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androbot01
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16 Mar 2017, 4:31 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Conservative thinking on health care....
Image

Liberal thinking on health care ...
Image


I'm not sure I understand why not having access to healthcare is a freedom.
I would think it would be the opposite. You have to be healthy before you can be free.

The sugar daddy concept is not a good metaphor as people do pay into state health care in the form of taxes or premiums or whatever. I think people get irked by the idea of paying into something they don't use. Young people are, of course, invincible and will live forever, so why should they pay? In Canada no one thinks this way, everyone knows that one day they will need health care.



Shahunshah
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16 Mar 2017, 4:37 am

androbot01 wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Conservative thinking on health care....
Image

Liberal thinking on health care ...
Image


I'm not sure I understand why not having access to healthcare is a freedom.
I would think it would be the opposite. You have to be healthy before you can be free.

The sugar daddy concept is not a good metaphor as people do pay into state health care in the form of taxes or premiums or whatever. I think people get irked by the idea of paying into something they don't use. Young people are, of course, invincible and will live forever, so why should they pay? In Canada no one thinks this way, everyone knows that one day they will need health care.
Maybe. I do wonder however if the USA would be more open if the country wasn't been faced with immense debt.



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16 Mar 2017, 5:00 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Freedom to starve.
And as far as the right's concept of freedom is concerned, it's failed because so many business people - who tend to be conservative - are too miserly to employ more people, and provide good wages and benefits. Far too many business leaders see what they do as nothing but a get-rich-quick-scheme, with absolutely no interest in helping their fellow citizens.

So, you claim to know the greater good ?


If that means providing everyone with medical care, then yes, I do.


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16 Mar 2017, 5:06 am

adifferentname wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Freedom to starve.


Freedom to starve or the freedom not to be fed by force? Should I assume you're in favour of mandatory coverage from this statement?

Have you noticed how that's actually about liberty rather than change or lack thereof? I would have thought the word "freedom" something of a clue.

Quote:
And as far as the right's concept of freedom is concerned, it's failed because so many business people - who tend to be conservative - are too miserly to employ more people, and provide good wages and benefits. Far too many business leaders see what they do as nothing but a get-rich-quick-scheme, with absolutely no interest in helping their fellow citizens.


What an incredibly bigoted perspective you have, grandma.

Running a successful business requires efficient use of resources. Hiring additional staff willy-nilly due to a misplaced sense of altruism would be a great way of screwing up the lives of everyone who works for your company.

People who run successful businesses help their fellow citizens a great deal more than you manage to with your unfounded rhetoric and gross generalisations about the motivations and mindset of "typically conservative business people".


So letting people starve in the name of freedom is somehow a good thing? I fail to see the humanity in that. I'd rather care about my fellow humans then have such a total lack of empathy.
Sure, there are decent business people around. But there are also plenty of rat bastards who want to get a maximum degree of work out of labor in return for as minimal pay as possible.
And Grandma? Seriously? You do know I'm a guy, don't you?


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Kraichgauer
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16 Mar 2017, 5:08 am

SpiceWolf wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
And the only handiwork you've accomplished is showing the hypocrisy of the right - you'll preach about how much you're for family values, but if means you have to lighten your wallet to help families in need, then your cries of family values become screeches of "leach! parasite! deadbeat!"


Image

I like this cartoon, it kind of nails it.


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Absolutely true!


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16 Mar 2017, 8:03 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
adifferentname wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Freedom to starve.


Freedom to starve or the freedom not to be fed by force? Should I assume you're in favour of mandatory coverage from this statement?

Have you noticed how that's actually about liberty rather than change or lack thereof? I would have thought the word "freedom" something of a clue.

Quote:
And as far as the right's concept of freedom is concerned, it's failed because so many business people - who tend to be conservative - are too miserly to employ more people, and provide good wages and benefits. Far too many business leaders see what they do as nothing but a get-rich-quick-scheme, with absolutely no interest in helping their fellow citizens.


What an incredibly bigoted perspective you have, grandma.

Running a successful business requires efficient use of resources. Hiring additional staff willy-nilly due to a misplaced sense of altruism would be a great way of screwing up the lives of everyone who works for your company.

People who run successful businesses help their fellow citizens a great deal more than you manage to with your unfounded rhetoric and gross generalisations about the motivations and mindset of "typically conservative business people".


So letting people starve in the name of freedom is somehow a good thing? I fail to see the humanity in that. I'd rather care about my fellow humans then have such a total lack of empathy.
Sure, there are decent business people around. But there are also plenty of rat bastards who want to get a maximum degree of work out of labor in return for as minimal pay as possible.
And Grandma? Seriously? You do know I'm a guy, don't you?


