Are Christians responsible for the hatred of Jews today?
Irrelevant. The OP and this thread is talking about TODAY. The past is the past, and I don't know of really any Christian denomination that is anti-Jew or anti-Israel.
I've heard some people try to make a stir by invoking anti-Semitic rhetoric, but it's not common at all.
There is the Ku Klux Klan, which is a Christian organization. You can only join if you are a White, non-Jewish Christian. They didn't used to let Catholics in, but now they let in Catholics.
I don't know what denominations they attract, but I suspect primarily Baptists.
And most Christians think the KKK are nuts, what's your point. There are atheists out there that hate Jews, should I condemn all atheists for the actions of a few wackos that happen to be Atheist?
Yes, most Christians probably do (and certainly should) regard the Ku Klux Klan as a bunch of idiots. But, this is a Christian organization that is openly anti-Jewish.
Irrelevant. The OP and this thread is talking about TODAY. The past is the past, and I don't know of really any Christian denomination that is anti-Jew or anti-Israel.
I've heard some people try to make a stir by invoking anti-Semitic rhetoric, but it's not common at all.
There is the Ku Klux Klan, which is a Christian organization. You can only join if you are a White, non-Jewish Christian. They didn't used to let Catholics in, but now they let in Catholics.
I don't know what denominations they attract, but I suspect primarily Baptists.
And most Christians think the KKK are nuts, what's your point. There are atheists out there that hate Jews, should I condemn all atheists for the actions of a few wackos that happen to be Atheist?
Yes, most Christians probably do (and certainly should) regard the Ku Klux Klan as a bunch of idiots. But, this is a Christian organization that is openly anti-Jewish.
And there are atheist organizations that hate Jews too, aside from the fact the mainstream media doesn't report on them, what's your point. Should I say that all Atheists are anti-semites or that Atheism supports anti-semitism?
The Communists in the Soviet Union were anti-Jewish, if you mean right now, that is hard to find reports of because the mainstream media usually tries to cover it up.
Antisemitism has a very long history in all Christian countries. The Russians before and after communism maintain that tradition. That many communists were atheist is irrelevant.
He was asked to name one atheist organization that is anti-Semitic and he gave him an answer. Kinda funny how you've called me and Inuyasha trolls when you always have this contemptuous tone in your posts and resort to the same old straw men...
I'm atheist and I find foaming at the mouth atheists just as annoying as door knocking Evangelists. I dunno why the OP felt the need to make a million threads attacking Christianity...
Inuyasha, the Soviet Union was not completely antiJewish until the 1950s. The early Soviet Union was kinda proJewish, if those Jews were Communist. Lenin actually went out of his way to invite socialist Jews into the Soviet system. Of course those Jews who were not Communist or belonged to an unauthorized left party like anarchist or Menshevik etc were liquidated. In theory, Jews had full civil rights if they were obedient. Lenin's right hand man Lev Bronstein, aka Trotsky was Jewish as were Zinoviev, Radek, Lativinov and many other top Communists. Stalin was less proJewish in attitude, but he pretended to like the Jews in public until the 1950s. Stalin, in fact persecuted everyone, Jewsh or not. During the War, Stalin pretended to like Jews so to make Hitler look bad.
In the early 50s, Stalin became openly antiJewish. He accused Jews of plotting against him. After his death in 1953 , there were few Jews in the Soviet power structure. In 1964, the Brezhnev-Andropov regime passed various anti Jewish directives. Jews names and racial-ethnic identities were kept in vast dossiers and they were considered potential traitors.
Post Soviet Russia has seen a rise in traditional antiSemitism.
Blood & Honour? The Bay Area National Anarchists? The Nationalistische Studentenvereniging? Those are a few I can think of oontaining probably mostly atheist members.
I'm not sure of Charles Martel Society counts as atheist, but they definitely have quite a few atheist supporters. Anyway, the whole idea that antisemitism is related to Christianity is ludicrous. Antisemitism is of all cultures and of all ages.
Some interesting quotes :
This is the flip side of your other post-"Should Israel apologize for killing christ?"
you're trying desperately to start a brawl by provoking things from both sides.
Very clever!
you're suggesting that Christianity continuously promotes anti-semitism by repeating the story of the cruxifixtion (which is central to christianity).
A story about at man murdered by a crowd of people who happened to be Americans is not the same thing as a story that portrays Americans a nation of murderes.
Portraying Booth shooting Lincoln is not the same as porttraying all Americans as murderes.
So, no the gaspel narratives of the crusifixtion are not antisemetic. They depict a Jewish guy murdered by the Romans the latter acting at the behest of a local mob of folks who happened to have been also jewish-like the unfortunate guy.
But I will concede one thing.
This story thats come down to us about a crowd of people demanding that their Roman oppressors execute one of their own is as phoney as a three dollar bill, and is obviously spin.
( imagine Iraqis demanding that american soldiers execute a fellow Iraqi, or Poles demanding that their Soviet Red Army occupiers execute a fellow Pole- occupied peoples dont act that way- the story is fishy as hell).
The Romans (not the jews) killed Christ for their own reasons that had nothing to do wiith desires of the local jews. I think we all know that.
A couple decades afte rthe cruxifiction, when the early christians began to spread the word to the gentiles, the world was still owned by the empire of rome.
But now there was a problem. How do you spread a faith throughout the very same empire that executed your creed's founding prophet? (kinda like srpeading a religion founded by benedict arnold throughout America- its a contradiction).
To find an answer the early chiristinas apparently hired a spin doctor to change the story a little bit.
Instad of the truth that christ was matyred by Roman authorities becasue he was a threat to roman authorities- it became the hokey tale we now know today about christ being turned on by the local population who in turn demanded that the romans kill christ.
