WrongPlanet.net an anti-christian site?

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Inuyasha
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25 Apr 2011, 11:21 am

ryan93 wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

ryan93 wrote:

LKL wrote:

leejosepho wrote:

LKL wrote:

@leejosepho: there are patterns of logic that are considered non-subjective, and if we are not to become solipsistic we have to accept a foundation of logic somewhere.

I think I understand that statement and agree, but I do not know why you have made it.

Might you elaborate a bit in relation to something I must have said or done?

You implied that an atheist who loses religion because of the illogic of religion is merely acting on subjective experience that has no objective validity.

Rationality and Logic are objective. Atheists come to their conclusions through their best application of reason and logic. I'd like to think that the conclusions I have come are unavoidable for anyone who applies logic and rationality given the same axioms I've worked from. So I'd like to think they are objective to some degree.

From what I've seen Atheists can be about as objective as religious fanatics.

Being a religious fanatic, are you in a position to comment of objectivity then? Brainteaser :lol:

Only if you think everyone that happens to be in any religion to be a religious fanatic...

I don't go out of my way to bash atheists at every opportunity, that does not mean I won't respond when atheists are acting like bigots and doing their absolute best to piss off Christians for no other reason than their own lack of tolerance (referring to atheists being intolerant).

Atheists often go out of their way to pick fights with Christians and it is almost always exclusively directed towards Christians. I wouldn't be as prone to complain if you spent half as much time directing your criticism towards Islam, Budhism, Hinduism, etc. that you do towards bashing Christians, but you don't.

skafather84
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25 Apr 2011, 11:24 am

You know where I really care about this whole "prove god exists" thing? When you try and legislate from things that aren't relevant other than to your religious morality alone. That some douchebag in a collar says that life begins at conception and all of a sudden it's the word of god despite no real-world application for such a stance on the issue and that even the bible itself (as well as most legal sources) says that life begins when the baby takes its first breath, not before. When it's putting people in jail arbitrarily, I say "show me this god of yours". Otherwise, have fun playing pretend because I really don't care. Keep your games of pretend out of government and out of legislation.

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ryan93
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25 Apr 2011, 11:25 am

Quote:

As for Noah, there is evidence there may have been such major flooding in the region it seemed like it covered the entire world to the group of people whose history is the basis of the record in the Bible. But truth or not is actually irrelant to the point of the story. I read the stories about the search for proof asan interesting side story, but it has little to do with what I believe.

The problem is "evidence" in a scientific context does not mean the same thing as "evidence" in a colloquial context. There isn't evidence of a great flood in the former definition (the idea stands up to no scrutiny whatsoever), while in the latter there is, at least to literalist creationist Christians (or exclusively to them, I might add).

The flood theory doesn't deserve to be respected as a theory, or an idea, because it is judgeable as a Scientific Theory, and it fails miserably. It contradicts the evidence; the way in which things are buried cannot be explained by "men are smarter than dogs, so we climbed higher"; everything would be buried at the same level anyway.

But I'm digressing; my point is that if people want to put forward an idea about the Geology or Biology (religious, or non-religious), then words like "Evidence" have very specific meanings. And Creationism absolutely, undoubtable, irrefutable lacks any Scientific Evidence, at all. And it deserves no special treatment because it a Religious claim; it is wrong, utterly and hopelessly wrong, and it is demonstrably wrong by every professor, undergraduate or perceiving layman with half a brain in the world.

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Inuyasha
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25 Apr 2011, 11:28 am

skafather84 wrote:

Priests are just human beings, pastors are just human beings. Humans are of a fallen nature. Furthermore, the Israelites were not in the habit of deliberately practicing infanticide.

leejosepho
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25 Apr 2011, 11:41 am

ryan93 wrote:

... my point is that if people want to put forward an idea about the Geology or Biology (religious, or non-religious), then words like "Evidence" have very specific meanings.

Yes, agreed: Context, context, context!

ryan93 wrote:

And Creationism absolutely, undoubtable, irrefutable lacks any Scientific Evidence, at all. And it deserves no special treatment because it a Religious claim;

Not really, but yes, it is a belief/claim that does come from within religion ...

ryan93 wrote:

... demonstrably wrong by every professor, undergraduate or perceiving layman [speaking from withing the context of scientific proof] ...

Certainly.

ryan93 wrote:

... with half a brain ...

Oops, and respectfully offered: That is the kind of thing that could never edify -- "to instruct or benefit ... uplift" -- anyone here.

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skafather84
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25 Apr 2011, 12:40 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

skafather84 wrote:

Priests are just human beings, pastors are just human beings. Humans are of a fallen nature. Furthermore, the Israelites were not in the habit of deliberately practicing infanticide.

Good thing abortions involve no infants.

