The problem of SJWs

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No need for apologies, just acknowledge the context in which you exist.

I feel like the systemic racism that's being implemented today is a reversal of what it was when my dad was growing up, such as how they're bringing back segregation as if it's a good thing for black people now. In fact, most of the arguments I see made by SJWs, or Bolsheviks really... seem to be based on evolutionary racism, aka "not all races are made the same."

Back in the 1800's, it was stipulated that African people were of lower intelligence, etc, than Europeans, and that theory was tossed out as racist. Yet I see the SJWs bringing that thinking back, only it's packaged in a neat little bow and people are eating it up without realizing what it's actually meaning. Saying things like tests are racist to black people because they're geared towards white people only further proves this (as well as the fact that our school systems are in desperate need of a redo anyway). Some people may even argue that many programs or scholarships that exist where kids qualify purely based on their skin color can be considered racist as well.

My experience dealing with SJWs, both online and in real life, shows that they do not want true equality, and this shows another type of racism. They will raise the white race up onto a pedestal and claim they are in supreme power, and therefore must be stripped of that power and redistributed amongst the non-white people as if non-white people cannot do anything on their own. I have heard many non-white people arguing with SJWs over this, as they do not want a trophy, or to just be handed things, merely because they aren't white. Same with being a woman. However, the idea that "the most qualified should win/get the job" is racist to SJWs is preventing any form of real equality from taking hold.

I'm also constantly confused by their ideas on what constitutes as "white." Typically, they use the broader definition of "you look like you're of Northern European descent." Basing it on facial structure, usually not having to do with skin tone. However, there seems to be some disagreement on the one drop rule, as some will claim anyone with one drop of non-white blood is therefore not white, while others say anyone "white passing" benefits from white privilege and therefore must atone for the sins of the ~2% slave owners in the US 150 some odd years ago. They have this bizarre idea on what privilege even is, acting as if a black woman who makes $200,000 per year living in a primarily rich black neighborhood is more oppressed than a homeless white boy living in Compton (majority black poverty ridden city).

Most also refuse to believe that other races hold preferences to their own race, such as in Fontana, CA, they will tell me that white people still somehow manage to have white privilege there, even though it's a majority Hispanic city and it's very clear that there is Hispanic privilege, rather than white privilege. They will hire Hispanics over white, and in some case, will even refuse to serve white people. Privilege is a fluid thing, it's never constant and it's very dependent on the situation, area, and people.

Yet here in the US and the UK and Canada and other places, universities are starting to create "safe spaces" (aka segregated areas) that refuse entry to white males, or white people in general, in order to keep non-white people "safe." People are actively embracing segregation again, and anyone who opposes such a thing is automatically deemed racist. Unless they're black, then they're an Uncle Tom or coon. In the online discussions, there are usually only two races assumed; white or black, and those are the only ones that matter to SJWs. Just look at the "Oscars so white" thing. They were concerned only with black people winning, rather than the far less represented races, such as Asians, Hispanics, or Native Americans. If they were truly concerned with equal representation, they wouldn't be solely focused on just white and black people, but all races.

I could rant for hours on the subject of SJWs. They are harming multiple countries around the world with their ideology, which ultimately comes from the Bolsheviks, and they believe emotion is as valid evidence as cold hard scientific facts, and in fact sometimes believe it trumps facts (like the ones who believe if they have a dream someone did something bad, that person in reality must therefore apologize or pay because the dreamer was offended). I have been studying this mindset for over a year (or is it 2 by now?) and I have folders dedicated to the bizarre "logic" they go by. Their ideology doesn't make sense, and is closely tied with modern feminist ideology. "Feelz before Realz." They end up being rather anti science, and allow major problems to be neglected in lieu of focusing on things like "mansplaining" or "microaggressions." Instead of the 400 black children being slaughtered in the streets by criminals, they focus on the 250 mainly criminals who get killed by police (there are very few who were innocent, or killed unjustly innocent or not). The numbers do not match their narrative and it's highly disturbing to me.

^ +100

kamiyu, it seems to be a study of self-reinforcement (the echo chambers of the net) that leads you to simple generalizations. I haven't heard of this new segregation either, but did hear of this happening between the richer people in an area and poorer, which is where I think a problem lies.

