Livni: Israeli Arabs should move to Palestine once state...

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will you shut up about jewish s**t? hating jews was banned decades ago. hating muslims is still allowed. quit playing up the victim garbage when there's real concerns about real racism and genocide.

My Gawd, you really are an idiot!

Ok, while I disagree with what Skafather84 said, some poeple have said that Europe is heading down the same road as 70+ years ago. Execpt with Muslims. Also, I think skafather84 was talking about Europe, where there are laws against hate crime.

Also, Israel ain't perfect. Collective punishment of villages, illegal annexation of land, unequal treatment of Christian & Muslims by the government, and various other types of Shenanigans, put large amounts of doubt on nara44's idea that Israel is perfect.

I was involved with the Palestine Soladarity Campaign for a while and what really became clear to me was the lack of knowledge the people of Israel had about what the govt was doing. I think people every where get a limited picture of what goes on in there own country because the media is so censored/propaganda.

The people I have met from Israel did not seem prejudiced and were very nice and the people from Palestine that I know are also nice. I think problems like this are instigated by those in power wanting more power and wealth and manipulating the people to achieve those ends.

I think it is time people stopped ethnic cleansing everywhere!

Wise idea. Unfortunately, Religious wackos will not settle for anything right now other than complete control of the area. For the record, I want a two-state solution, but lean pro-Palestinian. However, the great powers have seriously screwed up the area, especially the US, the UK, and France. I think the negotiations to end the Arab-Israeli conflict should be done by the Nordic Countries (Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, and Iceland) and Turkey. The US will follow what agreement comes out of it, and will enforce it if nesscessary.

things to come-

Every thread in every forum about Israel and/vs the Palestinians ends in a shouting match
Someone will be compared to the Nazis.
No attitudes or viewpoints will be changed.

Ok, back to work y'all...

never wrote that,
again,
misquoting and distorting other ppl ideas r not helpful and put u in the same group of the liar and demagogue who misquote livni,
i myself,as all of my friend takes an active part against all the activities u mentioned since i was a child,
your typical one dimensional take on the situation is the last thing we need here,
none of the ppl who wrote here have any idea on the situation here which is way beyond the capacity of your tiny mind

i think its time for ppl to stop lying and incite hate into a place which already have more than enough of it,
there is not ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians,
does evacuating the Gaza strip at the cost of exposing citizens to hamas rockets constituents a genocide ? one might ask of whom exactly.

Israel media is much less censored than any arab media,
in Israel,unlike any other conflicted region there is huge amount of civil rights watchers who lives in the vilages,
something u won't find in Chechnia or iraq or darfure or in any other arab country,
anything that happened anywhere is in the papers,most ppl r well informed of the situation as most ppl also serve in the army and we live very close to each other,
for those who didn't get it yet,Israel is a tiny place,20 minutes drive from the Palestinian border to the sea.

Europe as a whole is highly unlikely to descend to a ww2 level of barbarism again. Communications are too good to allow things to happen en masse in silence, and unlike Jews, Muslims have the support of many large Muslim nations, and are generally more militant than Jews were. "Mussy-baiting" might be a popular pastime, but how many Muslims have a skewed view of the west these days, that is inaccurate and based on bigotry?

Reported, I don't think that I deserve to be insulted over a disagreement. Also, you don't seem to think of Palestinians as people.

True, there is a skewed view of the west. That is because our countries are giving Saudi Arabia and there backwater hick version of Islam a pedestal by buying their oil (This goes for my country as well). Start promoting a secular Muslim country over Saudi Arabia, like Turkey. Oh, but for some bigoted reason, you will not allow an Islamic country to join the EU, or for that matter, treating Turks throughout the EU proper without prejudice (In Germany especially). I am very certain that Kosovo, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Azerbaijan, or Turkey will NOT join the European Union before 2030. All because they are Muslim. You're countries will always find a tiny issue to nitpick at. For the record, I am not some right-winger, in fact, I'm a Social Democrat by European standards. However, it seems the bigotry in Europe is the worst its been since just before the Holocaust. And, for claiming Europe is calmer now, what was going on the 90's in the Balkans? There is still instability in Europe, even if you don't want to see it.

