13 Jun 2019, 9:15 am
Wolfram87 wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
To criticize would be to disrespect.
Now there's a notion worthy of outright rejection.
Sadly, yes.
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
I've met many Christians who I thought were despicable, but then again I can say the same for many Atheists I have known too. However at the same time I have met a few on both ends who seemed nice enough.
I'm not despicable.
My mother had me tested.
kraftiekortie wrote:
To criticize directly one’s faith is disrespectful.
To criticize “a” faith is not.
To criticize “a” faith is not.
Yep, around this autistic website, you really have to go nude and declare those hidden qualifiers.
Last edited by Pepe on 13 Jun 2019, 9:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
13 Jun 2019, 9:19 am
Pepe wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
I’m not seeking to shake anybody’s faith.
I’m just conveying my views on the matter of religion.
You have your notion, which has arisen out of your life experiences. To criticize would be to disrespect.
I’m just conveying my views on the matter of religion.
You have your notion, which has arisen out of your life experiences. To criticize would be to disrespect.
This is pretty much my position except for the last bit.
Context: General open discussion. Not a debating situation.
If a philosophy works for someone else, why try and change it? <shrug>
Whatever floats your boat.
Whatever bakes your cookies.
It is unmitigated arrogance to try and change the view of someone if that view isn't self-destructive or is not harmful to other people.
I too will speak my mind but I do go out of my way not to make it personal.
There is a difference between making a general comment and directing that comment specifically to an individual.
Also consider:
If we were to be constrained from making our opinions known, which may be in disharmony to someone else's, then more than likely there wouldn't be discussion groups like this one.
In regards to disrespecting a POV:
This old adage says it well:
I respect the right of others to have an opinion, but I reserve the right not to respect those opinions.
I'll dust off my default example:
The ancient Aztec priest has a right to his opinion.
I just happen to believe his belief in human sacrifice is scheiße.
For me, it would depend on the person he was sacrificing...
It’s hard for these conversations not to become personal because, when it comes to matters of faith, people tend to take things very personally.
13 Jun 2019, 9:22 am
cyberdad wrote:
Anyone looking for god should read this article
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/vv7b ... ed-into-ai
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/vv7b ... ed-into-ai
Alien Gods like Cthulhu?
13 Jun 2019, 9:39 am
Twilightprincess wrote:
Pepe wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
I’m not seeking to shake anybody’s faith.
I’m just conveying my views on the matter of religion.
You have your notion, which has arisen out of your life experiences. To criticize would be to disrespect.
I’m just conveying my views on the matter of religion.
You have your notion, which has arisen out of your life experiences. To criticize would be to disrespect.
This is pretty much my position except for the last bit.
Context: General open discussion. Not a debating situation.
If a philosophy works for someone else, why try and change it? <shrug>
Whatever floats your boat.
Whatever bakes your cookies.
It is unmitigated arrogance to try and change the view of someone if that view isn't self-destructive or is not harmful to other people.
I too will speak my mind but I do go out of my way not to make it personal.
There is a difference between making a general comment and directing that comment specifically to an individual.
Also consider:
If we were to be constrained from making our opinions known, which may be in disharmony to someone else's, then more than likely there wouldn't be discussion groups like this one.
In regards to disrespecting a POV:
This old adage says it well:
I respect the right of others to have an opinion, but I reserve the right not to respect those opinions.
I'll dust off my default example:
The ancient Aztec priest has a right to his opinion.
I just happen to believe his belief in human sacrifice is scheiße.
Twilightprincess wrote:
For me, it would depend on the person he was sacrificing...
Twilightprincess wrote:
It’s hard for these conversations not to become personal because, when it comes to matters of faith, people tend to take things very personally.
That is the problem.
Faith/spirituality/religion are philosophies designed to service the emotions.
Atheism, on the other hand, is a purely rational philosophy first and foremost.
THEN comes arrogance/superciliousness/self-importance/narcissism/patronisation.
13 Jun 2019, 9:42 am
Pepe wrote:
That is the problem.
Faith/spirituality/religion are philosophies designed to service the emotions.
Atheism, on the other hand, is a purely rational philosophy first and foremost.
THEN comes arrogance/superciliousness/self-importance/narcissism/patronisation.
Faith/spirituality/religion are philosophies designed to service the emotions.
Atheism, on the other hand, is a purely rational philosophy first and foremost.
THEN comes arrogance/superciliousness/self-importance/narcissism/patronisation.
It's superciliousarropatroimortanarcissistic! Even though the sound of it is something quite sadistic!
