The vanishing American man

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Completely different contexts; in order for your observation to mean anything you'd have to ignore that reality.

You can't hold up a piece of art as groundbreaking when that ground was broken ages ago.
That's the difference. Should we ignore that difference so your point will appear valid?4

After a dozen or more WAP knockoffs no one will find those songs groundbreaking or empowering either, they'll just be another category of raunchy song.

WAP was hardly "ground-breaking." There is a long tradition of women writing and performing raunchy, sex-positive songs.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkPCmIx ... VonPenguin

---

Oh, of 'Mice and Men'; Dear Lord, Humans are NOT Mice Yet The Thesis on 'The

Vanishing American Man' And The Separation of Genders, Not So Likely to Do

The 'Wild Thing' Like in Japan, A Most Technologically Advanced Country
Where Youth are

Losing Much

Real Reproductive

Appeal to Another Gender;

And Traditional Roles of Culture

Are Changing Greatly; Yes, Let's Look At the

Similarities Discussed With John B. Calhoun's

Thesis on A Mouse Utopia, He Created Back in the 60's,

Where Instant Gratification Was Provided To The Mice And

Social Roles Soon Faded Away And the Male Mice, in General,

Lost Any Desire to Protect Their Territories And Were Called 'The Beautiful

Ones' As They Groomed Themselves Incessantly And Did Not Have Any Scars

From the Rough And Tumble Life of Protecting Their Own Territories AS Such...

The Female Rats Became More Aggressive With Each Other; And Almost Predictably

Yes, Soon With The Genders Divided That Way Reproduction Ceased And The Whole

Utopian

Mouse Colony

Did Go Locally Extinct;

i've Pretty Much Summarized
It Yet Will Provide a Link For Further
Detail; As An Anthropology Observer

Participant Studying the Human Condition Intensely

For the Last 9 Years and 9 Months; And Sure Even Before (Happy 'Cinco De Mayo Day' By The

Way) That For A Total of 63 Years, One Day And One Month Shy of That 'Advanced Age;'

Oh, How Society And Gender(s) Roles Have Changed Since i Was Born on 6.6.60; Right

Then, When 'The Pill' Was Brought on to Scene, Where Women Tend to Select Mates

Then Not Quite As Masculine With Traits as the Hormonal Changes 'The Pill' Do Bring on

or off; Yes, my Mother Won the Best Figure Contest in 11th and 12th Grade and Eventually

My Father's Mother Said She Had the Most Glowing Fair Estrogen Filled Skin of Them All...

And Yes, Her Photos
From the 50's, Do

Shine That Way;

On the Other Hand, my Father As My Mother
Described Him; She, Working as A Clerk at the Local Courthouse;
As He Was Currently Working Law Enforcement in Then What Was
Called the 'Beverage Department'; Yes, Busting Moonshiners in The Woods

And Having to Fill Out the Paperwork at the Courthouse When Some Secretary
Or Clerk Wasn't Doing it For Him Swooning Over His Jet Black Curly Hair and

Sea Green Eyes;

Product of A
Cajun Spiced
French Mama;

And the Immigrated, X-Catholic Irish
Priest With His Father From the Black
Forest of Germany; Yes, with the 'Abilities'
She 'Possessed' AS She Woo'ed Him Out of the
Pews at Age 17; And He Was 36; Oh, the Scandal;
Oh, The Excommunication Then From the Catholic

(He Was A Noted Author From Last Century, Writing
Several Books, Most noted in His Wiki Bio For "Behind
The Dictators," Per The Roman Catholic Influence then)

Church to Get Married And Have A Normal
'Gender Roled Life;' Oh the Rule Breakers Yes!

