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Preparing for election, post election riots

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magz
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17 Nov 2020, 4:33 pm

If a need for a reform is ignored for long enough and people get p!ssed off enough, you get a revolution.
That usually comes with a lot of collateral damage.


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17 Nov 2020, 7:39 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I just didn't think it would do any good, since bad cops are still going to want to be bad cops, regardless of what protesters think of them, or so I thought.


Political change has the potential to reduce how beholden cities are to police unions and make it easier to fire violent thugs who hide behind their badge to commit assault and murder.

It doesn't promise improvement, but it at least has the potential.

I'd imagine in some communities it might only be a matter of time until people start targeting the offenders knowing that the criminal justice system will not hold those criminals accountable. It would be terrible for that to be the path things go down, but if the need for police reform is ignored it might be inevitable that other means start to become appealing to some.


But I thought that the President doesn't have power in reforming the police and that was more of a state and prosecution thing, and therefore the protests should be geared towards those elections and not a Presidential one, I thought.



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17 Nov 2020, 7:40 pm

magz wrote:
If a need for a reform is ignored for long enough and people get p!ssed off enough, you get a revolution.
That usually comes with a lot of collateral damage.


Well so far the people causing the riots are destroying their own communities rather than the government, so they don't seem to be very competent at the idea of a revolution, since they are destroying themselves more it seems.



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17 Nov 2020, 8:15 pm

ironpony wrote:
magz wrote:
If a need for a reform is ignored for long enough and people get p!ssed off enough, you get a revolution.
That usually comes with a lot of collateral damage.


Well so far the people causing the riots are destroying their own communities rather than the government, so they don't seem to be very competent at the idea of a revolution, since they are destroying themselves more it seems.


I don't think any communities have been destroyed by rioting, also riots are a small part of the protests...its just the more 'exciting' part so it gets more fancy news headlines and focus than the over-all more peaceful protesting. In some cases it was the police who caused 'rioting' by excessive force against protestors.


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17 Nov 2020, 8:29 pm

Agreed, it's like the whole country forgot the sensationalist media problem when the sensationalist presidency vilified the actual news.


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17 Nov 2020, 8:45 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
ironpony wrote:
magz wrote:
If a need for a reform is ignored for long enough and people get p!ssed off enough, you get a revolution.
That usually comes with a lot of collateral damage.


Well so far the people causing the riots are destroying their own communities rather than the government, so they don't seem to be very competent at the idea of a revolution, since they are destroying themselves more it seems.


I don't think any communities have been destroyed by rioting, also riots are a small part of the protests...its just the more 'exciting' part so it gets more fancy news headlines and focus than the over-all more peaceful protesting. In some cases it was the police who caused 'rioting' by excessive force against protestors.


Oh okay. What counts as excesssive force though? Anything beyond tear gas?



funeralxempire
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17 Nov 2020, 8:50 pm

ironpony wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I just didn't think it would do any good, since bad cops are still going to want to be bad cops, regardless of what protesters think of them, or so I thought.


Political change has the potential to reduce how beholden cities are to police unions and make it easier to fire violent thugs who hide behind their badge to commit assault and murder.

It doesn't promise improvement, but it at least has the potential.

I'd imagine in some communities it might only be a matter of time until people start targeting the offenders knowing that the criminal justice system will not hold those criminals accountable. It would be terrible for that to be the path things go down, but if the need for police reform is ignored it might be inevitable that other means start to become appealing to some.


But I thought that the President doesn't have power in reforming the police and that was more of a state and prosecution thing, and therefore the protests should be geared towards those elections and not a Presidential one, I thought.


In the US they all happen on the same day, afaik. It's not like here where provincial elections are separate from federal elections.


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17 Nov 2020, 8:58 pm

Oh okay, I'm not American so what do I know... So they vote for their district attorneys in their states, the same day they vote for President?



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18 Nov 2020, 6:02 am

ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I just didn't think it would do any good, since bad cops are still going to want to be bad cops, regardless of what protesters think of them, or so I thought.

the wo/man at the top, if that man or woman has any moral authority at all [totally unlike trumpoleeney who doesn't even know what "moral" means] sets the national tone. the POTUS has a national soapbox unlike any other person, and that person can harp on bad cops until enough people at the local level nationwide, are persuaded to have a closer look at their local brutal flatfoots. some police departments were dissolved or deconstructed, such as newark NJ's PD, when too much light [public ire] was shining on them for the comfort of a critical mass of those coproaches to where there were no further shadows for them to flee into.



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18 Nov 2020, 6:03 am

ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, I'm not American so what do I know... So they vote for their district attorneys in their states, the same day they vote for President?

yes, our main [not special] election days are always in the first week, usually a tuesday, in november, nationwide.



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18 Nov 2020, 6:05 am

ironpony wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
ironpony wrote:
magz wrote:
If a need for a reform is ignored for long enough and people get p!ssed off enough, you get a revolution.
That usually comes with a lot of collateral damage.


