Do you feel drawn to Satanism

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Satanists are atheist. Satan is merely a symbol of the the person who puts himself at the top rather than the idiotic concepts of Christian society.

Why is that self defeating? They just want to have fun, be free and be proud while they are alive. They enjoy rituals, so they perform them. I find Buddhism to be too restrictive on emotions, though I don't know much about it.

Then you just created an oxymoron, for the concept, even the name of Satan, holds religious title. you cant truly be religious and atheist both, can you? the only exceptions you make are the excuses you make for your self to live by your own actions.

No, I don't find personal subjectivism any more appealing than the collective kind.

On the other hand, I have yet to see Satanists commit genocide, build death camps or Gulags, fly airplanes into buildings, molest children, call for the death of those who believe differently, steal my hard-earned, or presume to dictate to me how to live my life. So I actually find them less offensive than more mainstream ideologies.

I've never found myself being drawn to any kind of group, society, club or religion.

I just can't be doing with all that group mentality, rules, regulations and dress codes.

No, it does nothing for me.

Oh Thank you Fnord, I have not laughed so loud in a while

That really isn't a problem! It is only symbolism. And in this case it is warranted. The mainstream religion holds certain values and it is understandable why a group that abhors those values would choose to identify with the character who rebelled. Religious/Mythical symbols are used in many places. Titles do not matter much, ideology does.

I was just about to post this. There's really nothing more to be said.... except that I find the political alliance between libertarians and religious fundies in the US very interesting.

The video has nothing to do with the Church of Satan! Is that Epictetus in your avatar?

I was referring to the statement, not the video.

And yes, that is Epictetus. I doubt he would consider Satanism to be very 'virtuous' either... Stoics are ethically bound to serve their fellowman and strive to be temperate, just, wise, and courageous in everything they do...

That's not very Satanic, I'm afraid.

Right, and what does the Church of Satan have to do with these groups?

I have studied Stoicism. I have found it useful in bad times but I think it is self deception in many ways. We are animals who appreciate carnal pleasures. It is as much part of our nature as rationality. The Stoic "Nature" is pure deception in my opinion. Avoiding the pleasures of life seems downright unwise to me, yet Stoics would avoid many of them. It seems to me that they simply call natural anything they want to support, even though it seems entirely unnatural. What point is there to living according to Stoicism?

Why do you think that wisdom, justice, and courage are not appreciated by Satanists? I have found all three in their literature, though I don't agree with everything they say. How did you form your opinion of Satanism?

How did I form my opinion about Satanists? From reading. I'll agree that Satanists are animals who enjoy carnal pleasures. They are also very selfish, a trait they share with Libertarians. Most Satanists seem to believe that anything is ok as long as you can get away with it. That does not seem very Just or wise to me. And using personal power to achieve selfish ends does not seem very courageous to me either.

Satanist are driven by desire. What happens when you cannot fulfill those desires? Adopting a lifestyle where you enslave yourself to animal urges doesn't seen seen like a good idea to me.

Stoicism is all about living a peaceful life. No matter what I have, I have everything I need and I am a slave to no one or anything. Stoicism bestows clarity upon it's followers and allows them to see the world as it truly is, without the bias of base passion.


Before modern Satanists shat out the slogan "Do what you will," Marcus Aurelius had anticipated, and finished the thought, "Do what you will. Even if you tear yourself apart, most people will continue doing the same things.”


PS

Don't get me wrong here... Some of my best friends act like Satanists. My dog has no Reason or morals and only acts upon instinct and positive/negative reinforcement. We get along pretty well as long as she doesn't poop on the carpet.

If you check out the website, it seems as if modern Satanists are most interested in social Darwinism and sexbots...

http://www.churchofsatan.com/WebBeta/pe ... ionism.php

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKBJxZf-Dgs[/youtube]

I bet you guys didn't know Robot Chicken was full of Satanists...

No, there are rules in Satanism. You cannot go around bothering people to get your way. You cannot harm anyone without provocation. You have been misled about this. We are selfish animals. There is nothing wrong with wanting what is good for yourself. That is nature, and just about all of us seek what is good for us. Pleasure is not an indifferent, it is of utmost importance in our lives. Be it in music, sports, television, games, sex, eating well, we seek pleasure and there is nothing wrong with that. Besides, the Stoics did not shun wealth, Seneca for example was among the wealthiest persons in Rome, as I recall. Seems pretty selfish to me.

If you cannot get your desires you will be unhappy, but it is better to try and achieve joy rather than surrender from the start and hinder your life in so many ways that it isn't worth living.

Base passion is the entire point of life. Without it there is no point to living. Why do Stoics continue living? If a life is as noble if short then what point is there to life? Why continue living? The truth is that we are animals with passions that we would like to satisfy. We can deceive ourselves and try to convince ourselves that getting a massage or eating chocolate does not give us joy but it is a complete lie that serves no purpose. If one has no chance of satisfying one's passions then one might as well accept it and not beat up oneself, but often we have a good chance of satisfying our passions and should seek to do so.

The point is to have realistic goals about satisfying your passions not to tear yourself apart with the impossible. One need not continue living. One can end one's life right now and not be a slave to anything, neither food, nor air, nor shelter but without being a slave to desires there is no point to life. If we we are completely free of desires life becomes pointless.

It boils to this. The pleasures of life are not indifferent. A life with many pleasures is much better than one without. We can try and convince ourselves that having a home is no better than being homeless, and that having good food is no better than starving, and that being wealthy is no better than being poor, and that being athletic no better than being cripple , and that being comfortable no better than being in chronic pain, but in the end it is all a big lie; one that not even we ourselves will believe deep down. We will still seek shelter, food, health and comfort. It is our true nature and there is nothing wrong with it. We need not feel guilty about what we are. The Stoic classification of the good things in life as indifferents is its fatal flaw.

I hadn't seen that before, but I was born during communism and when there is economic equality there is no reason to excel and eventually it gets so bad that the people can barely feed themselves. Competition brings progress!

As for non sentient artificial humans, that's his business. Nothing wrong with fantasizing of a bright future lol

Don't believe the lies of the Jedi ...

selflessness is a deception,
care not for the weak, helping them only makes them more pathetic,
believing in one's passion at the expense of others is the only truth,
with passion I gain virtue,
with virtue I gain power,
with power I gain freedom and my chains are broken ...

at least that is what my Sith master tells me ...