Thank God! or i Would Not Exist At All; at All;

Same With My Wife; As When Her Mother's Husband,
Her Stepfather, Was Overseas in Germany, Her Mother Got Really,

Really, REALLY Lonely And Visited The Bars When the 'Pacific
Islanders' Were on 'Liberty' That Way From Ships; A LOT OF
BEAUTY CAME OUT OF THAT 'INTERACTION' INDEED FOR REAL;

Anyway,

BACK TO the Future
of my Mother and Father
And me in that Case too;

My Mother Said my Father Was
the Most Handsome Man She Ever

Laid Her Eyes Upon; So Rugged, Half Shaven

Out in the Woods Busting Moonshiners as such;

She Said Whoever Was Married to Him Must Be the
Luckiest Woman in the World; Yet at age 26, Back in those

Days, Rather Old For an Unmarried Women Working in a Courthouse,

He Asked Her to Marry Him on the First Date and She Accepted on The Second Date;

After They Got Married, He Almost Never Said A Word to Her; The World was Changing,

'The Pill' Had Arrived That My Mother had No Plans of Using; Yet Yes, He Saw the American

Get Rich Scheme AS His American Dream Along With Owning a New Car Every Three Years THaT He Did;

He Told Her to Go to Work; And She Said No, She Wanted to Raise Children in A Garden of LoVE iN Peace
(Poetically Paraphrasing Her Words; Yet She is the Published Poet By Paper Book in her 50's, And Hell No Not Me;

As i'm All into Saving 'Forrests;'
Full of 'Gumpy' Trees, Hehe)

You'll Have to Excuse

me With a Tear in my
Eye; Mother's Day is

(She Always Said
i Was So Special)

Coming; She's No

Longer Here;

Yet i Have Her
Breath of Poetry
And LoVE iN Peace
Left; Yet OH NO; Yes What

An Estrogen Filled Influence She Was on me;

And God Yes; Got the Pics to Prove The Epigenetic

Effect it Had on me; as my Mother Said Before my Father

Left When i am 3, and Before i Could Speak at 4, i Worshipped The

Ground he Walked on And Wanted to Be Just Like Him, Before i Could

Even Talk; Yep, Still Have the Pic of me ALL BOY WITH TWO TOY GUNS WITH

BOW TIE COMING BACK FROM SOMEWHERE, MAYBE CHURCH; I'M NOT SURE AT 3;

THERE was no Doubt

All Boy, Yet Fast Forward

to A Few Years After Daddy is

Gone; And My Skin Glowed More

And My Hips Did Not Narrow Like the

Other Boys Did; True, So Full of Love With SMiLes;

Yet True, The Fearless

Father; The Rugged

One Who Looked Like

James Bond Yet According to my

Mother Was Only More Handsome, Holding A Cigarette,

Looking Like He Had Never Experienced Fear in His Life;

Indeed That's What i Wanted From Him More than Anything

When i Tried to Do A Crash Course to Be More Like him Twice

A Year when We Saw Him; When of course, He Hardly Said More than

A Few Words in His Lazy Boy Chair Watching Baseball or NASCAR, THE REST OF HIS LIFE;

Silent, Olive Skinned, Dark Haired With Sea Green Eyes; Indeed My Mother And Father

the EPiToMe

of Social
Roles for

Man and Woman;

Highly Sexually Dimorphic AS Such;

Where Both Nature and Nurture 'Shake Hands' That Way;

Hmm, Yet What is the Advantage for the Fearless Father Not to Stay

Around Still Now and the Mother to Provide a Home of LoVE iN Peace;

Roses With FLoWeRS

Yet No THorns

to Provide Tough
Enough Skin to Survive

In This No Holds Barred World;

Well, It Was Pretty Much Like Hell;

And Yes Literally Ended up That Way At Age
47, For 66 Months; As i No Longer Had the
Social Capacity to Keep Up WITH REAL LIFE;

Yet the LoVE iN Peace Part Was Surely Warm;

Yet On the Other Hand Anxiety Sucks; Anxiety REALLY Sucks;

Like the Cat We Adopted, Called Big Gray Moby From Our Neighbors,

When They Kicked Him Out of the House With No Claws As the New Baby

Had Allergies And Moby Didn't Nearly Come First in the Home Anymore;

Oh Lord, the Ignorance;

The Dude Said Moby

Was A Big Boy; He Would

Be Fine Out in the Wild With No Claws;

That's Kind of a Long Story Yet to make it
Shorter, He Developed An Eating Disorder of
Eating too Much too Fast And Only Lived to Age 10;