Again, prove to me in a functional manner why there needs to be such a law. What function is there other than putting your feeble mind at rest and costing the tax payers much more money.

ryan93
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25 Apr 2011, 12:44 pm

Quote:

Oops, and respectfully offered: That is the kind of thing that could never edify -- "to instruct or benefit ... uplift" -- anyone here.

I wasn't trying to imply Creationists half less than half a brain; I was trying to get across how easy it is to disprove their "theory" if you try, as opposed to, say General Relativity. Willfully manipulating evidence to meet your own prejudices doesn't require stupidity, merely a lack of integrity.

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AceOfSpades
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25 Apr 2011, 1:22 pm

skafather84 wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

skafather84 wrote:

Priests are just human beings, pastors are just human beings. Humans are of a fallen nature. Furthermore, the Israelites were not in the habit of deliberately practicing infanticide.

There's a million abortion threads and we know how they all tend to end up so take your flame baits elsewhere.

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25 Apr 2011, 1:31 pm

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Actually, there was remarkable symmetry between what you and I said; you said that atheists are as illogical as religious fanatics, I said you are a religious fanatic. I've heard you advocating literalist, "creation science" on the forums, and in a fanatical Christian is a literalist. It depends on how you define fanatically religious, I guess.

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Inuyasha
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25 Apr 2011, 1:51 pm

ryan93 wrote:

Quote:

I'm saying you can't dismiss the possibility, however I do not advocate forcing my religion onto others.

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25 Apr 2011, 1:52 pm

ryan93 wrote:

Quote:

You'll have to be patient here because I tend to collect memories of conclusions, but not what led to them, because, well, I just don't have the brain wiring to hold that volume of details like most people here. BUT my memory is really comfortable that I have read articles on archiological findings indicating a major flood in that region of the world in the right time period. Possibly soil samples making it possible, as well. Obviously not a global flood, and I never claimed it was, but a flood of such magnitude that those living in the region may have felt it appropriate to say it "covered the world."

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leejosepho
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25 Apr 2011, 1:54 pm

ryan93 wrote:

I wasn't trying to imply Creationists half less than half a brain; I was trying to get across how easy it is to disprove their "theory" if you try, as opposed to, say General Relativity. Willfully manipulating evidence to meet your own
prejudices doesn't require stupidity, merely a lack of integrity.

Cool ... and so then maybe something like this could be found less-offensive by anyone who might also benefit from a included thought as to the matter of positive character all around ...

"Creationism absolutely, undoubtable, irrefutable lacks any Scientific Evidence ... and it is demonstrably wrong by every professor, undergraduate or perceiving layman [displaying (rather than 'having') the integrity of intellectual honesty]."

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Inuyasha
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25 Apr 2011, 1:56 pm

leejosepho wrote:

ryan93 wrote:

I wasn't trying to imply Creationists half less than half a brain; I was trying to get across how easy it is to disprove their "theory" if you try, as opposed to, say General Relativity. Willfully manipulating evidence to meet your own
prejudices doesn't require stupidity, merely a lack of integrity.

Rhotorical Question: However, if tomorrow remnants of Noah's Ark were discovered would scientists still be claiming the Bible is nothing more than a work of fiction...

Answer: Yes, they would.

DW_a_mom
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25 Apr 2011, 1:58 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

Atheists often go out of their way to pick fights with Christians and it is almost always exclusively directed towards Christians. I wouldn't be as prone to complain if you spent half as much time directing your criticism towards Islam, Budhism, Hinduism, etc. that you do towards bashing Christians, but you don't.

You have to be careful of the generalization but it is worth being aware that some aetheists feel strongly that religion is destructive, and that faith is destruction; that the whole thing is to blame for much of what is wrong and unjust in our world. Which means ... that subgroup is almost compelled as a moral duty to try to persuade those of faith to leave their faith. Very much in the same way some Christians feel compelled to help save non-believers from hell. Certain belief systems (or non-belief systems) don't leave room for accepting the positions of others. I'm sure you can relate, you just have to flip it 180.

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skafather84
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25 Apr 2011, 2:02 pm

AceOfSpades wrote:

skafather84 wrote:

Inuyasha wrote:

skafather84 wrote:

Priests are just human beings, pastors are just human beings. Humans are of a fallen nature. Furthermore, the Israelites were not in the habit of deliberately practicing infanticide.

There's a million abortion threads and we know how they all tend to end up so take your flame baits elsewhere.

It's not my fault that superstitious people fail to comprehend the difference between being born and not born yet and the social differences between the two and want to create more garbage laws that'll cost tax payers more money that'll drive down the quality of life that much more. Take your god elsewhere. Maybe Jonestown.

skafather84
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25 Apr 2011, 2:04 pm

It's not flame bait. I have the best interests of society at large in the forefront. Anti-abortion advocates have their own selfishness and loathing at the forefront of their crusade.

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