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madbutnotmad
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23 Feb 2021, 5:06 pm

I personally decided to live outside the political framework
as i have completely lost faith in the power elite politicians using idealism as their bargaining chips which they use to persuade the common people to vote them in so they can then abuse their access to power and resource, and once voted in, they then un-fulfill their promises to the people who voted them and abuse their power and the resources.

I personally now see my self as an altruistic egalitarian humanitarian and try and help human kind, where ever I can, regardless as to what label the power and resources holder holds.

When a good man is in power or office, then they will act on my requests or advice.
When a bad man is in power, they will ignore people such as myself's requests and allow the world to suffer.

But still, we, as human beings must try. As we can help the world get better, if we try.



Aspiegaming
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23 Feb 2021, 5:50 pm

madbutnotmad wrote:
I personally decided to live outside the political framework
as i have completely lost faith in the power elite politicians using idealism as their bargaining chips which they use to persuade the common people to vote them in so they can then abuse their access to power and resource, and once voted in, they then un-fulfill their promises to the people who voted them and abuse their power and the resources.

I personally now see my self as an altruistic egalitarian humanitarian and try and help human kind, where ever I can, regardless as to what label the power and resources holder holds.

When a good man is in power or office, then they will act on my requests or advice.
When a bad man is in power, they will ignore people such as myself's requests and allow the world to suffer.

But still, we, as human beings must try. As we can help the world get better, if we try.


For me, the problem isn't just politicians, but also people in general who are so politically divided that society can't heal or function properly. I have no problems with liberals or conservatives, but people who are politically extreme can rot for all I care. I absolutely refuse to see middle ground with extremists.


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Bradleigh
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23 Feb 2021, 6:32 pm

I don't know what your politics are, but people don't always know the right words to express for the correct level of response. And when one is trying to help people who are disadvantaged or discriminated against for what they are, the moderate can come across just as bad as the far right, because the people concerned over those cause, a sometimes centrist opinion of do nothing or nothing of substantial effect will mean a continued endorsement of bad systems.

I am curious by what sort of opinions you could have had that would have someone call you a far right Nazi. Got no real context of what might be extreme.


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kraftiekortie
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23 Feb 2021, 6:39 pm

I believe the best way to help the disadvantaged....is not to emphasize how "disadvantaged" they are. And not to assume that a person won't succeed because he/she is in an "oppressed" group.

There are times when I feel that people perpetuate racism----by emphasizing the "separateness" of the races, and assuming that one race is automatically privileged, and the other is automatically oppressed.

My wife is black----and she's saved far more money than I have. And she has less education than I do. But, she has much more common sense than I do. She allowed herself NOT to be oppressed because she is black.



Bradleigh
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23 Feb 2021, 7:06 pm

If groups never have it empathise how they may be disadvantaged, the nothing changes. How well one particular person did compared to another against maybe even the expected results of disadvantage does no disprove a systematic problem is fixed or is on its way to being fixed. We can't only look at individual cases, and talking about disadvantages is not the same things as telling people that they cannot succeed, that is just silly. It might make someone all the more impressive that they overcame disadvantages, or just lucky.

Yes, there are times where things like racism can be perpetuated by empathising a separateness of the groups. But is not just as perpetuated when things like exceptions get treated as something political and the people uncomfortable by that don't get challenged. You can't have something like a movie have a black lead without some people asking if why they have to be black, or an interracial couple without those people thinking why it has to be interracial. Change is going to either be incredibly slower than it needs to be, or worse you will see things slide back into what is deemed comfortable and the fight is going to need to be dragged back out when it becomes obvious that there is a problem.

Maybe some people will still use things as a crutch for failure or something when they could have tried harder, but the problem is that some people have to try harder at all for what they are.


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kraftiekortie
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23 Feb 2021, 7:13 pm

Yes, my wife had to try harder than I did---definitely. And it was because she is black, and she's from a Caribbean country.

What bothers me, really, is that, under some "woke" notions, white people are automatically oppressors and racists based purely on the fact that they're white.

I'm not going to consent to me, myself, being called a racist merely because I happen to be white and Jewish. I'm not going to "check my privilege." I'm going to express my opinion based upon my life experience. And if it doesn't jibe with some extreme left-winger or right-winger....tough nuggies!

There has to be a middle ground between two extremes!



Bradleigh
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23 Feb 2021, 8:06 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I'm not going to consent to me, myself, being called a racist merely because I happen to be white and Jewish.


And you should not have to, the people do say one should be are ridiculous. it is why intersectionality is important, where things like class should be taken into consideration. And yet is also can create a dynamic where those who do not fight against the system or really are just trying to live in it could be letting problems go, or be unfairly criticised for acceptance. The only way things like that are going to be fixed is if people are upfront in their beliefs and how things should be, and then something is done to push forward the change.


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Kraichgauer
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23 Feb 2021, 9:26 pm

You're Bill Maher.


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slam_thunderhide
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26 Feb 2021, 11:37 am

Aspiegaming wrote:
I lean left to get away from Republican economics.
I lean right to get away from SJWs and Wokeness.


I think most regular people are "left wing" in terms of economic issues, and "right wing" on social issues. I know I am.

Unfortunately what we get with the major political parties (at least in the English-speaking world) seems to be the complete opposite on both issues.



Fnord
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26 Feb 2021, 11:52 am

What we get is that no matter which party sources our political identities, it requires us to adhere to its doctrines in every way possible.  So if you are economically conservative and socially liberal, then the hard-line Democrats will accuse you of not being a "true" Democrat, and the hard-line Republicans will accuse you of not being a "true" Republican, either.

It is like certain religious denominations, in that you simply must obey all of their doctrines on behavior, or you are not a "true" Buddhist, Christian, Jew, Muslim, or whatever.