Mexican flu

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25 Apr 2009, 5:24 pm

I'd often thought of New York as being the most dirtiest place in the U.S. It's overpopulated and filled with trash and waste especially in the cities.

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richardbenson
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25 Apr 2009, 5:27 pm

i dont believe mexico city is cleaner than alot of europe. thats probably garbage, im not gonna go through all the hastle of finding out how clean mexico city is though. and the flu started in mexico, and spread. it didnt start in california and spread to mexico, until a relatively clean country starts something for the rest of us to share then i'll believe clean countrys can start pandemics, reguardless, i dont even think the mexican officials know how it started. look at whos running the country, its practicley a failed state. if any pandemic could have been started anyplace worse, it was probably mexico

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25 Apr 2009, 6:20 pm

Orwell wrote:

pezar wrote:

Concenik wrote:

so wtf - can some geneticist or biochemist tell me if this can happen so rapidly in 'natural' condition? - such multi species viral combinations which are previously unknown??- or does Occam's razor suggest it is engineered?

Nature is capable of some pretty odd things. That said, pigs, birds, and humans are biologically so far apart that a hat trick virus that combines all three seems unlikely. Two has happened. Three seems rather odd.

Influenza has been infecting all three groups of organisms since before we even knew viruses existed, or that nucleic acid was the genetic material. Viruses are tricky little bastards, and you never know what to expect from them.

Quote:

Flu viruses are named after the two main proteins on their surfaces, abbreviated H and N. They are also differentiated by what animal they usually infect. The H in the new virus comes from pigs, but some of its other genes come from bird and human flu viruses, a mixture that the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention calls "very unusual".

It is new. Anne Schuchat, head of science and public health at the CDC, said that the US virus is an unusually mongrelised mix of genetic sequences from North American pigs, Eurasian pigs, birds and humans. The H protein on its surface, having hitherto circulated only in pigs, is one most human immune systems have never seen, the crucial requirement for a pandemic flu.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1 ... demic.html

------------

We have to assume' swine flu is in Ontario, health official warns

http://www.healthzone.ca/health/article/624335

...................

UK -
Cabin crew member in hospital after flight from swine flu-struck Mexico

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/ap ... ico-flight

--------

Ginseng and Salviae herbs play a role as immune activators and modulate immune responses during influenza virus infection

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_o ... 87a20169a0

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this story has almost immediately been buried and can only be found on Google cache now...

Long link to IP address 74.125.95.132 which could be anything.

compare with this one put in it's place:

http://www.redorbit.com/news/health/167 ... index.html

see how they are somewhat different?? Is that not slightly odd??

Last edited by Concenik on 25 Apr 2009, 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ruveyn
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25 Apr 2009, 6:46 pm

MissConstrue wrote:

I'd often thought of New York as being the most dirtiest place in the U.S. It's overpopulated and filled with trash and waste especially in the cities.

That rats eat up the garbage.

By the way have you ever noticed that we tend to name diseases after foreign nationalities and societies. For example: Asian flu, German measles, the Blotch of Egypt, the French rash. Do you not see a bit of xenophobia there?

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25 Apr 2009, 7:06 pm

i'd suppose that's basicly because we consider people from these regions to have weaker immunitary system than others for contracting said disease and spreading the disease or virus, which is why it has a negative connotation... Or it could just be that the first important cases of such disease comes from there? ^.- hrm. Anyway, i'll be looking out for this too, damn those viruses for constantly finding new tricks to spread >< .

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25 Apr 2009, 7:12 pm

Concenik, could you elaborate more on those links? I don't really see what relation they have to my post that you quoted.

OK, so an article was edited. I don't see what the big deal is.

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25 Apr 2009, 7:31 pm

phil777 wrote:

It is more basic than that. Humans tend to blame the evil that befalls them on The Other, The Stranger.

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Concenik
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25 Apr 2009, 7:42 pm

It seems this virus had NOT reassorted in pigs..so where had it come from??

Quote:

* Although it's called swine flu, this new strain is not infecting pigs and has never been seen in pigs. The threat is person to person transmission.

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/ ... ZC20090424

Concenik
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25 Apr 2009, 7:47 pm

Orwell wrote:

Concenik, could you elaborate more on those links? I don't really see what relation they have to my post that you quoted.

OK, so an article was edited. I don't see what the big deal is.

They weren't in relation to your quote - other than the first one...

Other than the banning thing - I was asked not to multiple post in sequence and to condense links into just one post .. probably because of my 'link spam' in the 'NWO monetary system' thread..that was why I kept editing the links onto the same post...

I realised it might have confused..sorry about that..