With A Really Sad Slow DownFall With Cat Diabetes; Yes,
Not able to Lift Himself Up to the Litter Box in His Last Days;

His Daily Routine ALL HIS LIFE, Consisting of Laying Down and Eating;

Same Age As the Feral Cat With Feline Leukemia Living to Around 10 Years Old
As Well; Yet You See, The Feral One lived a Life Without Fear And Transformed

to a Loving Lap Cat; Enjoying All the Healing Benefits of Oxytocin; God Yes, The Rest

Of His Cat Life too; Yet Retaining The Call of the Wild in Edge of Alertness and Not Eating

Too Much, Always Saving

What He Had For Later;

(Even After He Got 'Fixed;'
And 'They' Didn't Expect
Him to Live 8 More Years;
The Vet Remarked How
Amazing His Body Builder
Shoulders for Killing Squirrels Remained)

Yes, Just in case our Budget for
Catfood Dried Up; Always Looking

For Other Sources of Water Other than
Moby's Predictable Water Bowl; Nothing Was

Off Limits; Shower or Toilet Bowl, Either One; Just Find
Water to Survive As He Did in the Wild for A Year Before

i Tempted 'Yellow Boy' With A Tender Vittle Underneath Our Shed
During A Drought as He Wailed for Just A Drop of Water To Survive;

Understanding

That Occasionally

Humans Leave Water Outside

And Even Food too on Lucky Wild Cat Days;

Maybe the Other Fathers Around Town Who Stayed
With Their Wive's and Children and Religiously Attended

Church Each Sunday

Weren't As Rugged,

Handsome, And As

(Filled With Androgens)

'Cold' Emotionally as My
Father of Few to No Words;

As His Identical Twin Brother

Never Even Said a Word to My
Mother; During Their Marriage Either;

Yes, There is No Doubt Where Both
me and my Sister Got Our Asperger's Syndrome From;

And True, For Almost Two Decades, i Rarely Said A Word to my

Wife Either; See All These Words; Feel All These Emotions in Words;

They Did Not Exist During the Stress of Work Life; As True My Father Did
Law Enforcement for 46 Years and His Twin Brother Married into Money;

And Got to Work

For Himself in

Photography

And Free Lance

Detective Work;
Serving Papers and the

(He Stayed With His Family,
Softer In Every Way Human
In Loving Ways; Yet Still
Relatively Silent too)

SucH As That After A Short
Stint in the Military And Short
Career Rising in Rank as A Policeman
As Both He and My Father Started Out in the Military And As MotorCycle Cops;

Still Pictures of the Twins That Way in Historical Papers From Leon County in Florida;

It's Hard When You Don't Fit In; And i Guess When You Have Asperger's Syndrome (And There
is No Diagnosis in the 60's) And You Can't Speak Until Four, You Basically End Up Repeating
And Modeling A Lot of
What is Around You

To Even Survive;

And of Course,

Epigenetic Effects are

Real; A World of Women

That Was All for me; And

Eventually Confused For A Girl

in McDonald's By the Cashier at Age

12, Looking at my Long Eyelashes and

Blue to Green Changing Eyes too With Fair Skin of Course;

And God Yes, Glowing With A Smile Not Afraid to LoVE iN Peace;

Yet That Doesn't Work Well in A Tribal 'Trump' Town Still Worshipping

An Old Tribal God of War; Threatening Bodily Abuse if i Dared to Smile

At Either the City Park or Middle School Halls; As It's No CR8P, Toxic Patriarchy

Was All the CuLTuRaL RAge Then; Not Much Different than the 'SCaRCiTiES' of the

Desert Yet Yes Still in the Abundance And Beauty of Northwest Florida With So Many

Military Installations And Once Holding the Guinness World Record of Most Christian

Onward Marching Soldier Churches Per Capita in Yes, THE Entire World; It's Really No

Surprise the Football Team Were Runners Up in State Championship And Champions

Two Years After i Graduated; A Place Where Warriors Were Bred Both From the Military

And Other Church Families of Warring God's of Protection As Well; Yet You Know What,

