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God is Santa for adults

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Sedaka
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12 May 2008, 8:06 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Seeing resurrection from the dead firsthand kinda took away that atheist epiphany from me... of course I wasn't taught to believe in Saint Nick aside from that historical dude, so I have less association of bullshot with whatnot to get in my way of accepting God....


JimmyJazz wrote:
Shocking, another teenager who has figured out all the truths of the universe.


I've spent time with every major religion and most not-so-well-known, and I've considered atheism too. Although atheists will in the most part be very quick to tell you NOTHING ELSE EVEN MAKES SENSE GOD IS AN IMAGINARY FRIEND LAWLERSKATES, I honestly came out of these studies thinking Atheism doesn't make much sense.

Oh well, takes all kinds.



JimmyJazz, I think you cool that you can reject their propaganda... but what DO you accept as factual?


whose resurrection did you see firsthand?

edit: i've walked on that aqueduct in your new avie :)


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12 May 2008, 2:16 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:

JimmyJazz, I think you cool that you can reject their propaganda... but what DO you accept as factual?


Sorry, missed this earlier.

I accept that there is no scientific explanation as to -why- all the 'rules' of the universe hold true. They tell me how those rules work, show me those rules at work...but what force set those rules in place? What force holds all of it together? What force started all of this in the first place?

Science cannot and will not explain that, and for all their would-be intelligencia, the militant atheist crowd remain painfully narrow-minded and will put up walls of ignorance and crass insults at any time they're confronted with the notion that their arrogant world-view is incorrect.

I believe no specific religion is correct or incorrect. Religion, after all, is imperfect men and women attempting to somehow behold what is perfect...and so I believe everyone is seeing the same Divine force in their own way. Facets of the same jewel. I don't care much for the organized religions themselves, so much as I do the teachings...as I find any organized belief will have a great number of followers who follow it in name only.



skafather84
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12 May 2008, 11:42 pm

JimmyJazz wrote:
I accept that there is no scientific explanation as to -why- all the 'rules' of the universe hold true. They tell me how those rules work, show me those rules at work...but what force set those rules in place? What force holds all of it together? What force started all of this in the first place?



THE GOD OF THE GAPS WILL TAKE CARE OF THAT PROBLEM!!



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12 May 2008, 11:51 pm

skafather84 wrote:
JimmyJazz wrote:
I accept that there is no scientific explanation as to -why- all the 'rules' of the universe hold true. They tell me how those rules work, show me those rules at work...but what force set those rules in place? What force holds all of it together? What force started all of this in the first place?



THE GOD OF THE GAPS WILL TAKE CARE OF THAT PROBLEM!!

I don't think he was referring as much to what we still don't know (such minutiae as how exactly certain metabolic pathways may have developed and whatnot) as explanations of, for example, why F=ma. It's true, we know it's true, we can see it in action... but why does the universe operate in such a fashion that it is true? Science can't explain that (and doesn't try to). Science tells us what, and sometimes how, but never why.


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skafather84
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12 May 2008, 11:56 pm

Orwell wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
JimmyJazz wrote:
I accept that there is no scientific explanation as to -why- all the 'rules' of the universe hold true. They tell me how those rules work, show me those rules at work...but what force set those rules in place? What force holds all of it together? What force started all of this in the first place?



THE GOD OF THE GAPS WILL TAKE CARE OF THAT PROBLEM!!

I don't think he was referring as much to what we still don't know (such minutiae as how exactly certain metabolic pathways may have developed and whatnot) as explanations of, for example, why F=ma. It's true, we know it's true, we can see it in action... but why does the universe operate in such a fashion that it is true? Science can't explain that (and doesn't try to). Science tells us what, and sometimes how, but never why.



there is no why. there are no motives. existence just is. don't personify it.



oscuria
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12 May 2008, 11:57 pm

Orwell wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
JimmyJazz wrote:
I accept that there is no scientific explanation as to -why- all the 'rules' of the universe hold true. They tell me how those rules work, show me those rules at work...but what force set those rules in place? What force holds all of it together? What force started all of this in the first place?



THE GOD OF THE GAPS WILL TAKE CARE OF THAT PROBLEM!!

I don't think he was referring as much to what we still don't know (such minutiae as how exactly certain metabolic pathways may have developed and whatnot) as explanations of, for example, why F=ma. It's true, we know it's true, we can see it in action... but why does the universe operate in such a fashion that it is true? Science can't explain that (and doesn't try to). Science tells us what, and sometimes how, but never why.



Where would atheists be (in line) if "Science" began to answer the why? For now there are no answers, but what could they possibly think up? String theory? Even that is pseudoscience, No?



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13 May 2008, 12:01 am

skafather84 wrote:
there is no why. there are no motives. existence just is. don't personify it.

I wasn't personifying anything, nor ascribing motives. Why do two opposite charges attract? I know that they do, I have no clue why. I am curious. This is a question about the natural world which simply is unanswerable (as far as I know at least).


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skafather84
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13 May 2008, 12:38 am

Orwell wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
there is no why. there are no motives. existence just is. don't personify it.

I wasn't personifying anything, nor ascribing motives. Why do two opposite charges attract? I know that they do, I have no clue why. I am curious. This is a question about the natural world which simply is unanswerable (as far as I know at least).




so far it's unanswerable but things don't stay that way forever. which is what jimmyjazz was implying.



