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Why people with ASD / Autism / AS should not be a neo nazi

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malavois
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23 Oct 2020, 11:46 am

carlos55 wrote:
One of the most peculiar things in politics is why nazi’s are called “far right”

Hitler was a racist socialist, he was a member of the National Socialist Party in the 30’s.

In the UK we had the BNP which was labeled “far right” again his policies were socialist and on the left.


North Korea is officially called The Democratic People’s Republic of Korea. There is also the Democratic Republic of Congo. They are most certainly NOT democracies. It’s propaganda and misdirection.



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23 Oct 2020, 11:52 am

carlos55 wrote:
One of the most peculiar things in politics is why nazi’s are called “far right”

Hitler was a racist socialist, he was a member of the National Socialist Party in the 30’s.

In the UK we had the BNP which was labeled “far right” again his policies were socialist and on the left.


If anything they're extreme conservative.

Not libertarian (which has its own issues). Not socialist and progressive (obviously not progressive...). Authoritarian and traditionalist at the same time. Trying to enforce an old standard of culture, against modern 'decadence'.

But the extreme they go to contrasts with the vague nostalgia most conservatives have in the same way that communists and socialists aren't the same, because most socialists are in favour of a mixed economy achieved by voting rather than a revolution seizing the means of production.

Only thing they have in common with socialists is what they have in common with communists. And that's the authoritarian side of it.

I'd argue that authoritarianism is always dangerous. Even when it gets people who agree with me what they want.


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carlos55
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23 Oct 2020, 3:08 pm

KT67 wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
One of the most peculiar things in politics is why nazi’s are called “far right”

Hitler was a racist socialist, he was a member of the National Socialist Party in the 30’s.

In the UK we had the BNP which was labeled “far right” again his policies were socialist and on the left.


If anything they're extreme conservative.

Not libertarian (which has its own issues). Not socialist and progressive (obviously not progressive...). Authoritarian and traditionalist at the same time. Trying to enforce an old standard of culture, against modern 'decadence'.

But the extreme they go to contrasts with the vague nostalgia most conservatives have in the same way that communists and socialists aren't the same, because most socialists are in favour of a mixed economy achieved by voting rather than a revolution seizing the means of production.

Only thing they have in common with socialists is what they have in common with communists. And that's the authoritarian side of it.

I'd argue that authoritarianism is always dangerous. Even when it gets people who agree with me what they want.


Well its not as clear cut as that. Looking on google it appears there are many articles claiming both views, in fact a US senator Rep. Mo Brooks brought this up recently.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/ ... te-1237472

Many of Hitlers early policies were rather socialist in nature, like the micro-managing German society, price controls etc..

In the UK we had the BNP a far-right fringe party. Leaving aside many of their anti-immigration policies many of their other views were rather traditional socialist in nature like nationalisation of big industry, which many saw as a throw back to our old labour party of the 70`s.

Personally, I’m neither on the right or left but a libertarian, I see tyranny on both extreme sides of the political spectrum.


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23 Oct 2020, 3:17 pm

I have no idea what neo Nazi is, I have not seen anyone here who seemed to have ever expressed those beliefs. I have seen a few here that have expressed ideologies that would fall into Nazism. I pointed one of them out when someone made such comment and it got removed because it was seen as a personal attack. But no warning was issued to me so I am not gonna worry about it.


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malavois
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23 Oct 2020, 3:28 pm

carlos55 wrote:
I see tyranny on both extreme sides of the political spectrum.


As many things go, politics isn’t a real spectrum. It’s like a sphere. Like you may have seen the Cartesian political system map/graphic, with liberal on the negative x-axis, conservative on the positive x-axis, authoritarian on the positive y-axis, and libertarian on the negative y-axis.

But extreme conservatism and extreme liberalism both become authoritarianism. I don’t know if there have been extreme libertarians (anarchists?) but the more extreme a political stance, the more absolute the rhetoric has to be, the more stringent in enforcing that absolute and unified rhetoric, and boom authoritarianism.

I studied political science in college and a lot of classes/books are about exactly this topic. Politics and political ideologies morph over time, and as some conservatives love to chortle, Abraham Lincoln was a Republican...because in the mid 1800s that meant something different from what Republican means now. Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Tojo, Franco, they all named or identified their political ideologies slightly (or not so slightly) differently, but the end results are not so different. (In terms of how their ideology maps against the political spectrum/sphere, not in terms of overall damage. That is not measurable and I won’t attempt it.)



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23 Oct 2020, 3:39 pm

carlos55 wrote:
Never come across anyone with Nazi views on here.

