Pat Condell: "The crisis of secularism"

Post Reply New Topic

Maybe because we declared war on them?
Do you not expect a nation to respond hostilely against an invading nation?

Neither the Muslim culture nor the Qur'an command that you run passenger plains into buildings or blow yourself up in a crowded plaza.

Slay the unbelievers wherever you find them:

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers. [87, Medina]

Make war on the infidels living in your neighbourhood:

9:123 Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy, and others beside them whom ye know not. Allah knoweth them. Whatsoever ye spend in the way of Allah it will be repaid to you in full, and ye will not be wronged. [113, Medina]

When opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them:

9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. [113, Medina]

Kill the Jews and the Christians if they do not convert to Islam or refuse to pay Jizya tax:

9:29 Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low. [113, Medina]

Any religion other than Islam is not acceptable:

3:85 And whoso seeketh as religion other than the Surrender (to Allah) it will not be accepted from him, and he will be a loser in the Hereafter. [89, Medina]

The Jews and the Christians are perverts; fight them:

9:30 And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they! [113, Medina]

Maim and crucify the infidels if they criticise Islam:

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom [112, Medina]

The infidels are unclean; do not let them into a mosque:

9:28 O ye who believe! The idolaters only are unclean. So let them not come near the Inviolable Place of Worship after this their year. If ye fear poverty (from the loss of their merchandise) Allah shall preserve you of His bounty if He will. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise. [113, Medina]

Be harsh with the unbelievers:

9:73 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. [113, Medina]

Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies:

22:19 These twain (the believers and the disbelievers) are two opponents who contend concerning their Lord. But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads. 22:20 Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted; 22:21 And for them are hooked rods of iron. 22:22 Whenever, in their anguish, they would go forth from thence they are driven back therein and (it is said unto them): Taste the doom of burning. [103, Medina]

The Jews and the Christians are in perpetual hostility to the Muslims:

2:137 And if they believe in the like of that which ye believe, then are they rightly guided. But if they turn away, then are they in schism, and Allah will suffice thee (for defence) against them. He is the Hearer, the Knower. [103, Medina]

Fight the unbelievers vigorously without any exception:

25:52 So obey not the disbelievers, but strive against them...with a great endeavour. [42, Mecca]

Be stern with the infidels:

66:9 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end. [107, Medina]

Do not hanker for peace with the infidels; behead them when you catch them:

47:4 Now when ye meet in battle those who disbelieve, then it is smiting of the necks until, when ye have routed them, then making fast of bonds; and afterward either grace or ransom till the war lay down its burdens. That (is the ordinance). And if Allah willed He could have punished them (without you) but (thus it is ordained) that He may try some of you by means of others. And those who are slain in the way of Allah, He rendereth not their actions vain. [95, Medina]

The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them:

8:65 O Prophet! Exhort the believers to fight. If there be of you twenty steadfast they shall overcome two hundred, and if there be of you a hundred (steadfast) they shall overcome a thousand of those who disbelieve, because they (the disbelievers) are a folk without intelligence. [88, Medina]

Muslims must not take the infidels as friends:

3:28 Let not the believers take disbelievers for their friends in preference to believers. Whoso doeth that hath no connection with Allah unless (it be) that ye but guard yourselves against them, taking (as it were) security. Allah biddeth you beware (only) of Himself. Unto Allah is the journeying.[89, Medina]

Terrorise and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur'an:

8:12 When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger. [88, Medina]

Muslims must muster all weapons to terrorise the infidels:

8:60 Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy, and others beside them whom ye know not. Allah knoweth them. Whatsoever ye spend in the way of Allah it will be repaid to you in full, and ye will not be wronged. [88, Medina]

You do understand that there's a difference between criticizing beliefs and hating people simply because of what a few dozen radicals did, don't you?

