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Do you, a free person, see Muslim females as slaves?

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Yo El
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19 Mar 2017, 12:48 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
Many of your comments were discouraging to me, too. You can just start with research. Look, I'm not an expert on coddling young people, but I have been 17, and I would have just kept on making ridiculously uninformed comments of my own if I hadn't learned that it has consequences.
Good point, and I'm sorry.



jrjones9933
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19 Mar 2017, 12:49 pm

Yo El wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
Many of your comments were discouraging to me, too. You can just start with research. Look, I'm not an expert on coddling young people, but I have been 17, and I would have just kept on making ridiculously uninformed comments of my own if I hadn't learned that it has consequences.
Good point, and I'm sorry.

I didn't mean to make you feel bad in any lasting way, I promise. I hope we can have better discussions in the future.


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the_phoenix
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19 Mar 2017, 1:20 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
On an individual level, I smile at women wearing hijab if they make eye contact with me. I don't try to initiate eye contact, unless I feel unusually happy and friendly.

However, I would always prefer to patronize businesses which forbid any religious expression in the public area. Personally, the whole idea of the hijab disgusts me, modesty disgusts me, and the kind of religion which boils down to believing it because some old douchebag said it disgusts me beyond my ability to decently express.


You do realize that some would call you racist for these types of remarks?



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19 Mar 2017, 1:24 pm

the_phoenix wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
On an individual level, I smile at women wearing hijab if they make eye contact with me. I don't try to initiate eye contact, unless I feel unusually happy and friendly.

However, I would always prefer to patronize businesses which forbid any religious expression in the public area. Personally, the whole idea of the hijab disgusts me, modesty disgusts me, and the kind of religion which boils down to believing it because some old douchebag said it disgusts me beyond my ability to decently express.


You do realize that some would call you racist for these types of remarks?

Islam isn't a race. He seems to have problems with all religions. Jones sorry if I am misrepresenting you though.



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19 Mar 2017, 1:26 pm

BettaPonic wrote:
the_phoenix wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
On an individual level, I smile at women wearing hijab if they make eye contact with me. I don't try to initiate eye contact, unless I feel unusually happy and friendly.

However, I would always prefer to patronize businesses which forbid any religious expression in the public area. Personally, the whole idea of the hijab disgusts me, modesty disgusts me, and the kind of religion which boils down to believing it because some old douchebag said it disgusts me beyond my ability to decently express.

You do realize that some would call you racist for these types of remarks?

Islam isn't a race. He seems to have problems with all religions. Jones sorry if I am misrepresenting you though.

Oh. Well, if this is more a matter of identity politics, that's another thing altogether. Much more fluid and less defined.


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jrjones9933
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19 Mar 2017, 1:31 pm

Someone could call me a religious bigot for saying it, I guess. If they wanted to press the issue, I expect that I could cast imprecations on as many other religions as they care to name, with perfect philosophical integrity. I expect that I could even find some atheists using scientific sexism to oppress women and express my disgust with that, too.

If they want to keep calling me a bigot after all that, I really can't argue any further.


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the_phoenix
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19 Mar 2017, 1:31 pm

BettaPonic wrote:
the_phoenix wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
On an individual level, I smile at women wearing hijab if they make eye contact with me. I don't try to initiate eye contact, unless I feel unusually happy and friendly.

However, I would always prefer to patronize businesses which forbid any religious expression in the public area. Personally, the whole idea of the hijab disgusts me, modesty disgusts me, and the kind of religion which boils down to believing it because some old douchebag said it disgusts me beyond my ability to decently express.


You do realize that some would call you racist for these types of remarks?

Islam isn't a race. He seems to have problems with all religions. Jones sorry if I am misrepresenting you though.


In fact, I totally agree with you, BettaPonic.

Am just pointing out that there are leftists who will make the accusation of racism when it comes to criticizing Islam.

...



jrjones9933
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19 Mar 2017, 1:33 pm

Some criticisms of Islam are racist.

For example, honor killings vs domestic violence. There's not much difference to the dead people.


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the_phoenix
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19 Mar 2017, 1:35 pm

AspieUtah wrote:
BettaPonic wrote:
the_phoenix wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
On an individual level, I smile at women wearing hijab if they make eye contact with me. I don't try to initiate eye contact, unless I feel unusually happy and friendly.

However, I would always prefer to patronize businesses which forbid any religious expression in the public area. Personally, the whole idea of the hijab disgusts me, modesty disgusts me, and the kind of religion which boils down to believing it because some old douchebag said it disgusts me beyond my ability to decently express.

You do realize that some would call you racist for these types of remarks?

Islam isn't a race. He seems to have problems with all religions. Jones sorry if I am misrepresenting you though.

Oh. Well, if this is more a matter of identity politics, that's another thing altogether. Much more fluid and less defined.


Am just pointing out how some would react is all.
In fact, I think that people should be allowed to disagree about things without being called racist.
(Or Nazi, homophobe, sexist, etc., etc., etc. ...)



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19 Mar 2017, 1:38 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
Someone could call me a religious bigot for saying it, I guess. If they wanted to press the issue, I expect that I could cast imprecations on as many other religions as they care to name, with perfect philosophical integrity. I expect that I could even find some atheists using scientific sexism to oppress women and express my disgust with that, too.

If they want to keep calling me a bigot after all that, I really can't argue any further.


Noted ... and understood.



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19 Mar 2017, 1:40 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
Some criticisms of Islam are racist.

For example, honor killings vs domestic violence. There's not much difference to the dead people.


But if, as BettaPonic says, Islam is not a race ... then how is mentioning honor killings vs. domestic violence racist?



Jacoby
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19 Mar 2017, 1:44 pm

Subjugated is probably a more accurate than slave altho slavery including sex slavery are authorized in Islam, that is how Muhammed lived.



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19 Mar 2017, 1:47 pm

the_phoenix wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
Some criticisms of Islam are racist.

For example, honor killings vs domestic violence. There's not much difference to the dead people.


But if, as BettaPonic says, Islam is not a race ... then how is mentioning honor killings vs. domestic violence racist?

Criticizing behavior in one race while tolerating very similar behavior in another race is definitely racist. It's not as obvious as riding around in hooded pajamas, but it forms the racist foundation for Jim Crow, the Southern Strategy, the War on Drugs, and it shows the racism of politicians who vote against protections against domestic violence which mostly affect their own race, while frothing at the mouth condemning similar domestic violence in muslim countries. All of those represent racist double standards.

ETA: the point is that among demagogues and their followers, the image of the muslim is always dark-skinned. Let's not look at it through rose-colored glasses when it comes to demagoguery on either side.


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19 Mar 2017, 1:53 pm

People seem to find it very easy to mix up the moral codes of Islam with the laws of a country.



jrjones9933
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19 Mar 2017, 1:55 pm

Biscuitman wrote:
People seem to find it very easy to mix up the moral codes of Islam with the laws of a country.

Theocracies tend to reinforce that view.


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19 Mar 2017, 1:58 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
People seem to find it very easy to mix up the moral codes of Islam with the laws of a country.

Theocracies tend to reinforce that view.

Agreed, especially when those codes are in the religion.