I’m not a US citizen but even classIng Trump or his alt right supporters as nazis is a bit strong if not silly.


Even the ones who dress up in brown shirts with red arm bands and march around shouting 'Jews will not replace us'? :?


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23 Oct 2020, 3:40 pm

carlos55 wrote:
KT67 wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
One of the most peculiar things in politics is why nazi’s are called “far right”

Hitler was a racist socialist, he was a member of the National Socialist Party in the 30’s.

In the UK we had the BNP which was labeled “far right” again his policies were socialist and on the left.


If anything they're extreme conservative.

Not libertarian (which has its own issues). Not socialist and progressive (obviously not progressive...). Authoritarian and traditionalist at the same time. Trying to enforce an old standard of culture, against modern 'decadence'.

But the extreme they go to contrasts with the vague nostalgia most conservatives have in the same way that communists and socialists aren't the same, because most socialists are in favour of a mixed economy achieved by voting rather than a revolution seizing the means of production.

Only thing they have in common with socialists is what they have in common with communists. And that's the authoritarian side of it.

I'd argue that authoritarianism is always dangerous. Even when it gets people who agree with me what they want.


Well its not as clear cut as that. Looking on google it appears there are many articles claiming both views, in fact a US senator Rep. Mo Brooks brought this up recently.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/ ... te-1237472

Many of Hitlers early policies were rather socialist in nature, like the micro-managing German society, price controls etc..

In the UK we had the BNP a far-right fringe party. Leaving aside many of their anti-immigration policies many of their other views were rather traditional socialist in nature like nationalisation of big industry, which many saw as a throw back to our old labour party of the 70`s.

Personally, I’m neither on the right or left but a libertarian, I see tyranny on both extreme sides of the political spectrum.


You should read the information you link to. (You do understand that these are pretty fringe politicians in the US and not actual authorities, right?) From the article:

Quote:
Brooks also said — incorrectly — that Hitler was a socialist. “The author was Socialist Adolph Hitler in his book, 'Mein Kampf,'” the Alabama Republican claimed.

Of course, this isn’t true. The Nazi Party, officially the National Socialist German Workers’ Party, was fascist, not socialist — the opposite end of the political universe from socialists. But that hasn’t stopped other Republicans from jumping in as well.

On Tuesday, Rep. Louie Gohmert (R-Texas), another of the more bombastic GOP lawmakers, waded into the “Socialists are the same as Nazis” flap.


Read the link I posted on if NAZIs are socialist for more information.

And leaving aside BNP racist and fascist dogma??? Seriously?

But lets talk BNP economics. From the link I posted:

Quote:
Tyndall described his approach to the economy as "National Economics",[238] expressing the view that "politics must lead, and not be led by, economic forces".[239] His approach rejected economic liberalism because it did not serve "the national interest", although still saw advantages in a capitalist system, looking favourably on individual enterprise.[240] He called on capitalist elements to be combined with socialist ones, with the government playing a role in planning the economy.[230] He promoted the idea of the UK becoming an autarky which was economically self-sufficient, with domestic production protected from foreign competition.[230] This attitude was heavily informed by the corporatist system that had been introduced in Benito Mussolini's Fascist Italy.[241]


You seem to confuse socialism with corporatism, authoritarianism, and nationalism. He is not talking about a socialist economy to help society as a whole or even the worker, but a authoritarian government funded by capitalist industry (not unlike the NAZI model).

Trying to rewrite history through syntax to ignore the behavior of past right-wing regimes is disingenuous at best.



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23 Oct 2020, 4:00 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
Never come across anyone with Nazi views on here.

I’m not a US citizen but even classIng Trump or his alt right supporters as nazis is a bit strong if not silly.


Even the ones who dress up in brown shirts with red arm bands and march around shouting 'Jews will not replace us'? :?


And their UK equivalents recently filmed doing massed Nazi salutes in front of a war memorial. A bunch of English Defence League types marched out to "defend" a statue of Winston Churchill from an imagined threat from Black Lives Matter protesters. I'm not sure exactly what was going on in their heads when they decided to Seig Heil* him while they were there.

It baffles me that any autistic people would support a cause that literally used to vivisect us. It's like Milo Yiannopoulos- he's kidding himself if he doesn't realise his white-supremacist friends would have him executed for "deviance" if they ever won power.

*sp? don't really feel like googling it.


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23 Oct 2020, 11:56 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
Never come across anyone with Nazi views on here.

I’m not a US citizen but even classIng Trump or his alt right supporters as nazis is a bit strong if not silly.