Based on what? That's about as unqualified as statements get.

That is my point, actually... they seem to be based on random online postings, but that is no way to resource a sample. I could make any number of observations but I usually don't create some acronym and attribute every single opinion to everyone. Claiming e.g. that phrenology is somehow a universal belief, when it's pseudo-science.

Kamiyu he hasn't heard of it because he has not had to (or is qualified to) attend the institutions such as US campus where this is happening.

You make a lot of valid points.
TimTex I also empathise with your points. We are by default classed as wrong by a group of people regardless of whatever we did or were born as. That in itself is how racism comes about.

Well, what were you expecting

There are many articles detailing such things, going back to about 2010, but here are some more recent ones, mainly detailing the problem on college/university campuses. I like to base my opinions on as many facts as I can find, from multiple sources, so that I do not fall to "simple generalizations." People of the SJW ideology, and feminist ideology, are of very similar mindsets for the simple reason that they must have an echo chamber and will shame anyone who becomes "problematic." This is something I have seen countless times, as more and more people become "anti-SJW" or "anti-feminist." Anything I say, I try to have a long list of reasons and evidence to back up my stance.

I'm known to link-spam and it puts people off, but hopefully this is palatable.


Ethnic Minorities Deserve Safe Spaces Without White People

'POC Only': College Students Now Openly Refusing To Live With White People

Safe Spaces Segregate the Claremont Colleges

Cal State LA offers segregated housing for black students

Ruby Bridges Wonders If Racial Tensions and Segregated School Districts Have Sent America Back to Pre-Civil Rights Era

Elite K-8 school teaches white students they’re born racist

Activists Enforce Segregation: "Black-only Healing Space"

Black Lives Matter: Banning Racial Segregation is Racist

At Princeton, black students demand segregation

Black Lives Matter slams public library’s ban on blacks-only meetings as racist

Black students demand segregated spaces from white students

Black lives matter hosting 'Blacks Only' event in Portland

Black Students Demand “Segregation Now, Segregation Tomorrow, Segregation Forever”

Black Lives Matter Cries 'White Supremacy' after Holding 'Color-Only' Meetings at Library

Black Students Demand Segregation from Whites, 'Lack spaces where they feel safe and comfortable'

Safe Space Segregation: College Coffee Shop Only Allows "People of Color"

I’m Northwestern’s president. Here’s why safe spaces for students are important.

This Claremont Safe Space for Women of Color Is Actually Pretty Hateful and Racist Students form identity-based group in order to bash people they don't like.

Reclaiming a safe space: Person of Color co-op to open this fall

wow. so that's what a "safe space" is? i thought it was some kind of metaphorical expression

how did those ideas ever come to be seen as acceptable?

Kamiyu is discussing widely documented social behaviour, not a dubious scientific principle.

Also, pot meet kettle. You've demonstrated zero reservations when it comes to making gross generalisations in the numerous "x group are all fascists" threads you've started. I don't think it would be unreasonable, at this juncture, to request you revisit those threads with the same rigorous attention to detail you're demanding here, provide some citations and supporting data for your many, many proclamations.



Whilst it wasn't strictly necessary to "link-spam", as you put it, on this occasion, I'm not sure why anyone would object to having more information.

Other than desire to create an information safe-space around a cognitive bias, of course.



Doublethink.

According to safespacenetwork on Tumblr:





What I was saying about shunning those who become "problematic" is very evident in videos like this one, btw. Just to make myself clearer.

Same with posts like this, which I've been noticing becoming more common:


And then there's this lovely game: SJW or Stormfront, where people block out the descriptor (white, male, etc) and replace it with something else, usually Jew. There is also a rise in the popularity of "race reversal" posts, where people take posts bashing white people and make it say black instead.



And on the other end of the spectrum, instead of segregation we have people pushing for forced integration concerning who one dates:



And I think the problem is that while these people are a minority, they are actually causing real world harm. They have power and influence and are doing things that I don't think they realize the consequences of. I don't think anyone knows those consequences, but judging from history, it's not going to be good.