Though, Even Now,

Around 70 Percent;
Yes, And More of the
County Still Support The

'Trump Meme;' YET NOW THere is A Transgender

Person; i Don't Know Which Type; And That's
Okay As This Human is the Nicest Walmart

Greeter The County Has Ever Had; And There

Is A Big Display Now With LGBQT+ Related Items

to Celebrate the Diversity of Humankind There; And You

Better Believe IT; It's Corporate Protected; If anyone Gives the

Transgender Person A Hard Time or Starts Any Other Bull CR8P;

The Cops Will Come and Remove them from the Store if Necessary

in a 'Florida Man' Minute;

Anyway; There Are So Many

Natural and Nurturing Factors That

Come into Play For What Makes Gender Roles

What They Are; i Surely Understand First Hand;

What it Feels Like When the President of the Beta Club

Still in God Damned High School Says in Your Freshman

Year; Yes in a Frigging Club For Nerds; Welcome Ladies and

Gentlemen and Fred;

It's Hard not to Fit In;

It's Most Definitely Hard for

Folks Who Others Assign another Gender to;

And When They Just Decide to Do IT For Real;

THEN They MAY BE Outcast even More; Not Necessarily 'Locally' Now

Yet At the State Level of Politics in Ignorant States of Humanity Now;

i Finally Found the Fearless Father in me; And It's True i had to Go to
Bars for 6 Years Starting at 53, and Get into A Few Rough And Tumble
Brawls to Finally

Get Initiated

In A way my

Youth Never Freely Brought;

Life is a Lot Easier When You Are
Able to Fit into Culturally Ascribed Roles;

And Life May Be the Best oF All When You WiLL Create

Your Own Memes And Other 'Shticks' Of Life When You

Rise out of the DarK into the LiGHT; And You no Longer

Have to Conform as You Beat the System for Pay AND TO FIT IN;

INDEED, WHEN
OTHERS REALLY

HAVE NO CHOICE

IN REAL LIFE, YET TO ALLOW

YOU TO BE YOU; AS ThERE IS

NO DOUBT YOU STAND FIRM

GROUNDED TOUCHING THE STARS OF FREEDOM FOR
REAL; INDEED, THANKS DADDY FOR LEAVING; i Had

to find my own way; And it Ended Up Being the Best

That Way Newly Now For Sure;

it Took 53 Years;

Yet i own my

Life and am Slave
to No One Else on this

Earth Except when my Wife
Tells me What to Do, Hehe;

True, i've Earned the Patience of
'Job' For Real too;

Yes, Just Yes

Dear and
Spend the

Rest of Your Life
With Wings for Real...

The World is Not Fair;

Some Will Survive;

Some Will Not;

And Yes, Others Will
THRiVE iN A Better Place They
Individually, And ToGeTHeR DO, Newly Now,

TO Move, Connect, and Yes, Co-Create For REAL;

You See, Man and Or Woman, We Are NOT MiCE; God Yes, We
Do Have A Common Rodent Ancestor From Around 75 MiLLioN

Years Ago; And Yes, Share Much of the Same Genetic Material;

Yet Humanity Has the iMaGiNaTioN And CREaTiViTY to Co-Create

Their Own Social Roles And Will to Actually ThriVE iN Life; No Matter

How Many Other

'Mice' Give up

And Jump Ship;

Faster or Slower;

This Is Life; Make the
Best of What's Still Around Or Not;

Co-Create A New Way of Living and Even Thrive...

Yet What's True About John B. Calhoun's Experiment
Is Instant Gratification is A Highway to Heaven to Hell...

In All Ways That Comes and Goes; You Ain't Gonna Stay

in Heaven

On Earth

Unless Ya
Do 'Boot Camp' too;

Even, If You've Never
Been And Have to Create

Your Own Challenges to Go With the Sweet Teas of Life...