Even the ones who dress up in brown shirts with red arm bands and march around shouting 'Jews will not replace us'? :?


Oh you mean the ones the POTUS called "fine folks" :lol:



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24 Oct 2020, 1:41 am

To me it's not a question of whether or not we have a nazi infestation; stop letting the extreme right lower the bar.


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24 Oct 2020, 1:54 am

malavois wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
One of the most peculiar things in politics is why nazi’s are called “far right”

Hitler was a racist socialist, he was a member of the National Socialist Party in the 30’s.

In the UK we had the BNP which was labeled “far right” again his policies were socialist and on the left.


North Korea is officially called The Democratic People’s Republic of Korea. There is also the Democratic Republic of Congo. They are most certainly NOT democracies. It’s propaganda and misdirection.


Yep.
The Nazis used their title to drag people in, initially.
It was a means to an end.



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24 Oct 2020, 2:04 am

funeralxempire wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
Never come across anyone with Nazi views on here.

I’m not a US citizen but even classIng Trump or his alt right supporters as nazis is a bit strong if not silly.


Even the ones who dress up in brown shirts with red arm bands and march around shouting 'Jews will not replace us'? :?


Seriously?
How many would do such a thing in a country of over 330,000,000 people? :roll:

I am sure we would find extreme left-wing individuals behaving bizarrely also. 8)



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24 Oct 2020, 4:05 am

Pepe wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
Never come across anyone with Nazi views on here.

I’m not a US citizen but even classIng Trump or his alt right supporters as nazis is a bit strong if not silly.


Even the ones who dress up in brown shirts with red arm bands and march around shouting 'Jews will not replace us'? :?


Seriously?
How many would do such a thing in a country of over 330,000,000 people? :roll:


Enough to be a viable political bloc, even if not all of them dress like that regularly outside of Unite The Right rallies. :wink:


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24 Oct 2020, 4:31 am

madbutnotmad wrote:
I have noticed that some of the people on this forum hold far right if not Neo Nazi views.

I believe that if you have ASD / Autism / Asperger Syndrome, you should realise that being a neo nazi is not a good idea.

The reasoning for this is that there now is substantial evidence that proves Hans Asperger, the doctor that Asperger Syndrome was named after who went down in history for discovering the condition, was actually actively involved in the nazi regime to the extent of participating in its murderous euthanasia programme, sending hundreds of children with ASD to their premature deaths.

Pioneering autism doctor Hans Asperger sent disabled children to be killed by Nazis, new study claims

To say that you are a neo nazi while having ASD / Autism / Asperger Syndrome, is to say that you agree that you and all the people with the same disability that you suffer from deserve to die for being subhuman life.

Although i believe in freedom of speech, i was thinking when considering the above fact (i.e. in how the nazi's classify people with ASD) that perhaps this website should consider banning all neo nazi activity.

I say this, as I also know that some with ASD may be naive and may not understand when other members are being manipulative or abusive. and also may not understand how vulnerable they are.


Well I agree with you for sure.

And well also there is a danger of white supremacists/neo-nazis radicalizing people via online means. I had a period when I was 17 where I kinda got sucked into nazi s**t luckily I did not stick with that, but yeah I certainly feel like I got close to getting brainwashed into it...Like f**k I was even thinking of running away from home to try and find nazis to join(I am very glad I didn't, like I was a 17 year old girl and if I had followed through it likely could have ended up in some weird sex abuse situation). But IDK I was in a dark place and being stupid. But I did realize from that, that like online radicalization and stuff isn't false like that can happen for sure I was extremely close to falling into it.


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24 Oct 2020, 7:00 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Pepe wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
Never come across anyone with Nazi views on here.

I’m not a US citizen but even classIng Trump or his alt right supporters as nazis is a bit strong if not silly.


Even the ones who dress up in brown shirts with red arm bands and march around shouting 'Jews will not replace us'? :?


Seriously?
How many would do such a thing in a country of over 330,000,000 people? :roll:


Enough to be a viable political bloc, even if not all of them dress like that regularly outside of Unite The Right rallies. :wink:


Don't they just balance the whackos on the other side? :mrgreen:



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24 Oct 2020, 7:06 am

BTW this is a good reason why instead of fighting over labels (which is partly done to show 'your side' as the good side) we ought to be combatting ideas.

Ideas of hatred against ethnic minorities, homosexuals, mentally ill people etc.

Ideas of authoritarianism, anti-democracy, violence.

Combatting ideas is harder than sticking it to your opponent. But it's the right thing to do.


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