Page 13 of 20 [ 309 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 ... 20  Next

Skilpadde
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Dec 2008
Age: 47
Gender: Female
Posts: 27,019

01 Sep 2009, 4:51 am

mgran wrote:
He wasn't autistic, or aspergers... I've noticed "Hitler was a..." is used quite a lot by folks who want to attack the missing noun. For the record, he wasn't a vegetarian either (despite rumours, his personal cook confirmed that was a myth that he thought made him look cool) and he wasn't a Christian. Or a Jew. (I've heard that one argued as well.)


Yeah, I heard that one, too. His great grandfather was Jewish (or was it grandfather?) and so he saw his father as Jewish. Hitler felt abused by his father and so he hated Jews. I've also heard that it was an argument with Wittgenstein when they were both in junior high that made him antisemittic.



TheDoctor82
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,400
Location: Sandusky, Ohio

01 Sep 2009, 6:02 am

No, usually Autistic folks know better than to directly tell the whole world in full anger on stage what they're thinking...not to mention the brilliant calculation of having 90% of your army wiped out in Soviet Russia.....

Oh yeah, aren't we also extremely loyal to our allies? Do ya see where this is going?



bluerose
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

User avatar

Joined: 9 Aug 2009
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 215
Location: The Baltics

01 Sep 2009, 6:15 am

Wow..I do wonder where ppl here get their information from. I don't think there are any sources on Hitler one could truly trust, as far as theories about his behaviour go. Everybody has got their viewpoint and agenda. He was a very controversial figure, probs the most controversial in history. I, for one, do think he had Asperger's. It shows in his eyes, he had the aspie stare. No other disorder has it's own stare like that. I don't think he was a sociopath because he was NOT charming. And his nature was practically seethrough, you could see how messed up he was by looking at his speeches. It was very straightforward. I can't even imagine how he ever got elected. I suppose he played on the anger that all Germans had back then about their situation. Also, I'm related to someone that reminds me of him and he definately has Asperger's. I don't see how there's any point to denying it, it's not like the disorder made him evil, that was just his nature, he would've been evil even if he hadn't had Aspergers.



TheDoctor82
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,400
Location: Sandusky, Ohio

01 Sep 2009, 6:21 am

bluerose wrote:
Wow..I do wonder where ppl here get their information from. I don't think there are any sources on Hitler one could truly trust, as far as theories about his behaviour go. Everybody has got their viewpoint and agenda. He was a very controversial figure, probs the most controversial in history. I, for one, do think he had Asperger's. It shows in his eyes, he had the aspie stare. No other disorder has it's own stare like that. I don't think he was a sociopath because he was NOT charming. And his nature was practically seethrough, you could see how messed up he was by looking at his speeches. It was very straightforward. I can't even imagine how he ever got elected. I suppose he played on the anger that all Germans had back then about their situation. Also, I'm related to someone that reminds me of him and he definately has Asperger's. I don't see how there's any point to denying it, it's not like the disorder made him evil, that was just his nature, he would've been evil even if he hadn't had Aspergers.


Yah um....he didn't get elected. He lost the election; then Hindenburg felt sorry for him, gave him half his power, and Hitler just kicked the guy out.

Like I said...I don't see him being Autistic.

Most controversial in history? That's so 20th century.

The only difference between he and the majority of other blood-thirsty dictators & tyrants( most of them also being actually smart, and well-calculating, other than utterly half-@$$ing it, & having their own folks turn against them) was that he was stupid enough to show his true colors at all times. If he and Stalin had been involved in a poker game with every other dictator of the 20th century, Hitler would be the first to be screaming & yelling to everyone how he had a full house, rather than doing the smart thing of not showing his hand.



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

01 Sep 2009, 6:54 am

Stinkypuppy wrote:
There's something about AS that makes me think that as Aspies we are capable of being the most courageous, awesome heroes, or the most terrible villains known to mankind... but it's what we learn and experience along the way that determines which outcome of the two we end up. We have a lot of power, which can be used for immense benefit to everyone... or detriment. I think that people in general (and NTs in particular) fear that power, not necessarily because the power is evil, but because the risk of abuse of that power is so great, and the tremendous precedent for abuse compared to benevolent use.

Partly why there are so few real life heroes these days, at a time when I think we need them the most...

... we're just like X-Men!! 8)


Hell yes, i've always considered myself some kind of unnoticed hero sometimes rising to protect my students from their s***** teacher's grasp 8). Being an outsidah is awesome, you get to experience many different and cool things nt's can't, i try to be as couragerous as possible so i can protest against the society :P



PlatedDrake
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,365
Location: Piedmont Region, NC, USA

01 Sep 2009, 6:55 am

Believe it or not, a co-worker i worked with some years ago whose friend has a more severe case of Autism (forgot the specific name) and was obsessed with WW II. From what he found, Hitler didnt have AS. Rather, he suffered from something like irritable bowel syndrome and he took arsenic for it. That resulted in his insanity.



