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just-me
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18 Jun 2009, 9:28 pm

carturo222 wrote:
just-me wrote:
Ah, but you see the people we see are not really "bad" people they just have problems. But most of the time we cant see that from where we stand.

(...)

The awful person serves as an example , to show us why we should be good people. If we had not suffered at an awful persons hand then we could not relate to the pain of others and therefor we would feel no remorse for hurting others.

(...)

Both are needed to create good in the world.


The rationality (and cost-efficiency) of drawing good from our endurance of and opposition to evil eludes me.


Well there is another aspect to this .
Man has free will .
This means he has the ability to choose to be good or evil.

It would not be very kind to create a being unable to do anything without the permission of his creator.

I do not believe god created us beneath him. He made us to be free and thrive however we choose . Good or evil.

Oh and I'm not a christian, I just believe in god. So my views are different then the Christian views.



just-me
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18 Jun 2009, 9:50 pm

z0rp wrote:
God would choose where you're born, and what environment you grow on, thus basically knowing exactly every event that will happen in your life, this God would have been the one to make this person appear awful to others.
I think we choose where we are born. I actually remember choosing my parents.
In the Buddhist book of the dead actually states that a persons soul chooses there parents before birth. I actually remember this so I believe it to be true.

As for god knowing every even that will happen in your life before hand. I believe this part is true. I think god can give you signs in the right direction but at the end of the day he will let you choose your own path. If you ask for his / her help god will gladly help if its within your destany.

z0rp wrote:
I'm sure an all powerful lord of the Universe could do better. And on top of that, it's not even very effective and this is at someone's expense. What if you had to be that person?
I was that person. I learned how to be a good person through abuse and neglect. I agree that it could and should be done another way. But when it happens it can turn someone into a good person if they want to be.

z0rp wrote:
Why doesn't this God just make imaginary people, that only he can tell are fake for example. Although I'm sure this infinitely knowing creature could think of something even better. (If I knew everything I sure could)
That wouldn't end well. Can you imagine falling in love with a fake person?

You bring up very good points z0rp!



z0rp
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18 Jun 2009, 11:35 pm

just-me wrote:
I think we choose where we are born. I actually remember choosing my parents.

So your brain was created before you were, or was this apparent memory somehow implanted into your brain when you assumed your body? Either way it seems too far fetched for me to believe and arguing against someone's personal experience serves little purpose, as most of the time they refuse all explanations minus the one they make up.

just-me wrote:
As for god knowing every even that will happen in your life before hand. I believe this part is true. I think god can give you signs in the right direction but at the end of the day he will let you choose your own path. If you ask for his / her help god will gladly help if its within your destany.

But he made your path, why does he need to give you signs if he made it? He knows how it will turn out, that or he doesn't know everything or he's just a crappy designer.

just-me wrote:
I was that person. I learned how to be a good person through abuse and neglect. I agree that it could and should be done another way. But when it happens it can turn someone into a good person if they want to be.

But couldn't everyone learn how to be good in a good way? I'm sure a being that could do anything could make that happen, no?

just-me wrote:
That wouldn't end well. Can you imagine falling in love with a fake person? !

I would argue falling in love with a fake person would be no different than falling in love with someone for their looks then finding this person not to be so lovely on the inside. Such a thing could be staged easily. And it was only an example, as I said, if I was infinitely intelligent I could create a better system with a snap of my fingers. Or if I could simply do anything I would just say "Better system please.", and one would pop into existence.


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just-me
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19 Jun 2009, 12:43 am

z0rp wrote:
So your brain was created before you were, or was this apparent memory somehow implanted into your brain when you assumed your body?
We all have a soul and it exists in the physical plane as well as the astral plane. When we die the energy of our soul still exists. It is in a different none-physical state but all our memories are stored there. When we are born we still have these memories but most people have to do certain things to recall this info, but others remember some things from the beginning. I had to meditate to recall my past lives but I never forgot choosing my parents and moments after i was conceived.

z0rp wrote:
Either way it seems too far fetched for me to believe and arguing against someone's personal experience serves little purpose, as most of the time they refuse all explanations minus the one they make up.
That's fine, to someone who hasn't heard about these things i would expect it to seem far fetched.