13 Jun 2019, 9:50 am
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
Pepe wrote:
That is the problem.
Faith/spirituality/religion are philosophies designed to service the emotions.
Atheism, on the other hand, is a purely rational philosophy first and foremost.
THEN comes arrogance/superciliousness/self-importance/narcissism/patronisation.
Faith/spirituality/religion are philosophies designed to service the emotions.
Atheism, on the other hand, is a purely rational philosophy first and foremost.
THEN comes arrogance/superciliousness/self-importance/narcissism/patronisation.
It's superciliousarropatroimortanarcissistic! Even though the sound of it is something quite sadistic!
13 Jun 2019, 10:48 am
13 Jun 2019, 11:15 am
Twilightprincess wrote:
I tend not to think in absolutes. In other words, I can’t be entirely sure that there isn’t a god although I lean towards atheism and am fairly certain that there isn’t one, especially a loving god. I personally can’t see how there could be a loving god when I think of the horrible suffering lots of people have experienced. How could a loving deity allow atrocities to occur without intervening? I’m well-versed in Bible-lore, but the biblical reason was never good enough for me.
I suppose something could’ve got the universe rolling and then lost interest and left us to ourselves, but it’s more productive to focus on science and the things that can be gleaned from research and evidence.
Or else we could get sucked down the rabbit hole of what ifs. What if my subjective reality isn’t even real?
I suppose something could’ve got the universe rolling and then lost interest and left us to ourselves, but it’s more productive to focus on science and the things that can be gleaned from research and evidence.
Or else we could get sucked down the rabbit hole of what ifs. What if my subjective reality isn’t even real?
Humanity tries to make sense of the life system's chaos and, well, nonsense.
Atheists have a pretty good go of it.
Theologians, on the other hand, are trying to put lipstick on a pig and call it pretty.
Don't get me wrong.
I do like pigs.
Particularly with BBQ sauce.
Some of my best friends are pigs.
And even though they run around naked, need a shave and roll around in their own kaka, they are people too and I meant no disrespect.
(God! this political correctness scheisse is killing me. <slightly depressed>)
I hope that clears things up.
Which reminds me of a joke:
Q: What do you give an adolescent piglet?
A: Oinkment. <boom tish>
P.S.
Pigs are "pretty" in their own way.
No offence intended. <sigh>
Oi vey!
P.P.S.
Regarding: "ifs and buts":
https://youtu.be/UdDk6E3AtbQ
Last edited by Pepe on 13 Jun 2019, 11:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
13 Jun 2019, 11:15 am
Twilightprincess wrote:
I tend not to think in absolutes. In other words, I can’t be entirely sure that there isn’t a god although I lean towards atheism and am fairly certain that there isn’t one, especially a loving god. I personally can’t see how there could be a loving god when I think of the horrible suffering lots of people have experienced. How could a loving deity allow atrocities to occur without intervening? I’m well-versed in Bible-lore, but the biblical reason was never good enough for me. (Of course, I think there’s a very small chance that I could be wrong, so I try to avoid arrogance.)
I suppose something could’ve got the universe rolling and then lost interest and left us to ourselves, but it’s more productive to focus on science and the things that can be gleaned from research and evidence.
Or else we could get sucked down the rabbit hole of what ifs. What if my subjective reality isn’t even real?
I suppose something could’ve got the universe rolling and then lost interest and left us to ourselves, but it’s more productive to focus on science and the things that can be gleaned from research and evidence.
Or else we could get sucked down the rabbit hole of what ifs. What if my subjective reality isn’t even real?
The thing that annoys me most about bible stories is that they are often stories of god and his followers doing horrible and cruel things to people, and I'm sorry but "Don't question these things because God is perfect!" is just not a good enough excuse for me.
The Abrahamic religions (Christianity, Islam, and even Judiasm) have always claimed to be religions of love and peace and they are ANYTHING but in my honest opinion. Even Satanists are more peace-loving than these guys. That really is no joke!
13 Jun 2019, 5:47 pm
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
The thing that annoys me most about bible stories is that they are often stories of god and his followers doing horrible and cruel things to people, and I'm sorry but "Don't question these things because God is perfect!" is just not a good enough excuse for me.
I am a little more concerned that an omnipotent being (god) is capable of genocide, tantrums and changing his mind. The Abrahmic religions operate on fear, brainwashed christians in Roman times happily let themselves be martyred in blood sports a little bit like followers of christian cults being involved in mass suicide or blindly obeying opportunistic leaders.