Thus the blame for the deed was shifted away from the Roman government to the local people. This subtle change in the story had a huge effect. It enabled christinas to freely promote their new faith throughout the vast terroties of the roman empire without requiring converts to become rebels against the Roman State ( which they would have to become if christ were recognized as being rightly executed by the romans because he was a local trheat to roman authority).
This spin control paved the way for Christianity's rise. but it also caused the Jews to be scapegoated as villians because not all are able or are willing to make the fine distinction between a victim of "a crowd who happens to be Jewish" and "being killed by the Jews."
Today it would be nice to spin the story back to the truth. That it was all the fault of the Roman Empire. Unlike "the jews" as a culprit- "the roman empire" is actaully a very good scapegoat for the modern world because (a) its an insitituion and not an ethnic group of people and (b) it isnt around anymore- since Rome was the real perp anyway- why not blame it for the crucifiction? Blaming rome would be better than blaming any extant human group for christs death and would promote world peace.
NaturalPlastic, I believe the story was not that the "Jews" as a people killed Jesus, but that the Jewish priesthood, the Pharisees, and the local Herodian government considered Jesus an upstart. The Romans did not directly rule Judea. It was a "client state" under Roman protection. The local Herodian dynasty were known to be friends of many of Caesar's household. Judea was ruled by the local Herodian court and the Sanhedrin council made up of priests. A historical figure Qayafah (Caiapha) chaired the council. The Gospels point to hostility of Jesus to the Pharisees and priests. The Pharisees were hostile to Jesus and his close friend Baptist John had criticized the priests and the Herodians. The Roman ProConsul was Caesar's representative in Judea and had final say on certain issues. The ProConsul Pontius had several cohorts of Roman regulars to back up the local Herodian troops.
The story was that the Jewish ruling class wanted rid of Jesus, but they wanted Romans to do the dirty work of killing Him. Now, it is not anti-Semitic to say this, as many Jews despised the Sanhedrin, the priests, and the Pharisees. Nearly all Jews despised the Herodians.
Direct Roman rule came after the Jewish zealots overthrew the Herodians and defied Roman authority.
I was not alive then, so I cannot vouch for the story. However, Jesus would have posed more a threat to the priests and pharisees than to Caesar Tiberius.
Stalin was a Jew hater from the git-go.
ruveyn
The story was that the Jewish ruling class wanted rid of Jesus, but they wanted Romans to do the dirty work of killing Him. Now, it is not anti-Semitic to say this, as many Jews despised the Sanhedrin, the priests, and the Pharisees. Nearly all Jews despised the Herodians.
Direct Roman rule came after the Jewish zealots overthrew the Herodians and defied Roman authority.
I was not alive then, so I cannot vouch for the story. However, Jesus would have posed more a threat to the priests and pharisees than to Caesar Tiberius.
Whilst this is mainly true, the Jewish religious leaders knew fully well from prophesy that this was the Messiah, but they didnt want to lose thier own position of power over the people, the people themselves joined the guilt.
The Romans themselves had found no fault in Jesus and wanted to let them go, even offering them the chance to release Jesus as was the custom to release one at the Passover.
The ordinary Jewish people however, instead of choosing thier King and saviour, choose Barabbus instead.
Pontious Pilote, not wanting the blood of an innocent man on his hands, publicly washed his hands in front of the Jewish crowd to show niether he or the Romans wanted his death, the ordinary Jewish people however cried out with one voice:-
"Let his blood be upon us and upon our children".
and so it is.
This however, shouldnt be a reason for Christian anti-semitism, because Jesus was meant to be sacrificed, he was the sacrificial "Lamb of God", someone had to do it, Jesus himself said forgive them.
However, Christians follow what Jesus said and did, Jesus himself condemned, not the Jewish people, but the Jewish leaders, he said they where doing the work of thier father the Devil, in Revelation it is they who bring about Satans One World Government, and who rule over kingdoms of the world.
Christians therefore should condemn and expose what Elite Judaism is doing at every oppurtunity, in order to protect themselves however, Elite Judaism, (the Bankers and Rabbis), try to discredit Christians by crying anti-semitism and saying we are against all Jews no matter how many times we explain its only those of "The Synagogue of Satan" who prove by thier actions they are not real Jews.
The trouble is, just as the ordinary Jews alligned themselves with the actions of the Pharisees when killing Jesus, they today align themselves with thier current leaders, the Bankers, so as we get more infyriated with the likes of the Rothschilds, the average innocent Jew is unfortunately also going to end up sharing in the coming wrath.
Heres a warning Jesus gave to the ordinary Jews at the end of the days.
4And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
5For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
8Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.
The Communists in the Soviet Union were anti-Jewish, if you mean right now, that is hard to find reports of because the mainstream media usually tries to cover it up.
As I understand it, the Soviet Communists were against every religion, not just Jews. The communists were accused both of being founded and supported by Jews, and of being anti-Jewish.
So you can't you name one atheist organization in the United States that is anti-Jewish? Why would the "mainstream media" try to "cover it up?" Is Google not even returning any results? Wouldn't they at least have a website? Or, is their's a secretive organization?
We have, on the one hand, the Ku Klux Klan, which is an anti-Jewish Christian organization. But, nothing on the other hand?
And what should we do about elite Christians? You know, those television evangelists, bankers, and politicians.
And what should we do about elite Christians? You know, those television evangelists, bankers, and politicians.
Expose them as well, and the Pope, all these man made "Christian" religions do so much damage to Christianity.
Who was it who said, "If good men say nothing, evil flurishes".
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