Nobody interested in the Russia-Ukraine conflict?

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goldfish21
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03 Feb 2023, 3:46 am

magz wrote:

I don't buy the last two paragraphs. War is extremely bad for natural environment. Humans show a reliable pattern of reproducing less in comfortable stability and reproducing more after wars and big disasters. To reduce human population, doing nothing and letting people choose not to have children would be much more effective.

Good points, but what if they plan on killing a Lot more people than previous wars? Then even IF there’s a baby boom it’s small potatoes compared to the last ones.

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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.

magz
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03 Feb 2023, 4:47 am

I don't see much suggestions of e.g. people from Nigeria willing to join the war - don't forget that most of the human population is not in the West and Russia.

Also, almighty conspiracies to "explain" things that can be explained by natural dynamics of people being stupid, greedy and selfish... you just don't need them. More general patterns emerge. I recently listened to a historian pointing out that big wars start when someone with enough power is unhappy about current world order - and it happens roughly every 100 years. History is annoyingly unwilling to end.

Not a good outlook but that's it.

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r00tb33r
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03 Feb 2023, 5:36 am

I noticed some people spend a lot of time in this thread, practically around the clock.

Between obsessing about it, and apparently having strong beliefs and opinions, I see being a hero behind the keyboard a poor use of that energy.

If this cause is important to you then go do something about it. I don't know. Grab a rifle and go fight, maybe?

Talking about it won't put a dent in it.

magz
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03 Feb 2023, 5:41 am

If you are not interested in a topic, don't visit it.
If you are, share your opinion on the topic - not on people discussing it.

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r00tb33r
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03 Feb 2023, 5:43 am

I'll figure out for myself what I do and don't comment on.

Pepe
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03 Feb 2023, 5:48 am

magz wrote:

goldfish21 wrote:

Then the US would be at war with russia and that’s what they’re trying to officially avoid by just providing aid to Ukraine to fight their war.. if other countries start shopping, now it’s WW3.

"Shopping"? Of course we're shopping for military equipment, how not to in this place of the world?

I am among those who believe it is WWIII already - but its shape is not pre-determined and it's relatively unlikely to become a nuclear holocaust - similarily to how armies were avoiding using chemical weapons in WWII.

And when it comes to Biden's proposal - yet another example of how several NATO members want to end this war as soon as possible or even sooner. So, Biden joined Macron, Scholz and Erdogan.
I suspect USA does not want Russia to collapse because that would empower China - but they can't show themselves as an unreliable ally because that would embolden China.

Meanwhile, here in Europe, we need to quickly arm ourselves to be prepared for the worst case scenario (USA gets busy in Pacific and Russia marches on - precisely WWIII).

I have a different opinion.
The CCP would want the Russian Federation to be a functioning ally (satellite state) of China.
It is a helpful counter against the western "Union".

If the Russian Federation did collapse, I guess the CCP could take back what they consider their own, however.

magz
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03 Feb 2023, 5:48 am

Commenting on other members is a subject of moderation.
I do not moderate this thread but I can still report it.

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magz
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03 Feb 2023, 5:53 am

Pepe wrote:

If USA did want Russia to collapse, their support would be much broader and faster and they would not propose compromise terms for fast ceasefire (even if rejected by both sides).
If Russia collapsed, China would be the sole ruler of Central Asia - not necessarily moving borders but claiming access to Russian natural resources.
I think that's the reason USA does not want Ukraine to really win.

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Pepe
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03 Feb 2023, 5:56 am

carlos55 wrote:

Maybe some people are over exaggerating the impact of 100 or so tanks.

Leaving aside the fact that tanks on their own are becoming obsolete we’re just talking enough to take a small town or something.

Ukraine volunteer claims why we’re losing (link)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EJ8i6Jix5uw

I believe the Ukrainians are aiming for around 300 western tanks.

magz
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03 Feb 2023, 6:14 am

Pepe wrote:

carlos55 wrote:

I believe the Ukrainians are aiming for around 300 western tanks.

They need much more.
A time window for a counter-offensive was wasted, Russia got their crap together, they started mass production of weapons and ammo, trained the mobiks and put Gerasimov in charge - he's a monster but effective.
Now the point for Ukrainians is not to reconquer but to hold what they have when the weather allows Russian new offensive.
Sad but that's what it is.

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Jakki
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03 Feb 2023, 6:40 am

given what has been conveyed to me from other parts of the Web . Ukraine seems to be just the latest testing ground for Industrial Corporate military megolith including production of new and nastier weapons.. That needs to demostrate their equipment in actual usuage and to dispose of older expensive equipment to make way for New More Expensive equipment .

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Pepe
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03 Feb 2023, 7:03 am

magz wrote:

Pepe wrote:

Firstly, a Russian loss in Ukraine doesn't have to mean the disintegration of the Russian Federation, just the disintegration of pootin.

And it is quite clear that Biden was sh*****g his pants about Russia initiating a nuclear holocaust, hence the softly, softly approach when helping Ukraine.
Other Ameeerian "Hawks" may have wanted the destruction of the Federation, using Ukraine.

magz
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03 Feb 2023, 8:07 am

It's interesting that Republican party in USA is split between traditional Republican "hawks" and post-Trump isolationists. Hoping for presidential nomination, DeSantis remains silent on the topic that interests me the most.

The commenters I heard claim that Biden is attempting to "boil a frog" - increasing the temperature so slowly that the frog does not realize when it's being boiled and does not jump out.

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TenMinutes
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03 Feb 2023, 8:31 am

Jakki wrote:

Ukraine seems to be just the latest testing ground

Ukraine has not received the best. Mostly artillery, short range stuff, Soviet era vehicles still in the inventory of former Soviet states. Newer tanks is an escalation but it will be a while before they have them, are trained, figure out logistics and maintenance on vehicles they will only have in small numbers.

But…

It is apparent that all the warfare the US has engaged in this century has been a huge live-fire training exercise. It has occurred to me for a long time that this may have been an explicit plan all along. The US has trained for modern combat like nobody else has, and they’ve shared their expertise with Allies. And with Ukraine. Ukraine in 2022 was nothing like the pushover it was in 2014.

Jakki
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03 Feb 2023, 9:14 am

Am hoping you are right about Ukraine... but , it is suspiciously reminding me of what every great empire tends to
expand and knowing Hunter Biden had huge investments there . That we may have a new puppet state to support ?

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magz
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03 Feb 2023, 9:36 am

Jakki wrote:

You don't need a puppet state when people want to ally with you.
That's something Russians seem not to understand about expansion of Western influence.

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