Why are the starving supposed to be the sole burden of the callous conservative ceo? There are millions of wealthy liberals out there. Why aren't they feeding the hungry? You act like the only people in business and financial power are conservatives and all the liberals live in huts in communes. Why haven't all you altruistic champions of humanity pulled together and ended hunger already? President Obama accrued nearly 10 trillion dollars of debt in 8 years, how much of that fed the starving?



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16 Mar 2017, 9:20 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
So letting people starve in the name of freedom is somehow a good thing? I fail to see the humanity in that. I'd rather care about my fellow humans then have such a total lack of empathy.


Have you heard of Bobby Sands?

Quote:
Sure, there are decent business people around. But there are also plenty of rat bastards who want to get a maximum degree of work out of labor in return for as minimal pay as possible.


And you, of course, have access to a list of their voting history, or perhaps a manifesto of their political aims in support of your claim that they "tend to be conservative"? I think that's a little disrespectful to our conservative chums here on WP, don't you?

Quote:
And Grandma? Seriously? You do know I'm a guy, don't you?


You aren't familiar with the tale of Little Red Riding Hood? Were you raised by wolves?

I believe the current trend is not to make such assumptions about people. For all I know, you identify as a Latvian lap-dancer.



Kraichgauer
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16 Mar 2017, 1:58 pm

EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
adifferentname wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Freedom to starve.


Freedom to starve or the freedom not to be fed by force? Should I assume you're in favour of mandatory coverage from this statement?

Have you noticed how that's actually about liberty rather than change or lack thereof? I would have thought the word "freedom" something of a clue.

Quote:
And as far as the right's concept of freedom is concerned, it's failed because so many business people - who tend to be conservative - are too miserly to employ more people, and provide good wages and benefits. Far too many business leaders see what they do as nothing but a get-rich-quick-scheme, with absolutely no interest in helping their fellow citizens.


What an incredibly bigoted perspective you have, grandma.

Running a successful business requires efficient use of resources. Hiring additional staff willy-nilly due to a misplaced sense of altruism would be a great way of screwing up the lives of everyone who works for your company.

People who run successful businesses help their fellow citizens a great deal more than you manage to with your unfounded rhetoric and gross generalisations about the motivations and mindset of "typically conservative business people".


So letting people starve in the name of freedom is somehow a good thing? I fail to see the humanity in that. I'd rather care about my fellow humans then have such a total lack of empathy.
Sure, there are decent business people around. But there are also plenty of rat bastards who want to get a maximum degree of work out of labor in return for as minimal pay as possible.
And Grandma? Seriously? You do know I'm a guy, don't you?


Why are the starving supposed to be the sole burden of the callous conservative ceo? There are millions of wealthy liberals out there. Why aren't they feeding the hungry? You act like the only people in business and financial power are conservatives and all the liberals live in huts in communes. Why haven't all you altruistic champions of humanity pulled together and ended hunger already? President Obama accrued nearly 10 trillion dollars of debt in 8 years, how much of that fed the starving?


My original point a few posts back had been, yes, the government does have a responsibility to care for the needy, as the wealthy, regardless of party ideology, hardly do enough in hiring people.
And that 10 billion dollar debt that that you lay at Obama's feet was in large part him taking responsibility for Bush's Iraqi blunder, which that former President had kept off the books in large part during his presidency.


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16 Mar 2017, 2:02 pm

adifferentname wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
So letting people starve in the name of freedom is somehow a good thing? I fail to see the humanity in that. I'd rather care about my fellow humans then have such a total lack of empathy.


Have you heard of Bobby Sands?

Quote:
Sure, there are decent business people around. But there are also plenty of rat bastards who want to get a maximum degree of work out of labor in return for as minimal pay as possible.


And you, of course, have access to a list of their voting history, or perhaps a manifesto of their political aims in support of your claim that they "tend to be conservative"? I think that's a little disrespectful to our conservative chums here on WP, don't you?

Quote:
And Grandma? Seriously? You do know I'm a guy, don't you?


You aren't familiar with the tale of Little Red Riding Hood? Were you raised by wolves?

I believe the current trend is not to make such assumptions about people. For all I know, you identify as a Latvian lap-dancer.


I have known business people in my day, and few if any were anything but conservative.
And Latvian belly dancer? ... Okay, you learned my secret.
Raised by wolves? Got me there, again.


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16 Mar 2017, 2:34 pm

nurseangela wrote:
Lukeda420 wrote:
Hey Angela,

I'm curious since you want to get into the healthcare industry, how do you feel about 24 million people losing their insurance and the tens of thousands of deaths that will result due to Trumpcare?


