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why does america have to be great

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nurseangela
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10 Nov 2016, 7:33 pm

anagram wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
I was reading how Brazil was when you had the Olympics going on. Are things bad there ?

the economy is supposedly at its lowest since 1930, but honestly i don't see it. i wouldn't even know it if i hadn't heard about it on tv. everything seems normal to me. we had local elections just last month, and everything seemed normal. people talked all the time about "THE CRISIS!!" when i was in italy, but i don't see that going on here. goes to show how the usual economic indicators mean very little

whatever "crisis" this is (it technically is a pretty bad recession), it's absolutely nothing compared to what things were like in the 80s and early 90s. those were crazy times. now i have money in the bank that i'm saving for my eventual early retirement, the interest rate looks pretty good, and i see no reason to be afraid of anything happening to my money. the economy has been stable for 20 years (and, ironically but probably not coincidentally, it was actually doing pretty well following the american crisis in 2008)


If I may ask, what sort of interest are you getting? Ours suck. I think the last I saw on a cd when I rolled it over for 5 yrs was like 2%.


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nurseangela
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10 Nov 2016, 7:36 pm

anagram wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
I was reading how Brazil was when you had the Olympics going on. Are things bad there ?

the economy is supposedly at its lowest since 1930, but honestly i don't see it. i wouldn't even know it if i hadn't heard about it on tv. everything seems normal to me. we had local elections just last month, and everything seemed normal. people talked all the time about "THE CRISIS!!" when i was in italy, but i don't see that going on here. goes to show how the usual economic indicators mean very little

whatever "crisis" this is (it technically is a pretty bad recession), it's absolutely nothing compared to what things were like in the 80s and early 90s. those were crazy times. now i have money in the bank that i'm saving for my eventual early retirement, the interest rate looks pretty good, and i see no reason to be afraid of anything happening to my money. the economy has been stable for 20 years (and, ironically but probably not coincidentally, it was actually doing pretty well following the american crisis in 2008)



That bothered me when you said those kids laughed when 9/11 happened. What do you guys really think of us?


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10 Nov 2016, 7:40 pm

TheSpectrum wrote:
Yeah, what angela said. Is it any better now? We opted not to see family in Rio due to the political problems and all the muggings and protests.

there has only been a couple of slightly alarming protests here and there, but it hasn't escalated, and things seem to have cooled down. people here have a short memory (thankfully, in this case). the vast majority of protests (and some were huge) have been entirely peaceful

more on that:
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=332313&p=7358785#p7358785

the muggings... well, it's rio. it's a crappy city :shrug:. it's the way it's always been (probably largely because of those historical developments that i mentioned earlier in this thread. royalty and nobility invaded the city and displaced all the poor to the hills scattered throughout the city, where they live to this day, and the state still hasn't taken control of all those areas back from drug lords, though it seems like soon they will have)

fortunately i'm not from rio though. i would never choose to live there. i think few people from my state would


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10 Nov 2016, 7:57 pm

nurseangela wrote:
If I may ask, what sort of interest are you getting? Ours suck. I think the last I saw on a cd when I rolled it over for 5 yrs was like 2%.

right now i'm getting about 4% effective annual interest

nurseangela wrote:
That bothered me when you said those kids laughed when 9/11 happened. What do you guys really think of us?

i know, right? it should bother you if you care that much about how the world sees your country. i meant that as a reality check for you

back when i was little, everybody's dream here seemed to be to migrate to the u.s., but, today, not so much. people are still jealous of the whole "first-world" thing of course, but still the general consensus seems to be that "americans are a paranoid and backwards people". also the u.s. has a terrible reputation for how it treats even middle-class brazilian tourists. horror stories, really. like minors being detained by immigration agents for like a week or two for absolutely no reason, being treated like criminals, being told they weren't allowed to use phones, and being given no information on what on earth was even going on to begin with. all that after having gone through all the pain of getting a tourist visa. which is a pain

meanwhile, we don't even need a visa to visit europe. you do the math...

