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Why haven't extraterrestrials made their presence known?

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Why haven't aliens made themselves known to us en masse?
They actually have but most people refuse to accept it 25%  25%  [ 20 ]
They think we are not ready for it 5%  5%  [ 4 ]
They think we are cruel/violent and don't deserve to know 9%  9%  [ 7 ]
They have a reason not to disclose that is unclear 6%  6%  [ 5 ]
Aliens have never visited Earth silly 56%  56%  [ 45 ]
Total votes : 81

techstepgenr8tion
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03 Feb 2012, 6:58 pm

Vigilans wrote:
There are a lot of people on Earth already who fear extraterrestrials, who think it would be detrimental to the Human race to have contact with them. That we could be colonized and enslaved. I think on other planets with sentient life that considers the possibility of life elsewhere they have this fear as well. It could be that when space faring civilizations meet they never get along. So perhaps aliens do not want to be found

Pshht...nah.

A society advanced enough to get here had to have developed AI a long time ago. They wouldn't need slaves if they already had AI or replicators handling all of that. Now, killing every man woman and child to strip the world for its resources - not likely but, it could happen.

Brings up another good point on why aliens wouldn't bother contacting us; if they already have sufficient technology to where scarcity doesn't exist - they've got no reason, especially knowing how utterly gross and clingy a level zero culture would be who's never met another race before.


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TeaEarlGreyHot
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03 Feb 2012, 7:04 pm

Why is the beginning of Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy now stuck in my head?


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03 Feb 2012, 7:15 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
There are a lot of people on Earth already who fear extraterrestrials, who think it would be detrimental to the Human race to have contact with them. That we could be colonized and enslaved. I think on other planets with sentient life that considers the possibility of life elsewhere they have this fear as well. It could be that when space faring civilizations meet they never get along. So perhaps aliens do not want to be found

Pshht...nah.

A society advanced enough to get here had to have developed AI a long time ago. They wouldn't need slaves if they already had AI or replicators handling all of that. Now, killing every man woman and child to strip the world for its resources - not likely but, it could happen.

Brings up another good point on why aliens wouldn't bother contacting us; if they already have sufficient technology to where scarcity doesn't exist - they've got no reason, especially knowing how utterly gross and clingy a level zero culture would be who's never met another race before.


I'm not talking about a society that can visit us but one that is at a similar level of development. Even a little bit more advanced. They probably had analogous experiences to human history where more advanced civilizations conquered less advanced ones.

I also suspect there are a great many intelligent civilizations that do not fit our criteria of "friendly". "Enslavement" can mean a lot of things. They might conquer planets and utilize the unique elements of it's environment to further themselves. To that end they might destroy human civilization but keep humans and/or other creatures and genetically engineer them to something we barely recognize but that serves their purposes, such as efficiently and rapidly stripping the planet of everything useful without them having to bring much equipment.

When there is no scarcity internally the entire purpose of this alien civilization becomes expansion as its population grows; another species is bound to get in the way at some point. I don't think there ever will be "no scarcity" as the more advanced we get the larger and more costly are the projects we will undertake. Scarcity on a personal/societal level might disappear but as a species we will always be hungry for more. I see no reason why it would not work this way for other civilizations


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03 Feb 2012, 7:18 pm

I think that there are almost certainly aliens.

And I think they're in the same boat as us. They can't contact us, and we can't contact them, because we're too far apart.



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03 Feb 2012, 7:20 pm

Vigilans wrote:
When there is no scarcity internally the entire purpose of this alien civilization becomes expansion as its population grows; another species is bound to get in the way at some point. I don't think there ever will be "no scarcity" as the more advanced we get the larger and more costly are the projects we will undertake. Scarcity on a personal/societal level might disappear but as a species we will always be hungry for more. I see no reason why it would not work this way for other civilizations

I'm really not sure if there's necessarily a bounds to where we'll even stop modifying ourselves or if we'll still have the urge, need, or drive to procreate the way we do if we're essentially set to live for thousands of years or even be immortal. A society at level 2 or 3 could just as easily aim for sustainability, terraform/colonize a few other planets as a disaster backup plan, and simply start becoming more and more like the aeons of the Nag Hammadi - abandon it all for the romance of reason, knowledge and attaining knowledge and wisdom ad infinitum.