And If You Spread Yourself Out too Thin With Distractions And

Do Not Find A Way to Focus on One TasK iN Flow; Oh the Potentials

That One Will Never Create; As Some Folks Have the Attention Spans

And Focuses of 'Blue Whales' to Swim Across the Oceans Free and

As Science Shows

Others Have the

Average Attention
Span of God Yes; Less
Than 3 Seconds; Literally

Less than A Gold Fish; Again,
Assessed by Science; Credit Too Goes

To "The Revenge of the Nerds" From the
Old Beta Club i Was Part of Too; Yes They

Systemized the Deficits of Human Nature;

And Profit Now off of Human Nature; Falling,

Falling, Falling, FAiLiNG

YES into Potential

Nothingness@ALL;

As Long As The Dollar

Bill Is Dancing And Is the

God of the New 'Masses;'

The Spiral Will Continue Mostly Straight Down...

On the Other Hand, THere Are Lots of Ways to Sprout
Fearless

Wings oF

LoVE iN

Peace FREE

That Yes; GoD
No, Do Not Fall
Newly Now, So Very Low...

And to Be Clear, i Am Just
Relating my Experiences
Directly on the ToPiC At
Hand; MileAge Varies GREATLY, Depending
On Model And Make; And Yes, Vessel And Essence Of Human
Being Real; God Yes, i Am A Hybrid of Many Colors, NewLY NoW.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_B._Calhoun

---

How many of them were significant hits on a similar scale as WAP?

Sorry, this point simply doesn't appear to hold-up to even a bare minimum of scrutiny.

This was 1930. Long before the internet. Long before there was such a thing as "going viral."

Still, WAP was just part of a tradition.

Another example of a woman singing a bawdy song is Jean Redpath, with "Nine Inch will Please a Lady"



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWlnz94 ... path-Topic

Anything written by Robert Burns has been a "significant hit" for centuries. Still very popular at Renaissance Fairs.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q23rFTl ... teTreasure

And, Jean Redpath's recordings of Robert Burns' songs have won critical praise around the world. She was awarded the MBE (Most Excellent Order of the British Empire) in 1987, and was inducted into the Scottish Traditional Music Hall of Fame in 2008.

And, Lucille Bogan's hit song has been popularized for modern audiences by The Asylum Street Spankers



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5JoDfi ... hnnyMiller


Here is a funny reaction video:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t8Q-NR ... boydReacts

Dunno, for me the article seemed to present a plethora of unconnected claims, so it was hard for me to focus on quite what the gist of it is supposed to be. If somebody could reduce it to a short sentence or two it might be more accessible. Maybe it's because I'm not a North American, and don't really understand the complexities of these things that get called American values, or see the need for any such thing. It could be argued that as a non-American I have no business commenting here, but I think it would be good if somebody would explain the article in a way that makes sense to the uninitiated.

I find this very hard to believe because the average American man is an extremely large human being, often between 275-400lbs. Hard to just vanish behind a tree trunk or lamp post or something. American men are very, very, visible.

This is censored knowledge but men do jobs that are dangerous because women are more valued and must be protected.

That is the reason men historically go to war and women do not. One man and a hundred females can repopulate much faster than one female and a hundred males.

It is crazy how the actually reasonable parts of the red pill got totally obliterated from public consciousness; and only the stupid stuff remains.

You are welcome.

Until recently it was a man’s world. Abuse of women was celebrated when we growing up and becoming adults. Rock stars were celebrated for going from city to city and and screwing underage girls, there were movies such as ‘Animal House’ and ‘Porky’s’ that celebrated raping women, staring at naked girls in the showers through peep holes. The assumption was if a women was raped she asked for it and if she did not want it she should not have been wearing those clothes. In my job back in the 80s strippers came on special occasions or a favored employees birthday. Abuse of women explained as boys being boys.

Now the world is not as female unfriendly. Some of the problems men have is that they are not used to being not entitled as much. And some of it is overcorrection. Too often traditional masculinity has been conflated with toxic masculinity, efforts to make things more female friendly end up making things male unfriendly. That is the wokeness so many around here are insisting is not real.

As far as “male behavior” being butt of jokes that is not new. Does Archie Bunker ring a bell? “Female behavior’ were also the butt of jokes such as my wife went shopping and spent all the money I earned. We laughed and did not get our fruit of the looms all twisted up about them.