Some of the most vocal critics of Israel are Jewish. Not all of them are anti-Zionist either.

Many South African Jews were involved in the anti-apartheid movement. One of them is a friend of my dad and quite a well known journalist. He is involved in an organisation that tries to keep Israelis and Palestinian talking. In a way there are many similarities with apartheid like the grand apartheid "homelands" with settlers encroaching and profiting, and the total control of resources and a to a certain extent petit apartheid with their own citizens.

Personally my position is that Israel was ill connived and rushed, and probably shouldn't have been allowed to happen (given that the majority of pre WII Jews were against Zionism and reactionism is never good especially if you repeat the injustices of the past). However there is no turning back the clock. It has a right to exist in some form as does Palestine.

There main problem is a practical one. Namely the ingredient necessary to become a nation, and the fact the gaza doesn’t have that all an never will unless some major changes are made. It can't be another Bangladesh, it can't be a tax free haven or "kingdom". Both side need to wake up tot hat fact. Or at least stop pretending. This means the border will have to be renegotiated some what, to get some continuity. I can't see it happen with out some turnstile or buffer area. But that needn't be too large.

I was not attacking Israel nor insighting hatred toward it. ( Isaid the people from Israel I knew were very nice)

Ethnic cleansing does not just mean killing but also means forced repatriation, such as what happened in South Oestia to Georgians. (I said ethnic cleansing everywhere, meaning the world)

I think that all media is censored by the government in its favour. (meaning media in all countries)

I dont think it is a good idea to compare Israel with arab countries/media as that is antagonistic rather than helpful.

I think it is obviously very sad and creates pain for many people.

I hope people can move forward like they have in northern ireland and south africa.

a big problem there is the settlements in the west bank and the way that israel has divided gaza and west bank and yet hold both accountable for the others' actions. gaza has become far more removed and more reactionary than west bank though the west bank has seen more acts of settlers attacking palestinian farmers. the west bank ends up paying the price with occupation.

Who said I can't see bigotry or instability? That is my whole point. Events like genocide are observed by the world, and tried by the world. In the forties it was possible to murder millions and hide it, through poor communications. There isn't a place in Europe that lacks access to a vast amount of media.. most of it completely uncontrolled or regulated by national interests. Trying to hide the slaughter of millions would be nigh on impossible.

Kosovo, Bosnia & Herzegovina are not Muslim nations, which I seem to recall was half the issue in the 90s. The very mixed and unstable nature of those areas of the world make them an unsafe bet for entry into the EU.... And Turkey? Allowing Turkey in would open the gates for even more uncontrolled mass-immigration, and the infrastructure of most European nations simply will not withstand such a thing. I very much doubt they are disallowed simply because they are Muslim. As for Muslim prejudice against the west... it has little to do with what the Saudis are doing or how much oil they have. How WE view Saudi Arabia changes nothing about how everyone else views us.

And personally, I dont think we as a nation should have anything to do with the EU or its federalisation plans.

Kosovo is 90% Muslim. Bosnia is plurality Muslim, at 45%. And why would Turkey being part of the EU cause more illegal immigration? They already come through there now. So, by your logic, Turkey should be denied entry, because the EU is too incompetant to actually control their own borders? (For the record, I say the same about the US.) It sounds like a cop out to me.

Oh, and you, I think, are very nieve to suggest that somehow Genocide will be stopped by information. It took 3 years for the western world to stop a genocide by the generally unliked country of Serbia. You going to tell me that some of the most liked countries will go against each other to stop one from doing genocide? Europe has a long and bloody history of scape-goating a specific ethnic or religious group of people with disturbing consequences. And, the pattern seems to be starting again with Muslims. And the Saudi thing I was refering to earlier? What I was saying is that by buying oil from them, you are allowing Saudi Arabia to promote an explicitly Anti-Western version of Islam. If you don't like what you are seeing in terms of radicalization, stop buying oil from them and start supporting the local versions of Islam, the most extreme example being Oman's version.