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03 Feb 2012, 7:42 pm

Space travel doesn't occur until Tech Level 6.

Interstellar Travel doesn't appear until Tech Level 8.

We're currently at Tech Level 7.



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03 Feb 2012, 10:31 pm

Fnord wrote:
Space travel doesn't occur until Tech Level 6.

Interstellar Travel doesn't appear until Tech Level 8.

We're currently at Tech Level 7.


depends on the scale,
Quote:
Definition

In 1964, Kardashev defined three levels of civilizations, based on the order of magnitude of the amount of power available to them:

Type I: "technological level close to the level presently [1964] attained on earth, with energy consumption at ≈4×1019 erg/sec.[2] Guillermo A. Lemarchand stated this as "a level 'near' contemporary terrestrial civilization with an energy capability equivalent to the solar insolation on Earth, between 10 to the 16 power and 10 to the 17 power Watts."[3]
Type II: "a civilization capable of harnessing the energy radiated by its own star (for example, the stage of successful construction of a "Dyson sphere"); energy consumption at ≈4×1033 erg/sec.[2] Lemarchand stated this as "a civilization capable of utilizing and channeling the entire radiation output of its star. The energy utilization would then be comparable to the luminosity of our Sun, about 4 x 10 to the 26 power Watts."[3]

Type III: "a civilization in possession of energy on the scale of its own galaxy, with energy consumption at≈4×1044 erg/sec."[2] Lemarchand stated this as "a civilization with access to the power comparable to the luminosity of the entire Milky Way galaxy, about 4 x 10 to the 37 power Watts."[3]


your tech levels do coincide with alternity stardirve though


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03 Feb 2012, 10:42 pm

Earth is just one big reality show on alien holographic television somewhere. They haven't contacted us because they don't want to risk hurting the ratings of a successful show.



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03 Feb 2012, 11:07 pm

Mack27 wrote:
Earth is just one big reality show on alien holographic television somewhere. They haven't contacted us because they don't want to risk hurting the ratings of a successful show.


The Tru-Man Show



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03 Feb 2012, 11:46 pm

The first thing that popped into my head upon reading over this discussion was this:

Image


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04 Feb 2012, 1:23 pm

Oodain wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Space travel doesn't occur until Tech Level 6. Interstellar Travel doesn't appear until Tech Level 8. We're currently at Tech Level 7.
depends on the scale,

I use the Miller scale.

But I made a mistake. I was off by one point in two of the categories. Here are the correct values:

Space travel doesn't occur until Tech Level 7.

Interstellar Travel doesn't appear until Tech Level 9.

We're currently at Tech Level 7.



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04 Feb 2012, 1:42 pm

Fnord wrote:
Oodain wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Space travel doesn't occur until Tech Level 6. Interstellar Travel doesn't appear until Tech Level 8. We're currently at Tech Level 7.
depends on the scale,

I use the Miller scale.

But I made a mistake. I was off by one point in two of the categories. Here are the correct values:

Space travel doesn't occur until Tech Level 7.

Interstellar Travel doesn't appear until Tech Level 9.

We're currently at Tech Level 7.


What's that got to do with the Miller Scale?

Miller Scale


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04 Feb 2012, 2:02 pm

TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
Why is the beginning of Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy now stuck in my head?


:lol:



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04 Feb 2012, 2:02 pm

Plain and simple, we just don't know.

It's funny how people will project chances of existence for benevolent aliens off the Earth, but scoff at any chance of a benevolent god off the Earth.



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04 Feb 2012, 5:49 pm

shrox wrote:
Plain and simple, we just don't know.

It's funny how people will project chances of existence for benevolent aliens off the Earth, but scoff at any chance of a benevolent god off the Earth.


Here is something we know. There is not an iota of evidence indicating the non-terrestrials are here or have ever been here. Not a bit of evidence.

ruveyn



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04 Feb 2012, 6:09 pm

ruveyn wrote:
shrox wrote:
Plain and simple, we just don't know.

It's funny how people will project chances of existence for benevolent aliens off the Earth, but scoff at any chance of a benevolent god off the Earth.


Here is something we know. There is not an iota of evidence indicating the non-terrestrials are here or have ever been here. Not a bit of evidence.

ruveyn


Reliable evidence at any rate.

Some people will wax lyrical about their "evidence" supporting alien visitation.


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