Opinions on abortion?

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That's where I stand.

-There are people who kidnap a woman and cut the baby out
-Fathers who don't want a child, and harm the mother to kill the fetus
-Criminals who kill in the fetus in the course of their actions

We have to decide whether these people should be charged with "fetal homicide", or not.

Getting pregnant isn't the same as donating an organ to an already-born, fully-developed human being.

Which part is the fallacy? I'm not sure what you're referring to. Not to mention, you're the one saying you're "killing something before it has a chance to live"... which is an entire contradiction in and of itself, as you can't kill something that isn't alive, and as I stated abortions happen BEFORE life.



I would rather spend the rest of my life hating myself more than any Pro-Lifer could hate me than give a child up for adoption where it WILL encounter abuse of many forms, severe emotional trauma, and deeply lasting psychological issues. It's not a chance, it's a certainty. Not to mention our country is overflowing with unwanted children, so that's an absolutely garbage argument to make. Yes, let's bring more suffering to innocent lives. Great idea.

As for not having sex... I can't even put into words how absolutely unhealthy that is. Both physically and emotionally. Perhaps if people spent less time "researching" pro-life propaganda and more time researching biology and how to keep your self healthy in all aspects of the word, the world would be a better place.

Regardless, I'm all for a woman making her own choices with her own life when there are no actual living things to consider. I don't care who says what to me about it, how nasty anyone wants to get (because yes, being a mean, stubborn as*hole really convinces a person of the legitimacy of the argument being made), or what "facts" they want to dredge up that came from nowhere within a 20 foot pole's distance of actual scientific truths, I'm not changing my opinion any more than you are. So let's agree to disagree.

I am most definitely pro-choice. I do not believe I have any right to say to anyone else what they can/should do with their body, same as if someone tried to tell me what to do with mine I would not appreciate it. Additionally, I don't suspect any women who has the procedure performed thinks to themselves "yay, I'm going through a traumatic ordeal, and I will carry the guilt of this with me for the rest of my life!" I imagine it is something that deeply affects the woman, and that she seeks out therapy of some sort afterwards for emotional support.

Indeed, pregnancy is temporary, but you brought up organ donation in the first place.

If I find out I'm pregnant, I'm getting an abortion right away. I don't want to give birth to a human child let alone having to deal with one.

If living as an orphan is so terrible, should we put them down humanely?

I suppose that was a fair attempt at making an antagonistic comment. But it missed the mark. We both know that a living, breathing, feeling and thinking Child is far different from an Embryo. Perhaps someone less educated might fall for that one.

edit: btw, very superb of you to take my genuine concern and empathy for unwanted children and make it something ugly. A round of applause for showing me the error of my ways.

Abortion is murder plain and simple.

Yeah it was a cheap shot, I am getting bored of this argument. Your "concern" for adopted children is utterly irrelevant though. The crux of this argument is always going to be the question "what is destroyed in an abortion". If the fetus is not a human being or has no rights through some other legal construction, then it really doesn't matter why you choose to abort and all such moralising is feel-good fluff. You can abort for congenital abnormalities, being female, parentage, race, autism, eye colour. What does it matter?

If the fetus is a human being, which I argue, then it is almost always wrong and such an argument for the perils of adoption would fall flat on its face.



From my point of view, your position is already ugly. I only held up a mirror.

I guess you didn't realize I wasn't talking to you, then? If you're so bored, move on. I'm not interested in being your punching bag. Go take it out on the person you're actually mad at that did you wrong. Or argue your inane drivel with someone else, because you're already changing the topic to suit you. I'm not interested and I have enough sense to move on.



It's almost cute how you think you can somehow know anything at all about me, and that you would have some insight into my person that I don't already have. You might want to turn the mirror around; then again, you seem like the glass house type. Have a nice night misdirecting your anger and psychological issues on others. We're done talking to each other.

I apologise in advance if you have difficulties reading English, which is possible given your interpretation of my post, but:

- Disagreeing with someone is not using them as a punching bag
- It's a public forum, you are talking to everyone that reads it.
- I didn't change the topic at all.
- I deduce your position from your own words, I didn't offer any insights into your character.
- Rather than engage, you indulge in personal attacks. You infer that I lack education, have anger issues and suffer from mental illness. To use your own words against you, this is not the behaviour of an educated person.

You can't force people to have children. There will be resentment, the kid will feel unloved and unwanted, they would pick up on it and some people just end up neglecting their child or abusing them because they were unwanted and in other countries babies get dumped off at orphanages where they get neglected because they are under staffed. Then the baby just ends up with problems in the future or for life and the fact RAD is pretty common in adopted children. Some parents have actually turned their adoptive children back after spending thousands of dollars trying to give them help or they give up their adoption and they turn their kid over to someone who specializes in RAD because it's the only way they can help them.

Abortions keep babies out of these situations and growing up to be f****d up people.

I have no problems with reading English, but you seem awfully ready to insinuate quite a lot about my character and intelligence with your strategic statements, as I see you've done with others.

You delved into the middle of a focused discussion between two people as though I had been speaking to you.

You didn't disagree with what I said, you took a cheap shot (as you admitted in your own words) and knowingly twisted my position and words to make it sound as though I am on the level with euthanizing children.

You're also arguing about a fetus, when I stated embryo, which are completely different things, yet you're not changing anything?

And now you're claiming I'm attacking you personally rather than making my own deductions: Troll-like antagonism towards those who do not share your views based on your words and the method with which you deliver them.

From the beginning you seemed to be looping me into an argument by making subtle hints that influence me to defend my character and my position. I don't agree with using such methods. They're almost exclusively utilized because a person has some repressed emotional issue that they don't feel comfortable expressing in an alternative and more appropriate manner. It's a very common theme on the internet, especially in public forums. If that's not what you're doing, then I apologize for reading you wrong. But the way with which you went about responding to my reply to someone else is incredibly similar to many, many instances where it has in fact been the case that someone was baiting solely for the sake of inciting an argument.
Hopefully this is just a case of misunderstanding on both sides. If you genuinely take issue with my person, then you'll just have to take issue. I may not agree with your opinion and position, but I'm not going to call you or your ideas ugly, I'm not going to insinuate that you're even remotely okay with cruelty towards children, and I'm going to let you have your opinion without judgment.

edit: I also can't help but wonder why you seem to be so focused on my opinion, even though there are several others here that you would disagree with.

As a final thought - I don't even know you, you don't know me at all, but you find license in taking cheap shots over a difference of opinion.

That by itself lends me to thinking ill of anyone and not liking their mentality. We are all extremely fallible in our perceptions and opinions. So I find any attempt to belittle, put down, judge, infantilize, condemn, etc another person for a difference of opinion AND omniscient/arrogant attitudes to be completely detestable.

Perhaps I was standoffish and ready to go on the defensive, but you did yourself no favors and your position no justice by being petty and taking a cheap shot as a first impression. I'm done with this thread, quite literally, I will not be returning.