Last edited by skafather84 on 13 May 2008, 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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13 May 2008, 7:45 am

skafather84 wrote:
Orwell wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
JimmyJazz wrote:
I accept that there is no scientific explanation as to -why- all the 'rules' of the universe hold true. They tell me how those rules work, show me those rules at work...but what force set those rules in place? What force holds all of it together? What force started all of this in the first place?



THE GOD OF THE GAPS WILL TAKE CARE OF THAT PROBLEM!!

I don't think he was referring as much to what we still don't know (such minutiae as how exactly certain metabolic pathways may have developed and whatnot) as explanations of, for example, why F=ma. It's true, we know it's true, we can see it in action... but why does the universe operate in such a fashion that it is true? Science can't explain that (and doesn't try to). Science tells us what, and sometimes how, but never why.



there is no why. there are no motives. existence just is. don't personify it.


Exactly. "God" is merely an anthropomorphizing of Nature, derived from an animistic imposition of human "social reality" with it's notions of purpose, design, meaning, etc. onto a physical reality where human social psychology does not apply. This is why in another thread I referred to the notion of "God" being an insult to Nature because it debases physical reality by trying to fit it into human "social reality."


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13 May 2008, 12:31 pm

the title to this topic is true!



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13 May 2008, 1:51 pm

richardbenson wrote:
the title to this topic is true!


No it is not. Santa gives presents. I have yet to find any material worth underneath a tree.



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15 May 2008, 5:40 am

I believe in a mixture of

Buddhism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhism

Existentialism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Existentialism

and

Humanism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism

I also add my own spin to things. I think that whilst I personally do not believe in a God, Goddess, Deity or whatever, people who do should be given respect for their beliefs, because tolerance is something that is so important in this world.

I do NOT, however, support beliefs that encourage people to live what I believe to be inappropriate lives. Scientology comes near the top of my list. However, that is just my honest opinion, and I'm not going to act upon anything and deliberately hurt people, because that would make me a HUGE coward, and also a hypocrite.

As for whether or not God is like Father Christmas, well, that is a disrespectful view, in my opinion. After all, Father Christmas originates from Christianity, with Saint Nicholas being a Christian Saint. So Father Christmas is a Christian tradition, though the stories about him have been manipulated for various purposes over the years, and have turned into the commercial carnage that is Christmas as we know it, today.

For Christians, God isn't a story or something/someone make believe. He is real. Whilst people are entitled to their opinions, there should be some rain check on what they publicly express. After all, I know a lot of Christians who tolerate Atheists and their beliefs, or lack of.



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19 May 2008, 11:14 pm

Orwell wrote:
I don't think he was referring as much to what we still don't know (such minutiae as how exactly certain metabolic pathways may have developed and whatnot) as explanations of, for example, why F=ma. It's true, we know it's true, we can see it in action... but why does the universe operate in such a fashion that it is true? Science can't explain that (and doesn't try to). Science tells us what, and sometimes how, but never why.


This is exactly what I was referring to.



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20 May 2008, 2:52 pm

The_Cinephile wrote:
Anyone else hate religion and the ignorance it stands for?
I believed in God at one point in my life.
As soon as I got old enough, I realized that God was just an illusion my mind needed to rationalize the world.
I made a complete turn-around, and now that I'm an Atheist, I'm happier and healthier that ever.
I no longer worry about going to hell or screwing up my relationship with an imaginary being.
I no longer feel guilty when I do something that the church believes is wrong.
Essentially, Atheism has freed me from my spiritual bondage.
Anyone else have the same experience?
Did you ever stop to think that for some people their life without a beleif in something would be how your life was when you did believe? Life would lose it's meaning, would seem too finite, might even be too overwhelming to bear day by day. Perhaps faith frees some from mortal bondage, whereas they wouldnt get too much happiness from sleeping around or not smoking anyway?



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20 May 2008, 3:17 pm

mikebw wrote:
Yes. I didn't come to describe it like that for several years, but yes.


Quote:
Seeing resurrection from the dead firsthand kinda took away that atheist epiphany from me


Someone you knew was dead, I mean fully dead with rigimortis set in with flesh rotting and stinking, officially dead for longer than a day and put in the grave dead. And you were there to witness this rotting corpse come alive again, resurrected from the dead? And there's news recording this miracle I'm sure...

Anything less than a day isn't impressive, it happens. Now being dead three days, being embalmed and prepared for burial, and then coming back to the living, that's something I want to hear about. Do go on.


No, my dad had just been dead for a few minutes. Mom and a friend prayed over him and he came back. Of course he died later that night for good, but it was at the hospital and not in our house. He first had died sitting in his chair with his eyes open, no breathing, and no pulse.



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22 May 2008, 6:24 am

Orwell wrote:
I don't think he was referring as much to what we still don't know (such minutiae as how exactly certain metabolic pathways may have developed and whatnot) as explanations of, for example, why F=ma. It's true, we know it's true, we can see it in action... but why does the universe operate in such a fashion that it is true? Science can't explain that (and doesn't try to). Science tells us what, and sometimes how, but never why.


Yes, that's how I feel. I was Christian until about a year ago, when I realised it was just routine, habit. It didn't actually do anything for me, I couldn't understand people having religious experiences. I believe we humans have this spiritual thing inside us, the WHY of the universe. WHY are we here? For me, sometimes the spiritual thing goes off inside me but I am unable to consider the notion of the existence of a higher being.
Basically, religion tries to answer the WHY of the universe. For some people, it works. For some of those people, they can justify any evil with religion. And for other people, we just don't know. We can't comprehend the religious experiences of others.