How will Americans adjust to life in an authoritarian state?

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MaxE
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20 Sep 2023, 6:57 am

KitLily wrote:
Americans will not like this at all. Americans are far more rebellious than the apathetic Brits.

And considering the vast numbers of guns belonging to private US individuals, there could easily be a very bloody revolt/civil war.

One could argue that the vogue for removing restrictions on gun ownership and promoting "gun culture" might have as its purpose the goal of ensuring that civil war will be as bloody as possible, which would theoretically lead to a more authoritarian society down the road as the public demand a return to order.


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20 Sep 2023, 7:15 am

MaxE wrote:
KitLily wrote:
Americans will not like this at all. Americans are far more rebellious than the apathetic Brits.

And considering the vast numbers of guns belonging to private US individuals, there could easily be a very bloody revolt/civil war.

One could argue that the vogue for removing restrictions on gun ownership and promoting "gun culture" might have as its purpose the goal of ensuring that civil war will be as bloody as possible, which would theoretically lead to a more authoritarian society down the road as the public demand a return to order.


Surely not. That would be far too cynical. Yes I am being sarcastic. :wink:


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20 Sep 2023, 9:05 am

To understand the apparent mechanism, by which our government controls our propaganda that we are fed.
You need not look too much further than 9/11, debacle . Where when our President was in a elementary school
reading in or to a class and the Secret Service told him that the country was under attack . His reaction at that moment was not of a surprised or indignant reaction . Or to leave immediately to take his role as president,
. But to malinger . And sit peacefully. As a man whom was already aware of the events. Then building three was demolished,to the ground .Never stuck by any plane. And the media spin was to have us declare a War on a Country that had no apparent connection and destroy it...Not even Weapons of mass destruction were found.MOST ODD, one of the benefits to the authoritarian State was to remove privacy rights via the Patriot Act. Calling for a vote on it. As urgent as a declaration of War,So noone got to examine the situations, Or Informed persons could have thought it through. Had worked in the special effects industry,( old school) NOT CGI graphics,Have seen buildings demolished in various locations aswell . The Building were demolished , via demolition,by all outward appearances . Where was the concern for human life then, Innocent Americans died , en Masse, during and afterwards.Due to this event.
Why was the Gov.not concerned with those persons in those building.( value of human life?)
So when the time Comes .. You can be assured there will most likely some new equally dramatic event . :skull:
That will shock the Entire majority of the population and we Will happily go along with it to give up further rights , ex-freedoms. To be made to believe it will be to ensure their own safety, comfort or just plain spoiled ease or because that is what they have become used to that is how the Corporate Media Empire, , hand in hand with the current Government controls. :evil:
But whatever they do to remove more civil rights, It will be spun, in such a way that people will want that. :ninja:
It will be up to the millenials and other Gen.s people growing up here to suffer and endure these things.Or to actually elect and put forth new people whom will be FOR THE PEOPLE :heart:


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20 Sep 2023, 11:27 am

As an American, I would just leave. I'm leaving as soon I have the opportunity. The United States is a burning tire fire like Springfield or Gotham City. Kids are making jokes about school shooting. And you know, that's fine, dark humor is fine. But what f**king society do we live in where literal children have to cope with life and death situations because a couple of idiots don't want to give up their precious death weapons if they happen to flunk a psych exam. Someone put an NRA flag next to my middle school.
This isn't our only issue, but I'm just so mad about it right now. Ban guns.


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21 Sep 2023, 1:03 pm

IF the USA ever did go authoritarian, it wouldn't take all that much adjusting to adjust to IMO. Same for Canada and other "democracies," where the will of the people isn't reflected in the laws politicians create and force upon the population. Laws are bought by Billionaires and wealthy corporations via lobbyists and political campaign contributions, not created to reflect what constituents want to live by.

That's why the average person opposes green lighting & subsidizing environmentally destructive projects, yet they go ahead all the time. Same thing plays out for all sorts of things big & small. People don't actually get a say in sweet f**k all in our so-called "democracies," so I can see how some people are tired of this s**t and embrace change.

Thing is, I think their embrace of trumplestiltskin is a dead wrong move. Ok to want change.. but choose something better, not measurably worse in every possible way. No sense in going straight backwards because you're fed up with not moving forwards. IMO.

But overall, people are already used to being told what to do by someone else who decided, so it really wouldn't be that big of a transition in that sense. It'd just be pretty wild if some of the absolutely ridiculous things were implemented that rolled back human rights by a Century. Those things would take some getting used to/getting the f**k outta there. That would be my move if Canada ever decided to go full Ridiculous. I'd leave. To where? I dunno. Maybe overseas.. maybe just into the woods away from all the morons doing their moronic s**t.


