belief, imo.