The fact is we can't prove these thing either way, i just find it fun to debate about. I'm glad your open minded to discussing something you don't believe in.



z0rp wrote:
But he made your path, why does he need to give you signs if he made it? He knows how it will turn out, that or he doesn't know everything or he's just a crappy designer.

He does not have to, it just helps the person understand what there future holds.

z0rp wrote:
But couldn't everyone learn how to be good in a good way? I'm sure a being that could do anything could make that happen, no?

Yes there are much better ways of becoming a good person. But to answer your question, I don't really know why it is not done a different way. I just know there was a higher purpose for what I personally went through.

z0rp wrote:
I would argue falling in love with a fake person would be no different than falling in love with someone for their looks then finding this person not to be so lovely on the inside. Such a thing could be staged easily. And it was only an example, as I said, if I was infinitely intelligent I could create a better system with a snap of my fingers. Or if I could simply do anything I would just say "Better system please.", and one would pop into existence.

I dont know why there is not a better system. My guess is its bound to have flaws if you give everyone the power to do what they want
(free will) .



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19 Jun 2009, 1:04 am

just-me wrote:
z0rp wrote:
So your brain was created before you were, or was this apparent memory somehow implanted into your brain when you assumed your body?
We all have a soul and it exists in the physical plane as well as the astral plane. When we die the energy of our soul still exists. It is in a different none-physical state but all our memories are stored there. When we are born we still have these memories but most people have to do certain things to recall this info, but others remember some things from the beginning. I had to meditate to recall my past lives but I never forgot choosing my parents and moments after i was conceived.

Maybe I'll give meditation a larger shot and if I 'recall' anything I'll let you know. :P

just-me wrote:
z0rp wrote:
Either way it seems too far fetched for me to believe and arguing against someone's personal experience serves little purpose, as most of the time they refuse all explanations minus the one they make up.
That's fine, to someone who hasn't heard about these things i would expect it to seem far fetched.


The fact is we can't prove these thing either way, i just find it fun to debate about. I'm glad your open minded to discussing something you don't believe in. [/quote]
To be completely honest I just post here when I have nothing better to do or when I'm bored, and I don't find the conversation all that boring so I don't mind discussing it. And of course I keep an open mind about everything, just not to the point where it falls out. In other words, I'm not about to try sky diving just yet.

just-me wrote:
z0rp wrote:
But he made your path, why does he need to give you signs if he made it? He knows how it will turn out, that or he doesn't know everything or he's just a crappy designer.

He does not have to, it just helps the person understand what there future holds.

I suppose if the person is curious that makes sense, but in that case why not make it easily accessible? Perhaps make it interesting and give the person ten life lines for when they're really confused in life, and when used they get a clue or something to that effect.

just-me wrote:
z0rp wrote:
I would argue falling in love with a fake person would be no different than falling in love with someone for their looks then finding this person not to be so lovely on the inside. Such a thing could be staged easily. And it was only an example, as I said, if I was infinitely intelligent I could create a better system with a snap of my fingers. Or if I could simply do anything I would just say "Better system please.", and one would pop into existence.

I dont know why there is not a better system. My guess is its bound to have flaws if you give everyone the power to do what they want
(free will) .

Well you don't even have to do that, just give people happiness. Make them clouds of ecstasy or something.


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pgd
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27 Jan 2011, 12:03 pm

ScottF wrote:
Why does God give someone a condition like aspergers and then when they screw up hold them at fault for making "judgements" and being bitter?

---
Who knows for sure? That comes down to how the word - God - is defined. There are thousands of non-profit religions on planet earth and the definition of Goddess - God - Goddesses - Gods - etc. vary enormously from one church, synagogue, mosque, televangelist program to the next. When Bad Things Happen to Good People (1981 book) by Harold Kushner, a Conservative rabbi.



Simonono
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27 Jan 2011, 12:11 pm

If there is he/it/she can show him/her/its self, and explain why my cats suffered terrible fates at such a young age. :twisted:



JNathanK
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27 Jan 2011, 9:28 pm

God's a fractal. Once you realize this, our interconnectedness can be known and the greatest potential realized.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jGaio87u3A[/youtube]



techstepgenr8tion
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27 Jan 2011, 11:03 pm

Yes.

The movie Bruce Almighty tells me so.


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