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MaxE
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22 Sep 2023, 8:01 am

goldfish21 wrote:
That would be my move if Canada ever decided to go full Ridiculous. I'd leave. To where? I dunno. Maybe overseas.. maybe just into the woods away from all the morons doing their moronic s**t.

You might consider Mexico. Mexico is an unusual case. It has rampant corruption at all levels, but its government doesn't seem to be moving towards authoritarianism, in fact it seems to me one of the few places that may be going in the opposite direction. Consider how some Mexican states have been moving toward marriage equality and reproductive rights, while the US goes in the opposite direction.

A lot of retired Canadians already live happily in Mexico as ex-pats. I've seen this on House Hunters. Obviously some places there are more ex-pat-friendly than others, but I think it offers an option. I spent a few nights in Mexico City 10 years or so ago and am seriously planning to go back soon just to help me decide whether Mexico is a country I like enough to live in if I had to. FYI if you plan such a trip yourself, consider looking for a room in the Hipódromo neighborhood, it's where we stayed and you can range out to neighboring areas from there.


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goldfish21
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22 Sep 2023, 10:44 am

MaxE wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
That would be my move if Canada ever decided to go full Ridiculous. I'd leave. To where? I dunno. Maybe overseas.. maybe just into the woods away from all the morons doing their moronic s**t.

You might consider Mexico. Mexico is an unusual case. It has rampant corruption at all levels, but its government doesn't seem to be moving towards authoritarianism, in fact it seems to me one of the few places that may be going in the opposite direction. Consider how some Mexican states have been moving toward marriage equality and reproductive rights, while the US goes in the opposite direction.

A lot of retired Canadians already live happily in Mexico as ex-pats. I've seen this on House Hunters. Obviously some places there are more ex-pat-friendly than others, but I think it offers an option. I spent a few nights in Mexico City 10 years or so ago and am seriously planning to go back soon just to help me decide whether Mexico is a country I like enough to live in if I had to. FYI if you plan such a trip yourself, consider looking for a room in the Hipódromo neighborhood, it's where we stayed and you can range out to neighboring areas from there.

I've heard the tourist/foreigner friendly areas of Mexico have become very expensive for housing/food etc. Maybe priced out of there like here. Could live in a cheaper area - but then it might not be safe.

I dunno where I'd go if I Had To leave home. If I had enough money to burn, maybe I wouldn't go anywhere in particular and would just keep on the move when I got bored of someplace. Go to the Dominican and kiteboard for a while, then somewhere else etc.. do a little work/bartering, minimize expenses, conserve funds, rinse and repeat.

But all of that is extremely unlikely. What's more likely is that things continue to become even more extremely unaffordable where I live and more and more people will be forced to leave in pursuit of affordable shelter/food etc. It's unlikely I'll be forced into that position as long as I can stay in the house my father paid for.


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MaxE
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22 Sep 2023, 10:52 am

goldfish21 wrote:
MaxE wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
That would be my move if Canada ever decided to go full Ridiculous. I'd leave. To where? I dunno. Maybe overseas.. maybe just into the woods away from all the morons doing their moronic s**t.

You might consider Mexico. Mexico is an unusual case. It has rampant corruption at all levels, but its government doesn't seem to be moving towards authoritarianism, in fact it seems to me one of the few places that may be going in the opposite direction. Consider how some Mexican states have been moving toward marriage equality and reproductive rights, while the US goes in the opposite direction.

A lot of retired Canadians already live happily in Mexico as ex-pats. I've seen this on House Hunters. Obviously some places there are more ex-pat-friendly than others, but I think it offers an option. I spent a few nights in Mexico City 10 years or so ago and am seriously planning to go back soon just to help me decide whether Mexico is a country I like enough to live in if I had to. FYI if you plan such a trip yourself, consider looking for a room in the Hipódromo neighborhood, it's where we stayed and you can range out to neighboring areas from there.

I've heard the tourist/foreigner friendly areas of Mexico have become very expensive for housing/food etc. Maybe priced out of there like here. Could live in a cheaper area - but then it might not be safe.

I dunno where I'd go if I Had To leave home. If I had enough money to burn, maybe I wouldn't go anywhere in particular and would just keep on the move when I got bored of someplace. Go to the Dominican and kiteboard for a while, then somewhere else etc.. do a little work/bartering, minimize expenses, conserve funds, rinse and repeat.

But all of that is extremely unlikely. What's more likely is that things continue to become even more extremely unaffordable where I live and more and more people will be forced to leave in pursuit of affordable shelter/food etc. It's unlikely I'll be forced into that position as long as I can stay in the house my father paid for.