2ukenkerl
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Jul 2007
Age: 63
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,242

01 Sep 2009, 7:11 am

PlatedDrake wrote:
Believe it or not, a co-worker i worked with some years ago whose friend has a more severe case of Autism (forgot the specific name) and was obsessed with WW II. From what he found, Hitler didnt have AS. Rather, he suffered from something like irritable bowel syndrome and he took arsenic for it. That resulted in his insanity.


I don't know about that, but there is a TON of evidence that he had PARKINSONS. He was NUTS! He probably was NOT autistic, and he certainly didn't havee AS.



engineer
Hummingbird
Hummingbird

User avatar

Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 19

01 Sep 2009, 7:29 am

This seems to stir up quite a discussion.

I was struck by the similarities between Hitler's behaviour and indications of asperger, without knowing other already had discussed whether Hitler was asperger. It seemed obvious.

It is also difficult to dismiss this, by stating that it is impossible to give a reliable diagnosis. Walter C. Langer led a study of Hitler's psychology based on interviews with a large number of people who had met him. This is probably at least as good as the information a psychiatrist can get during a few interviews with a person. The interesting thing is, that when this study was made, asperger was not known, but the facts in the study fit asperger better than the diagnosis Langer arrived at.

At the same time, there is nothing in Langer's study that definitely rules out that Hitler was asperger.

This means, that we somehow must find out how to cope with the fact, that a large number of people may find arguments which support that Hitler had asperger.

I agree with Stinkypuppy who wrote:

Quote:
There's something about AS that makes me think that as Aspies we are capable of being the most courageous, awesome heroes, or the most terrible villains known to mankind... but it's what we learn and experience along the way that determines which outcome of the two we end up. We have a lot of power, which can be used for immense benefit to everyone... or detriment.


Hitler grew up in a home with a drinking and violent father and felt neglected by his classmates. he lived part of his youth in the down and out slums of Vienna, and was a soldier in World War One. This can explain a lot of his anger and hate, and without these experiences he would probably have turned out differently.

However, his strange behaviour, and his strong belief in his own destiny, can be explained by his asperger. Even more disturbing, his hatred of jews may partly be attributed to his asperger. It is possible that he hit on that as an explanation because it was simpler than a political or economical explanation of the problems of him and the society in general. There was nothing in his childhood and his early years that might point to why he started to hate jews.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

01 Sep 2009, 10:22 am

engineer wrote:

However, his strange behaviour, and his strong belief in his own destiny, can be explained by his asperger. Even more disturbing, his hatred of jews may partly be attributed to his asperger. It is possible that he hit on that as an explanation because it was simpler than a political or economical explanation of the problems of him and the society in general. There was nothing in his childhood and his early years that might point to why he started to hate jews.

It doesn't because Hitler wasn't the only antisemite around Europe at the time and other Nazi officials were MUCH more antisemitic than he. He was mild compared to some of them. How do you explain the other antisemites who were worse?
He wrote Mein Kampf to make money and gain popularity which explains why it was so antisemitic. Pardon me, but you need to do some reading up on the entire Nazi movement and the people who made up the Reich before you assume Hitler was the only antisemite therefore he MUST have Asperger's



SpongeBobRocksMao
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Oct 2008
Age: 31
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,774
Location: SpongeBob's Pineapple (England really!)

01 Sep 2009, 10:44 am

I definitely don't think so. Hitler didn't appear to have difficulty socialising, and he didn't seem to have obsessions or the other AS traits. Plus, if he did have Asperger's, it would have appeared in the news or on the web. I've heard Albert Einstein and Isaac Newton may have had Asperger's, but not Hitler.


_________________
Who lives in a pineapple under the sea?
SpongeBobRocksMao!
Absorbent and yellow and porous is he!
SpongeBobRocksMao!


Skilpadde
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Dec 2008
Age: 47
Gender: Female
Posts: 27,019

01 Sep 2009, 10:53 am

Antisemitism was very common in the 1930's. Here in Norway we have an old ex-politician, Jo Benkow, who once claimed that the articles that appeared in Norwegian news papers in the 30's were so anti-Jewish that he himself had become an antisemite had he not been Jewish.



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

01 Sep 2009, 10:58 am

Hitler is the result of having an abusive childhood+being an aspie. MIchael jackson had a similiar childhood, so have many other people, but they have hardly become mad. I have read a book about an old man who have had a father who beat him with his fists, thrown him in the wall, called him disguisting things, raped his mom in front of his eyes, tried to drown him..... He didn't become a mad one, he became nice, but if you have AS and get treated bad, you can end up like hitla.