under trump's administration, i wouldn't even think about visiting the country at all. the only reason why i still consider the idea (i have a friend there), is because i'm also a european citizen


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nurseangela
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10 Nov 2016, 8:04 pm

anagram wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
If I may ask, what sort of interest are you getting? Ours suck. I think the last I saw on a cd when I rolled it over for 5 yrs was like 2%.

right now i'm getting about 4% effective interest

nurseangela wrote:
That bothered me when you said those kids laughed when 9/11 happened. What do you guys really think of us?

i know, right? it should bother you if you care that much about how the world sees your country. i meant that as a reality check for you

back when i was little, everybody's dream here seemed to be to migrate to the u.s., but, today, not so much. people are still jealous of the whole "first-world" thing of course, but still the general consensus seems to be that "americans are a paranoid and backwards people". also the u.s. has a terrible reputation for how it treats even middle-class brazilian tourists. horror stories, really. like minors being detained by immigration agents for like a week or two for absolutely no reason, being treated like criminals, being told they weren't allowed to use phones, and being given no information on earth was going on to begin with

meanwhile, we don't even need a visa to visit europe. you do the math...

under trump's administration, i wouldn't even think about visiting the country at all. the only reason why i still consider the idea (i have a friend there), is because i'm also a european citizen


OK, so if you did live here, wouldn't you want it back to what it used to be? What's different now that you guys don't want to live here anymore and what would you do to change it back to the way it was?



(Wow, 4%! My parents would die to get 4% again, I'll have to ask Ma again about that)


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10 Nov 2016, 8:15 pm

nurseangela wrote:
OK, so if you did live here, wouldn't you want it back to what it used to be? What's different now that you guys don't want to live here anymore and what would you do to change it back to the way it was?

it's simple: greener grass on the other side of the fence. we used to watch american stuff on tv, and it was pretty. and things here weren't pretty. that's pretty much it. now we see news about the u.s. on tv and we think "yikes! i'm so glad i don't live there", and the economy here (despite the temporary low) is pretty solid, all things considered

things have improved a lot in the last 20 years. i have a friend who's been living in belgium for some time. she has money, she has a bunch of degrees, she has a good job, she's married to a belgian guy, she's fluent in the language, she's a citizen by now, but still, she says she wants to come back. we don't have the infrastructure that countries like belgium do, of course, but we have nowhere near as much to be concerned about as they do. and they're a pretty grumpy bunch, as it seems. she's tired of it. so the choice isn't as straightforward as it used to seem. it's a matter of priorities


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Last edited by anagram on 10 Nov 2016, 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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10 Nov 2016, 8:25 pm

"what happened to the u.s.", i think, was the backlash of your own foreign policy. that's what you're paying for now. it's not "going back to what it was", because it was an illusion, just like the initial "miracle" of the european union. the world has changed

the way to make it better again, in my opinion, is to play nice for a change. play nice with other countries, and play nice with other demographic groups in your own country. get used to not having everything your way. accept compromises as an inevitable reality. if you don't... you're doomed


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10 Nov 2016, 8:26 pm

anagram wrote:
"what happened to the u.s.", i think, was the backlash of your own foreign policy. that's what you're paying for now. it's not "going back to what it was", because it was an illusion, just like the initial "miracle" of the european union. the world has changed. but the way to make it better again, in my opinion, is to play nice for a change. play nice with other countries, and play nice with other demographic groups in your own country. get used to not having everything your way. accept compromises as an inevitable reality. if you don't... you're doomed

it is my considered opinion that it is too late for that. we crossed a rubicon on the 8th. no turning back.



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10 Nov 2016, 8:30 pm

auntblabby wrote:
it is my considered opinion that it is too late for that. we crossed a rubicon on the 8th. no turning back.

well, if so, then there's nothing to do about it, so it's nothing to worry about either. just take a deep breath and face it when it comes. just like "the nuclear apocalypse". it's not like i have any anti-icbm in my closet... so, whatever. i'll just go on living my life, and those thoughts are simply irrelevant. i think it's much easier to see the bright side of things when you look at them this way. and it's not the end of the world yet. we won't see it coming when it is


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10 Nov 2016, 8:35 pm

Oh brother. I agree that's it's probably too late and you got the number "8" right, but it's the last 8 yrs of Obama. He ruined us. Racking up all that debt that we'll never be able to repay. The damn Obamacare mess. Letting in all of the illegal immigrants just so he could get their votes. It was his freaking plan all along to bring us down from the inside. It sure as hell worked. All we can do is pray now that Trump can do a miracle. I do believe in miracles.