This American guy went on disability due to a motorcycle accident (not that that would ever happen to you!) and was able to find a good affordable life in Morelia:

https://www.hgtv.com/shows/house-hunters-international/episodes/family-first-in-morelia-mexico


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22 Sep 2023, 10:52 am

I don't think I can adjust, and I don't want to think about what would happen to any opposition or resistance.


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Mrs.Gone
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22 Sep 2023, 6:23 pm

I don't live in the US and I feel sorry for those who do - women in particular. When the government - via judges - feels free to impose what a person will / should do with their own body (I'm speaking about abortion rights and free choice) it doesn't seem far-fetched to speak of some sort of "authoritarian state", sadly. The experience might be very different from a male point of view, I don't know.

Even sadder is the fact that the "liberal left" is collapsing under the weight of its own performative contradictions and compromises; it leaves the door wide open for any "Old Man Trump" to come and pretend to speak for the "ordinary people" (the "deplorables") - who feel legitimately let down by those who should have their best interests in mind. The sort of "authoritarian right" that shows its ugly head more and more in the US (but not only) truly deserves a serious critique and then some. But if the "liberal left" keeps refusing any form of self-criticism and doesn't go back soon to some serious and solid intellectual and philosophical foundations and praxis[i][/I], I fear the worst not only for the United States but for the Republican ideal in itself.


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ezbzbfcg2
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22 Sep 2023, 6:26 pm

On paper, the USA will still be nominally free. In practice, many unconstitutional state and local laws that contradict the spirit of the Constitution will be enforced with little challenge. It'll be a free-on-paper stance, and it's happening right now as we speak.

How will Americans react? Like a frog in a boiling pot with the heat slowly being turned up.



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22 Sep 2023, 7:20 pm

Already in the stew.....blurble..blurble... :hic:


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22 Sep 2023, 10:34 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
How will Americans react? Like a frog in a boiling pot with the heat slowly being turned up.



According to some old lore, when you boil frogs they reincarnate as all kinds of g-men and g-women. "Grenoulles" as the French say.


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23 Sep 2023, 1:08 am

Quick before they bann shovels...! , Dig a hole and pull it in after yourself..... 8O :nerdy:


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23 Sep 2023, 7:46 am

Mrs.Gone wrote:
I don't live in the US and I feel sorry for those who do - women in particular. When the government - via judges - feels free to impose what a person will / should do with their own body (I'm speaking about abortion rights and free choice) it doesn't seem far-fetched to speak of some sort of "authoritarian state", sadly. The experience might be very different from a male point of view, I don't know.

Even sadder is the fact that the "liberal left" is collapsing under the weight of its own performative contradictions and compromises; it leaves the door wide open for any "Old Man Trump" to come and pretend to speak for the "ordinary people" (the "deplorables") - who feel legitimately let down by those who should have their best interests in mind. The sort of "authoritarian right" that shows its ugly head more and more in the US (but not only) truly deserves a serious critique and then some. But if the "liberal left" keeps refusing any form of self-criticism and doesn't go back soon to some serious and solid intellectual and philosophical foundations and praxis[i][/I], I fear the worst not only for the United States but for the Republican ideal in itself.


^^^^
This


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23 Sep 2023, 8:28 am

Mrs.Gone wrote:
I don't live in the US and I feel sorry for those who do - women in particular. When the government - via judges - feels free to impose what a person will / should do with their own body (I'm speaking about abortion rights and free choice) it doesn't seem far-fetched to speak of some sort of "authoritarian state", sadly. The experience might be very different from a male point of view, I don't know.

Even sadder is the fact that the "liberal left" is collapsing under the weight of its own performative contradictions and compromises; it leaves the door wide open for any "Old Man Trump" to come and pretend to speak for the "ordinary people" (the "deplorables") - who feel legitimately let down by those who should have their best interests in mind. The sort of "authoritarian right" that shows its ugly head more and more in the US (but not only) truly deserves a serious critique and then some. But if the "liberal left" keeps refusing any form of self-criticism and doesn't go back soon to some serious and solid intellectual and philosophical foundations and praxis[i][/I], I fear the worst not only for the United States but for the Republican ideal in itself.

Not certain who you mean by "liberal left". Do you mean so-called "neoliberals" typified by Joe Biden? Or the Left Wing of the Democratic Party who consider Bernie Sanders to be their spiritual compass? Or some hypothetical foot soldiers who foist "wokeness" on decent people?

MAGAs are not creatures of folklore. You encounter them everywhere you go. Why obsess over a threat from evil "antifas" when you've likely never even seen one nor known anyone who has, when the MAGAs are right in front of you? Propaganda can be so f*****g effective!


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Last edited by MaxE on 23 Sep 2023, 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.