If a girl is raped and pregnant, should she keep the baby?

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Quit avoiding the question, Inuyasha.

If you have even half of the intellectual integrity you claim, you should be in a position to define, rather than merely repeat, your position.

We've all read your assertion that a foetus is a living human being. What I want to know is are there any circumstances--any at all--in which the mother's rights prevail over her child. Is there even one practical exception to your idealized view?

You infernal moron, this has been answered multiple times.

No crime has been committed. Abortion is not about punishing a crime - it is about the mother's rights NOT to have to donate her body for 9 months.

Woman inconveinenced for 9 months verses the child being denied the right to live, to grow up, have dreams, etc. Essentially you're saying another human being doesn't even have the right to exist.



I have 2 exceptions actually.

Life of the mother in serious jeopardy (and I mean legit not the idiotic excuses abortion clinics sometimes use to get around the law), such as cancers where they have to do chemo or the mother dies, kinda thing. In a situation like that, if they are at a point that they can get the child out and far enough along to survive on his/her own, they should get the kid out and into medical care to try to save the kid's life too). If the kid can't survive on his/her own then it is a choice for the woman to make.

Other exception I would make is the child is obviously brain dead well into the pregnency (like absolutely no brain activity), and this should be reviewed by multiple physicians to try to ensure honesty. However, there shouldn't be unreasonable expectations early in the pregnency when the child's brain is showing activity (like around day-47), because that is just unrealistic expectations of the child magically having adult-like readings when their brain just came online and still is doing a lot of growing and developing.

Inconvenience my ass. Pregnancy is a f*****g medical condition that before the advent of modern medicine KILLED many women. Nobody should have to go through this for a f*****g cluster of cells.

brain activity =/= structured brain activity,
jeez

I've already said, I don't care how structured the brain activity is, that early in the pregnency. All I care about is the fact there is brain activity, I'm not going to expect someone to recite the Gettysberg Address when they are just starting to learn to talk, you really shouldn't do that either.



That "cluster of cells" is a human being, so damn straight I'm going to call abortion murder for the conveinence of the woman, whom went out and had sex with her boyfriend and now doesn't want the consequences that she got pregnent due to her own behavior. I feel sorry for women that are raped, but I still maintain my position because the child is not the rapist, he/she is an innocent life that shouldn't be murdered so the woman "would feel better."

I don't view women as human incubators, that said, I will not equate a human child to a parasite or a simple cluster of cells, and in the situation of a pregnency the child's right to live, trumps a woman's inconveinence or feelings.

Yeah anencephalics have brain activity but they also lack a neo-cortex so the brain activity they have going on doesn't make them any less blind, deaf, and unconscious. On a side note though, I think the cluster of cells and parasite arguments are crap and are nothing more than fallacies of composition and projection of one's underlying assumptions onto the opponent.

Well considering the fact at least one of them flat out called them the child "a parasite," I'm not projecting anything.

Example:


Example:


Would you like more examples AceOfSpades, I know there is a post by LKL in here somewhere where she specifically calls the child in the womb a parasite.

What? I was referring to the pro-choicers in the thread when I was talking about the cluster of cells and parasite arguments. As for the projection thing, that's what both sides of the debate tend to do which annoys the crap out of me but in this case I was specifically addressing those who use those arguments.

Sorry, it seemed like your comments were directed towards me, thanks for the clarrification.

Even the 'brain activity' you talk about does not happen instantly after conception. So, you would be fine with early abortions, unless you are being irrational.

Without actual brain usage, a person is effectively a bunch of cells.

We do not care about protecting life in general. We are fine killing rats and bunnies and they all have more consciousness and potential to actually suffer than an early zygote.



It is not a child, it is a zef, it didn't become a child. It doesn't have dreams. Etc.

When you Inuyasha, force the woman to go on with the pregnancy, the zygote becomes a fetus and the fetus becomes a baby. But you no longer care about the baby, do you? The baby is all out in the wild and ready to suffer an unnecessary life. And you do nothing about it. You keep claiming that pregnancy is just a mere discomfort that lasts 9 months and that the woman can easily put him to adoption, yet you disregard your responsibility as a pro-lifer by completely avoiding to adopt anybody.

It is your (Inuyasha's) comfort of not having children right now vs. ensuring the babies you forced to be born actually have a chance to live and are raised by someone with actual money that can educate them. You deny this responsibility. Why do you expect the woman to do more than what you cannot even do?

What entitles you to this right of avoiding discomfort all while deciding discomfort is mandatory for other people, specifically in this case pregnant women?

What state do you live in, Inuyasha? I will to find a child - a real child (or a few thousand) - for you to adopt. Unless it's, maybe, inconvenient for you to have a child right now?

But what is your convenience over the life of a living, breathing, suffering child!?

Personally speaking if I was a woman and got raped and became pregnant, I would choose to have the baby because I would feel even worse about executing an innocent child for something their evil faher did. I don't know if I would keep the baby and raise it, maybe just give it up for adobtion to a good family.

That's how I would feel about the situation if it happened to me, but due to the fact that I am a male I can never get pregnant, though there is always the possability of being raped no matter what your gender is.

So even when it's still at the stage of two cells, it's a 'person' is it?

Even when it consists only of the 3 basic cell layers?

That's pretty dehumanizing, Inuyasha. You have just put women below some primitive tissue.

You make me sick.

And convenience? SHUT THE HELL UP. Risking diabetes, fistula, and other health problems is just an inconvenience? Being an invalid for 9 months is an inconvenience?

I know a woman who had to have a historectomy and is incontinent (for life) due to the "inconvenience" of have been pregnant. She pisses her pants every day if she so much as coughs or walks down the stairs at a normal pace and jarrs herself the tiniest bit. Forget laughing. She has had two "corrective" surgeries that did nothing more than cause her more discomfort and suffering. They corrected nothing.

One of my family members, who has type 1 diabetes, suffered horribly through her pregnancy and, when it came time to deliver, had to have a C-section because the baby was too large. She did not heal from the C-section for OVER 6 MONTHS because of her diabetes - and I'm just talking about the incision. She is still not the same, and she never will be.

I would like to see Inuyasha squeeze a grapefruit out through his urethra, get torn to hell (like I did when I gave birth) and tell me it's an "inconvenience."

If I were to get pregnant against my will, whether it was through rape or because anticonception failed, I would have an abortion or take the morning-after pill. Mentally, I'm in no fit state to raise a child and I don't want to go through nine months of pregnancy just to give the child away afterwards, then possibly have it come back eightteen years later to ask why I abanboned it. I don't think every fertilised ovum has a right to live, especially not if it contains my DNA. I would loathe having a baby grow inside me and possible shift that hate onto the child after birth. That's not something I would wish on another human being and honestly, an abortion would be a kinder option. One could possibly force me to act as a walking uterus and have a child, but one could not force me to love the child, and a life without being loved is no life at all, if you ask me.