I've already been in healthcare for 15 yrs. It has never been as bad as with Obamacare - I even lost my doctor. I even had to go without insurance because I couldn't afford Obamacare when I lost my job. I see anything as an improvement.



Lot of people still didn't have health insurance before Obamacare because they could not afford it. Then that came out and they made it a requirement and it was supposed to be affordable but people still fell between the cracks. That part pissed me off and the fact they still make you pay and make it required but yet it doesn't include everything. I believe in universal healthcare. UK has it, Canada, Australia. I thought Obamacare was going to be that but boy was I wrong when my husband had to shop for health insurance when he lost his job and I had anxiety because of money (I have money anxiety and do not like change in my finances and bills) and I was so pissed but luckily he qualified for free Obamacare. But then he lost it when he went on Medicare, he should have kept Obamacare because Medicare isn't free (only $100 a month and they take it out of your social security check) and he was paying nothing for Obamacare. I can totally understand why people would be angry about it and it hurt smaller businesses and made it harder for some families. Those who don't get it are the ones who are wealthy and don't need to worry about costs because they make so much money to afford it. My parents don't get it because they make so much money and my mom thinks it's just people whining because they don't want to change their lifestyle and get rid of some things like cable or Netflix or any sport packs on their cable or don't want to eat out less, etc. But what about us and our limited income? She didn't think about people in our position, those with disabilities and stuff. But like I say my husband qualified for free Obamacare.


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Fugu
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16 Mar 2017, 3:26 pm

League_Girl wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
Lukeda420 wrote:
Hey Angela,

I'm curious since you want to get into the healthcare industry, how do you feel about 24 million people losing their insurance and the tens of thousands of deaths that will result due to Trumpcare?


I've already been in healthcare for 15 yrs. It has never been as bad as with Obamacare - I even lost my doctor. I even had to go without insurance because I couldn't afford Obamacare when I lost my job. I see anything as an improvement.



Lot of people still didn't have health insurance before Obamacare because they could not afford it. Then that came out and they made it a requirement and it was supposed to be affordable but people still fell between the cracks. That part pissed me off and the fact they still make you pay and make it required but yet it doesn't include everything. I believe in universal healthcare. UK has it, Canada, Australia. I thought Obamacare was going to be that but boy was I wrong when my husband had to shop for health insurance when he lost his job and I had anxiety because of money (I have money anxiety and do not like change in my finances and bills) and I was so pissed but luckily he qualified for free Obamacare. But then he lost it when he went on Medicare, he should have kept Obamacare because Medicare isn't free (only $100 a month and they take it out of your social security check) and he was paying nothing for Obamacare. I can totally understand why people would be angry about it and it hurt smaller businesses and made it harder for some families. Those who don't get it are the ones who are wealthy and don't need to worry about costs because they make so much money to afford it. My parents don't get it because they make so much money and my mom thinks it's just people whining because they don't want to change their lifestyle and get rid of some things like cable or Netflix or any sport packs on their cable or don't want to eat out less, etc. But what about us and our limited income? She didn't think about people in our position, those with disabilities and stuff. But like I say my husband qualified for free Obamacare.
you're blaming the ACA for what the insurance companies(aka the people who set the prices paid) have been doing to protect their bottom lines.



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16 Mar 2017, 4:10 pm

Our little fish friend is back! :D
I'd feared that you'd been caught in a gill net.


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16 Mar 2017, 4:14 pm

Raptor wrote:
Our little fish friend is back! :D
I'd feared that you'd been caught in a gill net.
it's a good thing you're not a fisherman, seeing how you can't catch pufferfish with a gill net.



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16 Mar 2017, 5:18 pm

comparing penis size who donates the most is great, though the fact that charity is required is a signpost of an immoral society.



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16 Mar 2017, 5:22 pm

Fugu wrote:
comparing penis size who donates the most is great, though the fact that charity is required is a signpost of an immoral society.


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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16 Mar 2017, 5:38 pm

So I notice Flynn was paid by Russian state television for an appearance on state television.

Quote:
The House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform released documents obtained during its inquiry into Flynn’s activities in the months before Trump appointed him as national security adviser. The files showed that Russia’s RT network – designated by the U.S. intelligence community as a propaganda arm for Russia’s government – also paid for luxury hotel stays and other expenses incurred by Flynn and his adult son, Michael Flynn Jr., during the Moscow trip.


Globe & Mail: Russian interests paid thousands for Flynn appearances: documents

And in other news, still no proof of "wiretapping."