The above posts shock me. Did no one learn anything from Rotherham? Where 1400 girls were raped over a period of decades because the police and influential figures not only did not want to be seen as racist, but called anyone who challenged it racist?

Edit: Headmaster seems dubious..

Obviously you talking about modern liberal ideology, why not just say so? Except no liberal actually thinks the way you accuse them of doing. I call myself a liberal and things like affirmative action and other measures to combat racism are not in fact examples of racism or segregation.


Nonsense. This is the lowest level of knee-jerk racial defensiveness. As if after 400 years of racist policies and continued discrimination against minorities, the slightest move to address the problem is racist. Where were you 50 years ago when fire hoses and dogs were released on unarmed peaceful protestors wanting an equal education or equal housing or equal transportation? You sound totally clueless about history. IQ test are culturally biased, if they even mean anything at all. White culture has nothing to do with inherent qualities that one is born with.


Yes, they don't want gifts, they want equal opportunity. Unfortunately (for you) this requires a change in the status quo, positive action, not just claims that we are already equal.


Negotiation on what it means to be white because you are miffed about the insinuation that you might have anything to do with a white supremacist culture. I don't care, of course there are grey areas. I'm talking about the big picture.


Of course that's possible. I will be happy when black privilege becomes a problem.


That's not negative segregation, these areas are in universities which white and black people already attend. No special privileges are associated with such participation! It's a private club. You know what else is a safe space, churches. Good luck being a black person going to a white church in the South. You will wind up hanging from a tree.


You don't get to claim science. Liberal morality is based on science. Like the science of gender, which shows it's not binary. We tend to want reasonable gun control, which is impossible when childish claims of SJW pop up at the merest hint of a perfectly constitutional law to prevent gun violence. Or end the drug war. Or address issues of poverty or failing schools. These efforts are constantly being undermined by conservatives with their idiotic labels and fearmongering.

No, I am speaking about the Bolshevik ideology, as I said. I know plenty of liberals who do not side with this stuff.



I don't think you quite understood my point, since you said yourself that IQ tests are culturally biased. Tests themselves don't dictate IQ, and are baseless in judging ANYONE'S abilities. Our school system isn't racist, it just sucks. SJWs are claiming it's only detrimental to black kids, rather than everyone, and that it's a sign of systemic racism because black kids can't learn like white kids can. I'm not going to get into the serious issues underlying the real problems, that would be a completely different post. My point still stands, however, that they are claiming racism where there isn't any while they themselves are treating black kids as lesser to whites.

Also, I was not born 50 years ago. That's a completely stupid question, and 50 years ago is only showing how bad it is today in the misconceptions, as people are trying to undo everything that the civil rights movement worked for. People died for that stuff and they're just tossing it in the trash, claiming it's progressive instead of regressive. They are working to undo everything that those people fought for. This is not trying to fix the problems, this is making it far far worse. Black communities are at an all time low, and the things the SJWs claim they're trying to fix have only made things worse, and this is provable, not just my opinion. This is backed by evidence.



Unfortunately for me? As if you know my situation and life? Baseless and has nothing to do with the topic. Also, being handed a job based on race or gender is insulting to many. It's insulting to me. I want to work for my stuff. I want to be good at what I do, not get accolades for existing. Equal opportunity exists in the laws. The problems come from the communities, from individual opinions. We get very intelligent kids in, and they get pressured by their peers and family to ditch education because it's a "white" thing, and they hide their smarts in order to keep their street cred. We have lost many kids, 12-13 yrs old, to gang violence and crime, and they end up in juvie because education is seen as a "white" thing and that kind of thinking is setting kids back. That kind of thinking is racist and detrimental and needs to be dismantled. Giving a black kid a job just for being black isn't going to fix anything.

If we're going to have equality, that means everyone gets treated exactly the same. That means it doesn't matter what race someone is, or what gender they are, it means the employer looks for their abilities. It means the teachers and parents and people of the community also don't care. However, at the moment, we're being pushed to do the exact opposite. They actually want us to judge people based on their skin tone and ethnicity. So long as that happens, we cannot have equality, because so many people are bending over backwards to not be racist, that they're still treating people different based on their race.