Locustman
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Age: 54
Gender: Male
Posts: 277
Location: London, UK.

01 Sep 2009, 11:09 am

No.

Next question.



bluerose
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

User avatar

Joined: 9 Aug 2009
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 215
Location: The Baltics

01 Sep 2009, 11:28 am

Quote:
Yah um....he didn't get elected. He lost the election; then Hindenburg felt sorry for him, gave him half his power, and Hitler just kicked the guy out.

Like I said...I don't see him being Autistic.

Most controversial in history? That's so 20th century.

The only difference between he and the majority of other blood-thirsty dictators & tyrants( most of them also being actually smart, and well-calculating, other than utterly half-@$$ing it, & having their own folks turn against them) was that he was stupid enough to show his true colors at all times. If he and Stalin had been involved in a poker game with every other dictator of the 20th century, Hitler would be the first to be screaming & yelling to everyone how he had a full house, rather than doing the smart thing of not showing his hand.


Like it or not, no other figure in history has been as hated as Hitler. And that showing the true colors thing is exactly why I think he was an aspie- he wasn't capable of faking it, as opposed to a sociopath for example. He was pretty much the opposite of charming most of the time. He was a freak. And the fact that he liked going on tirades about his own favourite subjects is very aspielike, also I read that he had special interests and wasn't interested in small talk... I'm pretty convinced quite frankly. That and the abusive backround would pretty much explain everything.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

01 Sep 2009, 11:47 am

bluerose wrote:
Quote:
Yah um....he didn't get elected. He lost the election; then Hindenburg felt sorry for him, gave him half his power, and Hitler just kicked the guy out.

Like I said...I don't see him being Autistic.

Most controversial in history? That's so 20th century.

The only difference between he and the majority of other blood-thirsty dictators & tyrants( most of them also being actually smart, and well-calculating, other than utterly half-@$$ing it, & having their own folks turn against them) was that he was stupid enough to show his true colors at all times. If he and Stalin had been involved in a poker game with every other dictator of the 20th century, Hitler would be the first to be screaming & yelling to everyone how he had a full house, rather than doing the smart thing of not showing his hand.


Like it or not, no other figure in history has been as hated as Hitler. And that showing the true colors thing is exactly why I think he was an aspie- he wasn't capable of faking it, as opposed to a sociopath for example. He was pretty much the opposite of charming most of the time. He was a freak. And the fact that he liked going on tirades about his own favourite subjects is very aspielike, also I read that he had special interests and wasn't interested in small talk... I'm pretty convinced quite frankly. That and the abusive backround would pretty much explain everything.

But we don't know if he was really a freak. If he was a maniac why was he the leader of the Nazi party? You have to use some logic. A maniac is not going to gain the confidence of millions of people. It doesn't work that way. He was saner than most think...the evidence points to that. He wasn't that different than other Germans of the time. People were more abusive, in general, back then. He might have not ranted and raved more than most others ranted and raved. It was a sign of the times. You have to compare him to his peers, not to people of today. He could have been more like them than you realize. In fact, his speeches and persona delivering them were designed to personify the stereotypical German father so the volke would identify them with the father who was the ultimate figurehead and authority in their psyche. They were more likely to listen to that type of delivery and be swayed which is why he spoke in that manic, forceful, charismatic way.
It's unlikely he had Aperger's because he wasn't disabled. His political career and success as head of state proves he wasn't disabled. But there's going to be some people who will insist he was because of his manic style of talking which wasn't uncommon back then. It's kind of like a wrestler. Would you say wrestlers all have AS because they talk in a forceful, yelling tone of voice to excite their viewers so they will be all pumped and ready to watch wrestling and want to tune in again?
Saying that people with AS who have abusive childhoods will end up like Hitler is an inaccurate, gross oversimplification and very misleading. For one thing, Hitler was only a figurehead and wasn't even the worse Nazi of all. The Nazi bureaucracy was far worse and the ones who were actually responsible for the sick policies. The entire system was to blame, not just one man. Are you going to say the entire system was so messed up because of AS? Perhaps not.



ascan
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Feb 2005
Age: 54
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,194
Location: Taunton/Aberdeen

01 Sep 2009, 12:15 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
...If he was a maniac why was he the leader of the Nazi party? You have to use some logic. A maniac is not going to gain the confidence of millions of people. It doesn't work that way. He was saner than most think...


This is very true. Most people still believe the 1940s allied propaganda. That's very damaging for humanity as a whole because it gives people a false sense of security. Before we know it, despotism will have creeped up on us once again because we're looking in the wrong place.