The relevant line that was completely omitted in the re formulated article was:

Quote:

They added that it was discovered thanks to improved testing facilities and expanded disease surveillance; one at a Navy clinic and the other at a specialized clinic that monitors border communities.

- why was this claim dropped like a rock?

also as stated in the post I've just put up, the idea is that H1N1 has re assorted in pigs - this 'very unusual' and 'highly exotic' virus..but..

Quote:

* Although it's called swine flu, this new strain is not infecting pigs and has never been seen in pigs. The threat is person to person transmission.

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/ ... ZC20090424

This would seemingly rule out such a theory. So I continue to speculate that because of these facts which run absolutely contrary to much of the OP ED out there as to it's origin and that it's a 'highly unusual' combination of muti species strains that it appears to be a artificially weaponised virus.

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25 Apr 2009, 8:00 pm

pbcoll wrote:

To those on conspiracy theories: it would seem obvious that if you wanted to stage a biological attack on the US, you'd release it in, well, the US.

it's in the US - I never suggested it was intended as an assault solely on the US.

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25 Apr 2009, 8:05 pm

Orwell wrote:

Concenik wrote:

Yes, it can and does happen in nature. Our own knowledge is not sufficient to reliably engineer this type of thing, and certainly not very quickly. Bioweapons research also has largely stalled since the end of the Cold War- the most advanced bioweapons facility ever built was from the 80s in Kazakhstan.

With all due respect Orwell, unless you actually work as a microbiologist within a military construct ( which would lower your life expectancy considerably judging from the amount of mysterious fatalities having such a career seems to engender) you have no grounds to evince a knowledge of what can and can't be done in these spheres, for it surely isn't in the public realm..

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25 Apr 2009, 8:06 pm

richardbenson wrote:

I don't need to go through the hassle of finding out, beause I've already seen it with my own eyes (and smelled it too); believe it or not, sometimes brown people really are cleaner than white people; whether you refuse to believe it or not is irrelevant. And there are lots of places that are worse than Mexico, which is actually relatively prosperous compared to most of Latin America and the Third World, but if you knew anything about the Third World you'd know that.

Anyway, as I posted earlier, if one were attacking the US, one wouldn't release the strain far south of the border. Since Mexico itself is extremely unlikely to be a target of bioterror, by Occam's razor it's sensible to assume this is a natural mutation - it's not as if a virus mutating were unheard of.

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25 Apr 2009, 8:10 pm

claire333 wrote:

This topic is really creeping me out. Pandemic swine flu potential is bad enough...but intentional...

Concenik, you lost me a bit on your opinion of who might be responsible. What/who is the old structure? I have trouble with the idea of something like this being intentional, because of inability for one to protect themself from their own pandemic...unless they might not care.

I imagine contingencies would have been made if it were the case..

'old structure' - um, it's an entirely different thread - I might start that one up sometime when I feel sufficiently armoured to deal with the flak it will no doubt attract

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25 Apr 2009, 8:16 pm

pbcoll wrote:

Anyway, as I posted earlier, if one were attacking the US, one wouldn't release the strain far south of the border. Since Mexico itself is extremely unlikely to be a target of bioterror, by Occam's razor it's sensible to assume this is a natural mutation - it's not as if a virus mutating were unheard of.

No, it's not necessarily sensible to assume it's a natural mutation as the 'Occamic' evidences point distinctly in the opposite direction.

I reiterate - I personally am not suggesting it is an attack directed solely at America - and why would one of the most densely populated cities in the world with a hugely busy airport be such a bad choice to seed a virus if you were looking to start a pandemic to thin the numbers?

I spent a number of months in Mexico city and although the poverty can be extreme it never struck me as being a 'dirty city' - Guatemala city is a dirty city..

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25 Apr 2009, 9:02 pm

pbcoll wrote:

ive been to mexico, ive seen just about all ive need to see. and nobody is turning this into a white/brown issue, immagration, and laws therof have nothing to do with the color of ones skin. and reguardless, if you think our laws are harsh on immigrants comming to this contry mexico's laws twords there neighbours to the south is absolutley appauling. mexico has to be the biggest hypocrite this side of the hemisphere. yea lets cry about how the united states laws are so unfair, when they treat immigrants trying to get into there country 100 times worse. :lol:

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25 Apr 2009, 9:39 pm

Concenik wrote:

Orwell wrote:

Concenik wrote:

I am a microbiology student, and I know that if you attempt to study microbiology at even a very basic level you will quickly run into questions where the best answer anyone can give you is "I dunno." We know virtually nothing about biology. I have also heard and read statements from people who are competent in the realm of bioweapons, and they attest that it is not a trifling matter in terms of its complexity. It really is very difficult to produce bioweapons.

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