Does anyone else agree with feminism?

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This is popping up in the US too, started on the West Coast and started to spread as far as I can tell.

School kids are having this drilled into them, I think it's necessary in preschool but now we're looking at K-12 students raised in an "everyone's a winner" environment.

No drive to compete, taught that it's "bad" and unfair to possess or develop any qualities that might make you better than anyone else.

I'm sure these children are lovely but I just can't wait to see what kind of high achievers this generation turns out >not<

Sounds like a much milder version of the East German project.

Do feminists 'blame' men or do they blame women as well?

many women are complicit in their own oppression and in the oppression of men (men likewise).

From my perspective, women do not want "gender equality", gender equality would entail that both women and men are treated identically and as far as I've noticed every time something like that happens the woman spazzes out. For instance, we had a case where a female recruit was made to undress and bathe with all the other soldiers, she ran to the media with the case to complain, despite the fact that she was treated in a gender neutral manner. There was a case where a woman punched a man repeatedly in front of the police, yet the man was arrested when he attempted to restrain her.

so from 2 anecdotal cases you think that all women do not want gender equality? that is interesting.

also, it is not only "equality" to have men and women showering together. providing the same yet separate showering facilities would also be considered equal.

Yup. I'm all for that stuff. I don't see why anyone can be against it...apart from butthurt men who can't get laid. :/

Take something a bit more concrete then, a woman's advantage when it comes to child custody and child support, or the fact that women generally get lower sentences for the same crime, these issues are just as important as equal employment rights, yet I never hear the first ones mentioned in a public debate or by gender equality advocates.

many females and even *gasp* feminists want equality when it comes to child custody and child support, so you are incorrect there as well. just because it doesn't always happen in the legal system does not mean that women don't support changes.

Women generally get the kids because women generally are the primary care providers. It's as simple as that. Also, it was *all over* the feminist blogs when it was discovered that the census described care by the mother as 'parental care' and care by the father as something else. Every single feminist blogger I read was incensed about it. As for women showering with the men, whether or not its ok largely depends on how her fellow soldiers were behaving. If they'd been sexually harassing her day in and day out up to that point, I can see where she might have been uncomfortable (read: fearful of rape) to take a naked shower with them*. A lightly-built gay guy who'd been harassed consistently might react the same way.
*http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/1995/05/12/MN63836.DTL
quote:
Ninety percent of women under 50 who have served in the U.S. military and who responded to a survey report being victims of sexual harassment, and nearly one- third of the respondents of all ages say they have been raped.

The incidence of violent assaults among female veterans, the vast majority of whom reported at least one ``severe assault,'' is much higher than in the general population and raises questions about the treatment of women currently on active duty and the 1.2 million veterans, researchers said.

Equality is an iffy issue, because it's a fleeting pursuit. What happens after you try to gain a 50/50 balance... do you fight to keep it balanced? No. Most groups who fight for this balance(equality) end up being partisan and only caring about the group they represent.

Since I believe in a creator who make out men and women to be equal, MEN AND WOMEN ARE EQUAL.

But we are not the same. I think it's a beautiful thing... and we should celebrate those differences. First wave feminists seem to have a big issue accepting this, maybe because they feel that it may lead back the enironment that they were fighting and trying to get away from in the first place... where ((Because)) of a women's inherent differences, she could not achieve x, y, and z. I think women can do all of the things that men can do (in some areas worse then men, and in other areas better then men) but we need to acknowledge that we are not the same.

The two things that allow men and women to be equal are one or both of these two things:

1.) a creator who grants us equality.
2.) a higher power amongst humans (could be government, could society) that grants us this right.

We're not born equal. It is a right given to us by a right giver; you choose who that right giver is or was.

Also,... I feel that females have it made in the west. That they choose not to go into certain career fields is their own personal choice, and should be respected. They represent the majority of tomorrow's college-educated, tomorrow's management, and tomorrow's breadwinners for the family (in what ever shape that may take on in the future). I don't see it so positive with males, I think the preoccupation with staying young, immaturity, and never growing up has afflicted too much of the male population. More likely to commit crimes, drop out of high school, more likely to do drugs, more likely to get killed, more likely to engage in violence, more likely to be the victim of violence, more likely to commit suicide, more likely to not get a job, more likely to not attend college or graduate from college, etc.

I'm just now reading Virginia Woolf's brilliant essay 'A Room of one's own', and it reminds me of some of the feminist central issues.
Not all goals have been reached, even here in Scandinavia, and until they are, or forever, whichever comes first, a certain level of struggle is not only to be expected, it's all kinds of fair.

To be denied any personal choices, that are granted others, based on anything that is not a personal choice, is the core problem, as I see it. It's not a question of being identical, it's a question of having identical rights to make personal choices.
If your conscious, individual CHOICE is to have Snooky as your role model, you should be free to do so (but don't expect universal acclaim).
If your conscious choice is to wear a suit and tie and work in a bank, you should be paid the same as other suit-and-tie-wearing bankers, whether you squat to pee or not. But don't expect universal acclaim.

In this regard, the feminist struggle is not yet at the goal line.

I agree with feminists about the equal pay right, but I think they are wrong that women are disadvantaged. Women can use sex apeal to sway men to give them higher standing than men. They just shouldn't let themselves become victims of their own worrying mentality and go on with their life, seeking fairness where it does not exist.

While it's true that many women can wrap many men around their finger, there is so much wrong with the idea that this constitutes an argument against the need for more gender equality that I have to put it in list form:

1.) You are suggesting that women have to either use their sex appeal in order to get ahead in life or suffer disadvantages.

2.) You assume that most or all employers or superiors are male. An increasing number of them are women.

3.) Sex appeal is only an "advantage" in a world that is controlled by men. But in such a world, women are actually quite disadvantaged, since they depend on men for their livelihood. Thankfully we are past that point.

4.) Even if an employer happens to be male, not all men are easy to impress or seduce. Some are faithful to their partner or spouse, others are gay or asexual.

5.) Your argument reduces women to their physical attributes. Looks are everything, qualifications and hard work don't really matter.

6.) According to your argument, less attractive women should have less career opportunities.

7.) You are implying that women in higher positions got there by using their physical charms, not by being qualified and doing a good job.

8.) Not all women are comfortable with the idea of flirting with men in order to make a career. I think that most women would be appalled by this idea.

9.) You expect women to throw their morals overboard. Married or partnered women are to cheat on their spouses, single women ought to be disingenuous by flirting with unattractive superiors.

10.) You also expect women to reinforce an ugly gold digger stereotype.

11.) You further expect lesbian women to lie about their sexual orientation if they want to make a career.

12.) Not only men are susceptible to physical beauty. Attractive men have the same potential advantage as attractive women. But neither men nor women should have to sleep with their boss in order to get a promotion.

13.) How would you like to further your career by dating your gay boss? What would you say if he implied that you could get a promotion by sleeping with him?

Last edited by CrazyCatLord on 09 Mar 2012, 2:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Hey Vexcalibur's cat. meow meow meow ?