I wonder about the definition of "white" because so many people have differing opinions. I'm not white yet I am. My Cherokee friend is white, yet isn't. My Roma/Italian/Sephardic Jewish/Mexican/African friend is white yet isn't. The Census says even people from North Africa and the Middle East are classified as "white" even if they don't identify as such, while white supremacists claim even the Irish and Polish are not white. This is a big picture, because people, individuals, are being judged for things beyond their control, even if they're trying to fix the problems. They are being told they are inherently racist and that there's nothing they can do about it and that they need to apologize for having this supposed privilege, while most people seem to not have a clue what privilege actually is. An incredibly rich black oppressor of the people from Haiti is considered oppressed in the US. It's ridiculous.



There is black privilege, just the same as white privilege. It depends on where you are, your economic status, and the scholarships and opportunities offered.



If we are going to have any sort of racial segregation then it must be equal across the board and white people must be allowed to have their own groups as well, without being called racist or disbanded for discrimination. Equality is treating everyone equally, and that means allowing white people the same crap.



Liberal morality that the SJWs are pushing is not based on science, it is based on what feels right. I have looked over their data, and it is skewed and full of misconceptions. Gun control arguments are often based on just looking at how scary guns are, and I'm tired of people ignoring actual stats and information that show exactly how ineffective or affective gun control laws can be. It is highly dependent on the country, happiness of the people, population density and diversity, education levels, poverty levels, etc.

Out of all the violent crimes committed in the US, only 8% are committed with a firearm, and only a fraction of those are committed with the rifles gun control advocates hate. So what are we going to do about the 92% of violent crimes not committed with a firearm? And why do gun control advocates love to add in suicides into the gun death numbers, when it's been shown time and time again there is no actual correlation between suicide rates and guns? The UK thought banning guns would help, but their suicide rates have skyrocketed. They're also trying to ban kitchen knives...

The only fear mongering I've found is from the people who won't look at the statistics and won't debate me with actual evidence. They instead turn to claiming incorrect information about me as if that will help their argument. I want stats, I want evidence, I want cold hard truths, not things based on emotional appeal.

kamiyu910 deserves a prize for being one of the most articulate and detailed posters on WP.

This point is true and very much under-appreciated. If you don't have it already, please add to your files the very important essay by Eric Raymond called "Gramscian Damage": http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=260

It was written in 2006 well before "SJW" became a term, but it outlines most of the core Leftist memes that now are associated with the SJW idea, and addresses their origins in Stalinist propaganda from the early/mid 20th century. Here's an extract from Raymond:

===================

In a previous post on Suicidalism, I identified some of the most important of the Soviet Union’s memetic weapons. Here is that list again:

--There is no truth, only competing agendas.
--All Western (and especially American) claims to moral superiority over Communism/Fascism/Islam are vitiated by the West’s history of racism and colonialism.
--There are no objective standards by which we may judge one culture to be better than another. Anyone who claims that there are such standards is an evil oppressor.
--The prosperity of the West is built on ruthless exploitation of the Third World; therefore Westerners actually deserve to be impoverished and miserable.
--Crime is the fault of society, not the individual criminal. Poor criminals are entitled to what they take. Submitting to criminal predation is more virtuous than resisting it.
--The poor are victims. Criminals are victims. And only victims are virtuous. Therefore only the poor and criminals are virtuous. (Rich people can borrow some virtue by identifying with poor people and criminals.)
--For a virtuous person, violence and war are never justified. It is always better to be a victim than to fight, or even to defend oneself. But ‘oppressed’ people are allowed to use violence anyway; they are merely reflecting the evil of their oppressors.
--When confronted with terror, the only moral course for a Westerner is to apologize for past sins, understand the terrorist’s point of view, and make concessions.

As I previously observed, if you trace any of these back far enough, you’ll find a Stalinist intellectual at the bottom. (The last two items on the list, for example, came to us courtesy of Frantz Fanon. The fourth item is the Baran-Wallerstein “world system” thesis.) Most were staples of Soviet propaganda at the same time they were being promoted by “progressives” (read: Marxists and the dupes of Marxists) within the Western intelligentsia.

===================

Last edited by Darmok on 23 Sep 2016, 10:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.