But judeo-christian ethics did provide the legal foundation of morals and standards in our relatively stable society. So why rock the boat
13 Jun 2019, 5:50 pm
cyberdad wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
The thing that annoys me most about bible stories is that they are often stories of god and his followers doing horrible and cruel things to people, and I'm sorry but "Don't question these things because God is perfect!" is just not a good enough excuse for me.
I am a little more concerned that an omnipotent being (god) is capable of genocide, tantrums and changing his mind. The Abrahmic religions operate on fear, brainwashed christians in Roman times happily let themselves be martyred in blood sports a little bit like followers of christian cults being involved in mass suicide or blindly obeying opportunistic leaders.
But judeo-christian ethics did provide the legal foundation of morals and standards in our relatively stable society. So why rock the boat
I dunno, for some reason I just don't trust them.
13 Jun 2019, 6:04 pm
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
The thing that annoys me most about bible stories is that they are often stories of god and his followers doing horrible and cruel things to people, and I'm sorry but "Don't question these things because God is perfect!" is just not a good enough excuse for me.
I am a little more concerned that an omnipotent being (god) is capable of genocide, tantrums and changing his mind. The Abrahmic religions operate on fear, brainwashed christians in Roman times happily let themselves be martyred in blood sports a little bit like followers of christian cults being involved in mass suicide or blindly obeying opportunistic leaders.
But judeo-christian ethics did provide the legal foundation of morals and standards in our relatively stable society. So why rock the boat
I dunno, for some reason I just don't trust them.
We don't have a choice...the laws we live under were formed by bible thumping christians
13 Jun 2019, 6:17 pm
cyberdad wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
The thing that annoys me most about bible stories is that they are often stories of god and his followers doing horrible and cruel things to people, and I'm sorry but "Don't question these things because God is perfect!" is just not a good enough excuse for me.
I am a little more concerned that an omnipotent being (god) is capable of genocide, tantrums and changing his mind. The Abrahmic religions operate on fear, brainwashed christians in Roman times happily let themselves be martyred in blood sports a little bit like followers of christian cults being involved in mass suicide or blindly obeying opportunistic leaders.
But judeo-christian ethics did provide the legal foundation of morals and standards in our relatively stable society. So why rock the boat
I dunno, for some reason I just don't trust them.
We don't have a choice...the laws we live under were formed by bible thumping christians
I know, the very same Christians who used to burn people just like me at the stake for being homosexual or non-Christian. I guess that's why I don't trust them.
My biggest fear is going back to the dark ages when it was OK to do that s**t. If Mike Pence ever becomes president I feel that he would want things that way in this country and that scares me.
13 Jun 2019, 6:22 pm
13 Jun 2019, 6:29 pm
cyberdad wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
I know, the very same Christians who used to burn people just like me at the stake for being homosexual or non-Christian. I guess that's why I don't trust them.
My biggest fear is going back to the dark ages when it was OK to do that s**t. If Mike Pence ever becomes president I feel that he would want things that way ib this country and that scares me.
My biggest fear is going back to the dark ages when it was OK to do that s**t. If Mike Pence ever becomes president I feel that he would want things that way ib this country and that scares me.
It's up to the American people how far they go with this Trump/Pence experiment. The christian right seems to closing ranks these days (although Trump himself is hardly a poster boy for christian values).
Here in Australia our conservative coalition won another election and have started doing unpalatable things like remove anti-bullying programs in schools (safe schools program) that were designed to protect LGBTQI students who are at high risk of suicide. The premise is that "normal" kids shouldn't be exposed to homosexuality in education.
They are are also allowing schools to sack teachers or expel students who are homosexual. Seems to be a sign of the times that old ways of thinking are being normalised again.
That really is f****d up. I guess things are getting bad not just in the US but in the UK and Australia too.
I feel that something bad is going to happen soon...
13 Jun 2019, 9:31 pm
cyberdad wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
The thing that annoys me most about bible stories is that they are often stories of god and his followers doing horrible and cruel things to people, and I'm sorry but "Don't question these things because God is perfect!" is just not a good enough excuse for me.
I am a little more concerned that an omnipotent being (god) is capable of genocide, tantrums and changing his mind. The Abrahmic religions operate on fear, brainwashed christians in Roman times happily let themselves be martyred in blood sports a little bit like followers of christian cults being involved in mass suicide or blindly obeying opportunistic leaders.
But judeo-christian ethics did provide the legal foundation of morals and standards in our relatively stable society. So why rock the boat
At least most people have higher expectations when it comes to people’s behavior than God’s. We’d be in a real pickle otherwise.