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10 Nov 2016, 9:13 pm

anagram wrote:
sly279 wrote:
Because no one looks at nk cities and say wow how nice. Our infrastructure has been decaying and our power grid is super vulnerable. We've been too cheap and neglected it all. I've heard our airports are like 3rd world compared to European or Asian airports.

Also this whole anti freedom trend from the far left last 8 years has been horrible.

that's more like the "great place to live" sense that i meant. that makes sense. but... "great nation", not so much. because, if "being a great nation" does correlate with "being a great place to live" at all, it's only by making things far more complicated, shifting priorities from domestic infrastructure and welfare to interventionist priorities that benefit no one other than the few behind the curtain

and again: maybe asian and european airports are better than american ones. but that says very little about how good the american ones are. there is no need to be number one at everything. and, in fact, no one can be. growing up here in south america we tend to get used to the idea that everything is better elsewhere, simply because it's the natural order of the universe. but after being to three different continents myself, i've learned not to take for granted the things i have here but didn't have in those so-called first-world places

Has to say we haven't upgraded them since before I was born. Stuff has life spans and technology with planes and stuff has changed a lot the airport needs to too.

A bunch of people with guns could take out California power system. It's super old tech and insecure. It'd cost everyone a $2 a month to upgrade and secure our power grid so so extremist or nation doesn't shut our grid down for years and watches as we scramble, starve and freeze to death.



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10 Nov 2016, 9:18 pm

sly279 wrote:
anagram wrote:
sly279 wrote:
Because no one looks at nk cities and say wow how nice. Our infrastructure has been decaying and our power grid is super vulnerable. We've been too cheap and neglected it all. I've heard our airports are like 3rd world compared to European or Asian airports.

Also this whole anti freedom trend from the far left last 8 years has been horrible.

that's more like the "great place to live" sense that i meant. that makes sense. but... "great nation", not so much. because, if "being a great nation" does correlate with "being a great place to live" at all, it's only by making things far more complicated, shifting priorities from domestic infrastructure and welfare to interventionist priorities that benefit no one other than the few behind the curtain

and again: maybe asian and european airports are better than american ones. but that says very little about how good the american ones are. there is no need to be number one at everything. and, in fact, no one can be. growing up here in south america we tend to get used to the idea that everything is better elsewhere, simply because it's the natural order of the universe. but after being to three different continents myself, i've learned not to take for granted the things i have here but didn't have in those so-called first-world places

Has to say we haven't upgraded them since before I was born. Stuff has life spans and technology with planes and stuff has changed a lot the airport needs to too.

A bunch of people with guns could take out California power system. It's super old tech and insecure. It'd cost everyone a $2 a month to upgrade and secure our power grid so so extremist or nation doesn't shut our grid down for years and watches as we scramble, starve and freeze to death.

I can't help but believe there's an ulterior motive behind the PTB's refusal to harden our grid.



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10 Nov 2016, 11:02 pm

on a side note, i'm pleasantly surprised by how this didn't actually turn into a shitstorm


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auntblabby
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10 Nov 2016, 11:15 pm

anagram wrote:
on a side note, i'm pleasantly surprised by how this didn't actually turn into a shitstorm

the night is still young yet.



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10 Nov 2016, 11:16 pm

auntblabby wrote:
the night is still young yet.

:lol:

well, an entire 24 hours is surprising enough


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auntblabby
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10 Nov 2016, 11:30 pm

anagram wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
the night is still young yet.

:lol: well, an entire 24 hours is surprising enough

this all is the sideshow- the drama won't really begin until after inauguration day here.