You're not exactly wrong. I do think the education system tends to favor girls over boys. The advantage of that is that male athletes get offered much more scholarship money than any girl gets offered in academic scholarships. I've never met a girl valedictorian--and pretty much EVERY valedictorian I've run across was a girl, with very few exceptions--who got offered more than a combined $75k to $100k in academic scholarships. I HAVE, however, met more than one boy who got offered over $1 MILLION in athletic scholarships combined. These days college athletes are suing for shares in corporate sponsorships as though they were employees and not students. I say pay them if they're worth it.

But girls aren't going to get those opportunities. It's only fair that girls have an academic edge so that they can have full academic scholarships. And that means the education system will be better suited to meeting girl needs over boys.

There's also a disparity between occupations that favor men or women over the other. Men and women are just built differently. There's nothing wrong with that. Part of the feminist argument is that men have a physical advantage over women and tend to dominate them, hence why patriarchy is a problem and unfair. Women tend to be drawn towards occupations such as teaching, nursing, paralegal, arts/crafts, retail. Those occupations require detail-oriented work and "smart" skills. They also require personality traits such as empathy and a reliance on intuition. Occupations that suit men better tend to be more logic- and decision-driven, require a lot of personal initiative, and emphasize gross motor skills.

It's not that women are irrational or men are brutes. It's just a question of why men and women end up in different occupations. And knowing that men and women will tend to go in different directions, doesn't it make sense to structure an educational program that supports the needs of men and women?

You'll never get a completely fair educational system as long as that system is co-ed. It will either favor one sex or the other. You can't structure a school around meeting women's needs and expect boys to do better. You can't structure a school around rewarding male achievement and expect girls to do better. The best system will separate the two and tailor instruction to their respective needs.

Here is a snapshot of three newly adult men in my life. (all of them have been in my alternative education environment since at least age 10 and I think we do a really good job individualizing education.)

A: reliable, trustworthy, funny, intelligent, attractive cynical, sarcastic - slightly overweight but works hard on food choices and movement to fight his genetics. Cisgender Caucasian Bisexual. Never had a girlfriend or boyfriend, but would really like one. Wants to own his own restaurant someday and is entering an excellent culinary/business school next year. Works 20 hours a week and banks almost all of it as “investment capital” feels complete contempt for his company and managers but addresses them with respect (I have heard him take a work call) and performs all of his duties as well as he can. Takes advantage of training opportunities. Has said out loud “stroking morons is one of the things I get paid for. And I am paid well.” Has little or no use for religion or most adults. Politically active. Sees society as a capitalist system in which he simply needs to follow the rules (written and implied) in order to maximize his own gain, and a social system that has no use for him and from which he must protect himself.

K: gentle, funny, kind, very tall and broad, a good friend who gets along with anyone. Cisgender Straight Caucasian, has never dated. Doesn’t care. Struggles with a learning disability. Wanted to be a plumber, but his parents are making him go to college for a business degree. Sees the world as a pretty comfortable, welcoming place. Politically indifferent. Figures everything will turn out ok.

R: smart, lazy, agreeable, kind, forgettable average Caucasian guy. Cisgender, Bisexual. Not sure he sees the world anymore as his eyes are dazzled by his boyfriend of just over a year. Kids are betting they’ll be married by June. Prefers nature to school. Planning to pursue a degree leading to a parks and rec job. Currently volunteering with local parks department. Also politically indifferent. Also thinks everything will probably turn out fine.

We were just discussing the song WAP--written and performed by a woman, and celebrating prostitution.

At last I'm beginning to understand.

Slightly more seriously, perusing the replies to the original post has led me to some kind of a grasp of the article's meaning. It's claiming (in a somewhat cryptic way) that men are becoming some kind of underclass in the USA. Don't know why they didn't just say that. Well, in total I've been in the USA for several years, and I've not once noticed anybody putting me down or denying me anything on the grounds of my being male. Mind you, I've been mostly in Arkansas, so maybe something's going on somewhere else.

Hard to be competitive in work & play with all that extra weight and estrogen, I'd imagine. So, perhaps if some American men are feeling unaccomplished they should point their fingers back at themselves for being the ones not being disciplined & doing the work it takes to achieve things.