Are you a Taoists ???

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Thanks a lot for the information! It's helped me understand a lot. I plan to take Tai Chi (Wu, I think) lessons, I believe there's a school near my home.

Well, Quran and Koran are both considered correct, as the "Q" sound in it does not exist in English. It's a heavy glottal sound.

I'm interested in your Qi book. Where can I acquire a copy?

It’s a nice book. I got it at a Book Warehouse sale. They often have odds and ends, remainders and such so I'm not sure where to get it.

It’s called: Reflections on Qi: Tuning your life to the world’s hidden energy and its by Gary Khor.

Khan_Sama

I liked the Muslim stand up guy Ali Baba,
I think it's true we should judge religions by what they teach not by the words and actions of misguided followers.
Even Taoism in China became misguided (in my opinion) and obsessed with prolonging life and alchemy etc.
I guess all prophets, sages and wise men must start of knowing the Tao in some way and then their words are taken by followers and become canonised and institutionalised till the true meaning is lost to most followers who then follow dead ritual and dogma.
Lao Tzu saw this and tried to explain it:

1. THE EMBODIMENT OF TAO
Even the finest teaching is not the Tao itself.
Even the finest name is insufficient to define it.
Without words, the Tao can be experienced,
and without a name, it can be known.

To conduct one's life according to the Tao,
is to conduct one's life without regrets;
to realize that potential within oneself
which is of benefit to all.

Though words or names are not required
to live one's life this way,
to describe it, words and names are used,
that we might better clarify
the way of which we speak,
without confusing it with other ways
in which an individual might choose to live.

Through knowledge, intellectual thought and words,
the manifestations of the Tao are known,
but without such intellectual intent
we might experience the Tao itself.

Both knowledge and experience are real,
but reality has many forms,
which seem to cause complexity.

By using the means appropriate,
we extend ourselves beyond
the barriers of such complexity,
and so experience the Tao.

Has anybody seen the work of artist Alex Grey?
I find him truly inspirational.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08R8tgvX ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_f5905BuE4c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ihro0MMryI4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZddAjRtACM&NR=1

Last edited by Pixel8 on 31 Mar 2008, 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

Ever heard Goa Gil?
I like him to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=380iqaMM ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7udF30fb ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udp6A7Tt ... re=related

Pixel8: That was a GREAT version of Chapter One.

Please guys!! When you quote the Tao te Ching include the translation you are using. When I see a particularly interesting interpretation of one of the chapters, I want to read the other 80 in the same translation.

I use Gia-Fu Feng and Jane English most of the tme. I also like Stephen Mitchell, also Thomas Cleary; also Chang Chung-yuan (who relates the Tao te Ching to Heidigger's "On Time and Being."

Yes, manifest reality does have many forms!! !

I agree Bobby1933,

It's Stan Rosenthal's translation, found in full here:

http://www.religiousworlds.com/taoism/ttcstan3.html#80

Thanks, I will ask the employees of Crosswords bookstore to order it, Amazon's prices are way too expensive for most Indian's budgets. ><



Heh, Ali Baba is way too hillarious. I can't wait for his movie to be released.

Yes, what you say is quite correct, and corresponds with the Islamic view on other religions being distorted. However, I believe philosophical taoists don't follow the religious rites, rather, I they follow the Tao as a way of life, and I too see Islam as a way of life. I do see a lot of conflict however, such as sexuality in Taoism vs sexuality in Islam. I was wondering, although there are no statistics for the number of Taoists, are there more philosophical Taoists?

Strangely, most Chinese expats living in my city (there are a few owning Chinese resteraunts) seem to follow Buddhism and worship traditional Chinese deities. I haven't come across any Taoist symbols anywhere in the resteraunts.

Btw, citizendium.org does not have any article on Taoism, although it has articles on Lao Tzu and the Tao Te Ching. Anyone interested in writing an article on it in the future? I would, if my research on Taoism is sufficient enough, and I don't see that being a possibility for many months.

Khan_Sama wrote

I have no idea how many philosophical Taoists there are in the world, I know it's growing in the West where there is a growing thirst for something less materialistic and more (dare I say) "spiritual" in peoples lives.

I don't believe Lao Tzu intended us to become Taoists when he wrote it.
Like the story of the finger pointing to the moon, that we should not look at the finger but follow where it is pointing and so see the moon for ourselves.

It is my personal belief that we should strive to rise above "isms" even Tao-ism and see that all the great prophets and sages were trying to return us to a state of enlightenment and peace with ourselves and the universal conciousness. The problem is that we make judgements and divisions based on what we see as right and wrong. As you are a Muslim I will explain what I mean like this.

The story about Adam and Eve says the apple gave them knowledge of good and evil and they lost their state of oneness with the garden. They had no shame in their sexuality or any inequality between the two sexes before this. We should strive not to make judgements of other people because right and wrong are relative terms.

Please bear in mind this my personal understanding and not true of all Taoists, as a human being I am right and wrong depending on who you are.

Anyway I am waffling, here's what Lao Tzu said:

2
When people see some things as beautiful,
other things become ugly.
When people see some things as good,
other things become bad.

Being and non-being create each other.
Difficult and easy support each other.
Long and short define each other.
High and low depend on each other.
Before and after follow each other.

Therefore the Master
acts without doing anything
and teaches without saying anything.
Things arise and she lets them come;
things disappear and she lets them go.
She has but doesn't possess,
acts but doesn't expect.
When her work is done, she forgets it.
That is why it lasts forever.

Each has guardian angels before him and behind him, who watch him by God’s command.

- The Koran


There is a being, wonderful, perfect;
It existed before heaven and earth.
How quiet it is!
How spiritual it is!
It stands alone and it does not change.
It moves around and around, but does not on this account suffer.
All life comes from it.
It wraps around everything with its love as a garment,
And yet it claims no honor, for it does not demand to be Lord.
I do not know its name, and so I call it Tao, the Way,
And rejoice in its power.

Lau -tzu

What a wonderful philosophy! I must finish reading the Tao Te Ching. ^^

Btw, was the Tao Te Ching originally written in vernacular Chinese? If not, which form of Chinese? Which is the earliest surviving copy? Sorry if my questions seem a little strange...I'm just curious. ^^;;

Ma-wang-tui (silk scrolls) and Fu I (the base of most Tao translations) manuscripts were comprised around the late third century B.C. and before. These ancient texts are compiled with archaic chinese that contain many characters that seem foreign to todays chinese ideographs. The copy I read was written by Victor H. Mair made after 1973, lead by the excavation of the the silk scrolls and past further interpretational translations.

Well my giving up smoking is going well
and I'm free of alcohol and other naughties
I study the Tao and I Ching all day
my mind and body are feeling healthier
but I still can't seem to get down to any actual meditation
Still, It's early days.

All things are hard before they're easy.

15.
Do you have the patience to wait
till your mud settles and the water is clear?
Can you remain unmoving
till the right action arises by itself?

16.
Empty your mind of all thoughts.
Let your heart be at peace.
Watch the turmoil of beings,
but contemplate their return.

Each separate being in the universe
returns to the common source.
Returning to the source is serenity.

If you don't realize the source,
you stumble in confusion and sorrow.

Hey, I'm trying to quit smoking too!
Awesome!

If you need help meditating, I have some pointers.

I need all the help I can get.

I have done my first attempt today though, no amazing insights but I did feel very peaceful afterwards. I guess I just have to persist.

Yeah, it takes a while to make a good routine.
Some tension releasing exercises might make it easier.

The meditation thread:

here