German warning over mass Romanian and Bulgarian migration

Post Reply New Topic

What happens, though, when Bulgarians and Romanians become legally permitted to work in Germany?

Employers can get away with exploitation of these workers because they have no recourse. But once they are legal, then employers won't be able to get away with these practices. The "deluge" of Romanians and Bulgarians will start to dry up, and the exploitation will move on to Moldovans and Belorussians.

There will always be an illegal movement of migrant labour. Always. The economies of countries like Germany, the UK and the USA are built--in part--upon cheap labour. Many of the cities that are complaining about Romanians and Bulgarians are also the cities that would cease to function were those people not there.

The influx of economic migrants from poorer countries in Europe to richer ones only works when there are employers at liberty to hire cheap. But if employers have to pay the same wages and provide the same working conditions, then there is no attraction in hiring a foreign worker--the language barrier is a primary issue.

Poles were perfectly legally entitled to work in the UK from May 2004 on. They still came here in massive numbers (because wages in the UK were far, far higher than in Poland), largely because they were perceived as harder-working, could probably be paid less, and wouldn't know their rights like a UK citizen would.

Too many immigrants at one time like that can't be good, especially if there are not enough jobs for them.

There are nowhere nearly enough jobs. We have an unemployment rate of about 8% (and a youth unemployment rate of 21%) here at least count. And yet our lords and masters want to continue importing millions of people from poor countries to compete with not well-off British workers for jobs.

It's insanity.

Nope, I dont think the 50% austrian part of me, should have more rights then the 18,75% french part of me, the 6,25% corsican part of me (No, dont ever tell a corsican, that he would be a french. ^^), the 18,75% romanian part of me or the 6,25% russian part of me.

And no I am not a one worlder by any chance. So in building sector we always had a great amount of foreign workers, because its no representative work. Everyone wants to do office jobs nowadays. I am earning good money, and I am only 1/3 of my working time on building sites and do measuring and plan works, still there are poeple that think I have a low "status" because of "being forced" (I love it, its kind of freedom for me.) to visit these "dirty construction sites". -.- So we have many polish, hungarian, turkey and ex-Yugoslavian workers and also in our office there are many from eastern germany. Still we are always looking for good working austrian workers, because they still have the advantage of native speaking.

Most people think that construction site workers only do stupid works, but thats nonsense, so we need workers that are able to fluently communicate to architects, customers, the leading construction site office, or other workers like electricians, tile builder, painters, installers ... So at least we need 50% workers able of fluid speaking german, so we can be sure, that even during holidays we have a well speaking worker on every construction site. And its really hard finding them, and the ones we get, we are willing to pay well, because when doing the communication they take more responsibility. So if something goes wrong, they will get the blame, so more responsibility, more payment. But try finding people, willing to work on construction sites. Everybody wants to work in the clean office. -.- We were searching 6 months for two austrian worker trainees, because in the summer before we had problems with having not enough germans speaking workers. Forget it. Now we have employed two boys, whose parents came from turkey. So their german notes in school were terrible, but we found out they speak fluently german with viennese inhabitent accent. The only problem is, they wright in this way as well.



They are humans like others, so they can have no superpowers allowing them to work harder then other humans. Whatever they can achieve, can be achieved by others too. My company is 50 km at the border to hungary, so I have to match my work afford as well with the hungarian workers. But as long as they are not becoming mutants with superpowers, its not the problem. If a hungarian would have twice the outcome of work as I have in the same time, I know why my employer would like to hire the other person. Because of me sitting on my ass half of the time.

The less payment because of them not knowing the rights, I agree, it is a problem. So when they came, they didnt know, that they are allowed to visit doctors or offices during worktime, that timechanging is 1:1,5 and so and so on...but after 2-3 years they normally get to know their rights from their colleagues. So they know now, that a small percent of their payment goes to the "workers office" and that they can ask them for help and they are provided with free lawyers if the get misused by a corrupt company, on the other side the "workers office" provided them with info-documents of their rights in their mother languages and you can have help and information per telephone in different languages. So they match up to the other workers.

But the illegal workers cant, because you only get help from the "workers office" if you have an official work. So no information, no rights, no free lawyer, ...

Its not that I dont know, that it causes social problems, when people separate themself, having enclaves of their own language, culture in an foreign country. The more it is important not to let that happen by giving them the chance to live along with the other native people. As long as the illegal workers only can afford substandard areas with their illegal payment, they are forced to build these enclaves. This is something that must be prevented at all costs. So I understand that there are big problems in London with these subcultures, that are building their own worlds. On the other side I myself have one direct serbian neighbor, one of mazedonia and on of iran opposite to me of the street for years. They are normal official workers, so instead of being forced to live in enclaves with others, being frustrated about live, the concentrate on doing as every other person in my neighborhood is doing: Saving a bit money, renewing the house by themselfs every summer, loaning each other tools and so on, schools of their kids, and so on. There is no enclave where they can build up an own foreign culture, the neighborhood is our enclave as mixed as it is, and so we are the only one having influence on us. Sure they have accents and everything, but no real differences, and until now the iranian did not run after me to tell me about the koran. And their children got normal jobs, so my direct neighbors daughters became a secretary and the other one a baker, enabling them to live normally like us as well. So I dont need to be afraid of these kids causing social troubles.

If there were three iranians instead three different neighbors, sure they would concentrate on themselfs. But as long as everything is mixed up, i think its even helping for understanding and more tolerance, because every neighbor has his own personal culture you must deal with. So you cannot withdraw into your own culture alone.

What country are you a citizen of? Austria? I'm not on about ethnicity and if you're of French, Romanian or Russian descent; I'm on about citizenship and where you live.

Why shouldn't you be able to say, as a citizen, that you don't want Namibians or Russians coming into your country en-masse?

What I mean is that Australian citizens of British descent should have much less automatic right to live in the UK than UK citizens, because they're often not UK citizens.

Just because I might be of Norwegian descent doesn't necessarily mean that I should have the right to live in Norway if I'm not a Norwegian citizen.

It's that simple. The people who live in a territory should have the right to have their say about what happens to the place they live in respected.

I don't want a say in the affairs of Poland or Serbia because I'm not Polish or Serbian. I don't want mass immigration from poor countries because, at the moment, there are few jobs here and we have a lot of problems with British people being unemployed. In a country, the inhabitants / citizens of that country should come first, no?

The other point to it is that, if you as Austrians don't have control of whom you let in or out of your country, you've lost control of your own sovereignty. And that is down to the EU.

I have official citizenship for Austria and France. Still I do not understand, why my employer should not have the right to fire me, and instead hire another worker that delivers him 200% work in the same time, just because this ones hungarian? The border is 50km from here, so there are no different persons living, they are completely the same persons as I am and people are regularly crossing the border for shopping and everything. If another person is doing 200% more work then I do in the same time, I should stop sitting on my ass instead forcong my employer to keep me because of some printed paper.

And the problems, that there are company sectors, where you dont find people that wont work here, is still existent. I repeat: We searched 6 months for two new trainees to become experienced workers in our company. But noone wants to work on construction sites anymore. We searched openly in newspapers, in internet, ... and we are not racistic, but we need at least one fluent speaking worker on every construction site, so we searched for fluent german speaking workers. We did not find them.

It seems the citizens dont want to. Because if they had come, wanting the jobs, we would happily have offered them.

In the US and Canada the immigrants create jobs for themselves. There are hundreds of tech start ups created by Asian immigrants. Don't Poles own some of the corner shops? I'm sure it could be made it easier for immigrants to start businesses in England. If the government removed whatever red tape stands in the way, unemployment wouldn't be such an issue.