Well so far the people causing the riots are destroying their own communities rather than the government, so they don't seem to be very competent at the idea of a revolution, since they are destroying themselves more it seems.


I don't think any communities have been destroyed by rioting, also riots are a small part of the protests...its just the more 'exciting' part so it gets more fancy news headlines and focus than the over-all more peaceful protesting. In some cases it was the police who caused 'rioting' by excessive force against protestors.


Oh okay. What counts as excesssive force though? Anything beyond tear gas?

we all know what police brutality is, esp. those of us who have been the brunt of it. george floyd was a honking example of excessive force, killing an unarmed suspect for no good reason.



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18 Nov 2020, 6:07 am

cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
it seems a record number of 'em voted for their man, 71+ million. the only thing that outpolled them was the record 78 million who voted for biden/harris. the authoritarian types are still a powerful force as they took senate and house seats from the democrats.


Yes that number of 71 million is very worrying. It will remain a legacy that the US has a long road to rehabilitating their masses from the wrath of populist ethnocentric nationalism

i am not particularly literate regarding the bible but it does seem to say that the sins of the father are visited upon the sons to the third generation which is another way of saying it takes several generations for the hate to fade generation to generation. that means in actual practice that america won't mellow out for another few decades.



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18 Nov 2020, 7:42 am

magz wrote:
Pepe wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Tempus Fugit wrote:
Originally Tedros Adhanom was being blamed. But like China he was forgotten about in favor of blaming the US president.


How about they are all to blame. This argument that the virus orginates in China doesn't give Frump a free pass to allow 280,000 Americans to die and to be a superspreader spreading covid to your co-workers and to the MAGA mobs who come and listen


Had the Wuhan virus been kept in China*, and not transported around the world via China*s* workers, there wouldn't have been 1.2 million dead now. 8O
You do know that, right? :scratch:

For the life of me, I don't understand how you can by-pass this *fact*.
Well, I actually do.
A narrative must be, erm, narrated. :)
You can understand why critical thinkers can't take what you say seriously, right? 8)
From what I gathered, before the Chinese realised the virus was new, it already leaked to Europe.
Most of the pandemics is "European strain" now, even in China.
Ease of travel is a great thing of global world but it has clear a downside when it comes to epidemics.


That isn't how I remember it.

The China*s* authorities knew it was contagious.
They stopped their own doctors reporting that fact. (Yes, it is a fact. 1.2 million dead to verify it.)
The China*s* told the W.H.O. that it wasn't transmissible to humans.
Putting the best spin on it, the W.H.O didn't do due diligence.
The W.H.O.'s assertion that the coronavirus wasn't transmissable to humans allowed the CC*P to loot millions of units of PPE, before the world became aware of the pandemic, leaving the rest of the world scrambling to obtain more.
The CC*P locked down their cities and continued to allowed infected workers to travel to other parts of the world.

Regarding the mutated strain, of the virus, yes there is a continuous mutating process.
Are you saying there is doubt that the Wuhan virus didn't originate in Wuhan? :scratch: :mrgreen:



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18 Nov 2020, 7:47 am

cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
it seems a record number of 'em voted for their man, 71+ million. the only thing that outpolled them was the record 78 million who voted for biden/harris. the authoritarian types are still a powerful force as they took senate and house seats from the democrats.


Yes that number of 71 million is very worrying. It will remain a legacy that the US has a long road to rehabilitating their masses from the wrath of populist ethnocentric nationalism


My best guess is that most of the 71 million don't want the socialisation/marxification of America.



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18 Nov 2020, 8:10 am

Pepe wrote:
Are you saying there is doubt that the Wuhan virus didn't originate in Wuhan? :scratch: :mrgreen:
Call it ‘Coronavirus’. Disease and prejudice have long gone hand in hand. We can do better in 2020.
NYT wrote:
We’ve been down this road before, too many times. In the 14th century the Black Death provoked mass violence against Jews, Catalans, clerics and beggars; when syphilis spread in the 15th century, it was called variously the Neapolitan, French, Polish and German disease, depending on who was pointing the blame; when the plague struck Honolulu in 1899, officials burned down Chinatown. And so on, down to our times, when epidemics like Ebola, SARS and Zika fueled animus toward specific regions or peoples.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/23/opin ... acism.html


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18 Nov 2020, 8:11 am

Pepe wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
it seems a record number of 'em voted for their man, 71+ million. the only thing that outpolled them was the record 78 million who voted for biden/harris. the authoritarian types are still a powerful force as they took senate and house seats from the democrats.


Yes that number of 71 million is very worrying. It will remain a legacy that the US has a long road to rehabilitating their masses from the wrath of populist ethnocentric nationalism


My best guess is that most of the 71 million don't want the socialisation/marxification of America.

in addition, they don't want people like me to have affordable health care and they think they have the right to police my private life as well, the goddamned hypocrites.