Neither the Muslim culture nor the Qur'an command that you run passenger plains into buildings or blow yourself up in a crowded plaza.
To hold an entire nation of people who for the most part want nothing to do with this responsible is pure ignorance.
To deny them their basic rights as human beings, to invade their country and murder innocent civilians, to torture innocent men until they lie and tell you what you want just for the slightest hope you will let them rot away in a cell.
This is hate and should not be tolerated let alone encouraged.

Maybe because we declared war on them?
Do you not expect a nation to respond hostilely against an invading nation?
I wonder, why does no one keep track of the amount of unfounded American attacks on innocent Muslim towns.
Why do we not take count of the innocent people we kill?

In my opinion "terrorists attacks" stopped being terrorist attacks when we declared war and counted a farmer defending his children from us as a terrorist attack.

You might want to recheck your history as even with my very pitiful knowledge of it I know that Christians have along rich history of terror.
They very often killed those who would not convert and went on righteous crusades and holy wars in the name of god.

That is a good enough reason for me criticize at least the Wahabi sect for promoting terrorism.

You've swallowed the extremist Islamic dogma wholesale.

And Islam is a "nation" now? Jesus Christ. Any other Islamist apologia you want to utter?

Who declared war on who? From where I see it, murdering 2,996 people is pretty much a declaration of war. Bear in this mind that this was before the U.S./UK had invaded either Iraq or Afghanistan. These people are murderers, no two ways about it.

Really, Islam is the state of barbarous savages using their book to inflict pain, misery, suffering and death on others. The sooner that Muslim countries are secularised and liberalised the better for nearly everyone living in those countries, Muslim and non-Muslim alike. Only the religious bullies have anything to fear.

Nearly 20,000 Islamic terrorist attacks have been committed since 11 September 2001.

There have been very, very few Christian terrorists. Even the likes of Breivik and McVeigh couldn't be called "Christian" terrorists. And Northern Ireland wasn't a religious conflict either, but a national one.

This is double standards at its best. The majority of those "Islamic terrorist attacks" are exactly the same as the Troubles, between factions who differ in many ways, the most obvious of which is the particular branch of their religion they follow. I actually agree with you about the Troubles being more to do with nationalism and the general conflict of groups than "you have fancy churches and idolise Mary, plain churches and Jesus ftw!", but I think the same is true of the struggles between Shia and Sunni in Iraq, or the south Thailand conflict.

Many of the other "Islamic terrorist attacks" are acts of war against an invading army, unfortunately the guerillas are generally less restrained than British, American and NATO troops tend to be.

So basically,
Muslim commits a terrorist attack= "ISLAMIC TERRORISM"
Christian commits a terrorist attack= "oh no, you have to look at their motivation..."

Who declared war on who? From where I see it, murdering 2,996 people is pretty much a declaration of war. Bear in this mind that this was before the U.S./UK had invaded either Iraq or Afghanistan.

This is double standards at its best.

The majority of those "Islamic terrorist attacks" are exactly the same as the Troubles

At what point is it not from 'Christian' belief? Because they're not directly backing up their act with a passage from the Bible?

Yes, that's exactly right.

Yes, that's exactly right.

Also, anyone - does the UK have a Christian armed forces? The Queen is our head of state as appointed by God (the Christian one), we are, as the Prime Minister observed, a Christian country, and they fight on behalf of Her Majesty and the country.

No, they're not. Islamist terrorist attacks on a sectarian level are usually to do with a sect of Islam - i.e. Sunni v Shia, without major other factors going on. In Northern Ireland, the sect you're from is a communal and ethnic marker (and people mistakenly attribute political opinions to that marker that may not actually be in evidence - i.e. there are Nationalists from Protestant backgrounds - hell, we have a Protestant Irish Nationalist on this website! - and Unionists from Catholic backgrounds). Due to history though, certain religious sects have been correlated with national identity in Ireland.

Is Islamic terrorism bound up with similar things - i.e. ethnicity? Or is it purely religious sectarianism? I bet it's the latter. Therefore, Islamic terrorism is mainly religious in nature.