Religion

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I am in the christian religion.

hmmm, is it not interesting how-

The Apple tree of sin was placed in eden just to tempt what was supposed to be perfect to begin with? perhaps it was meant to be that humans was to eat of this apple in the first place? and if so why punish Adam and eve for what was first planed in the first place? if god is perfect and knows everything even whats in someones heart then he/she would know that they would eat of the apple in the first place, and if so why tempt them in the first place but instead make them the way we was meant to be in the first place? did he/she just want a reason to pick on us and blame us for something? perhaps his/her own mistakes? oh thats right god don't make mistakes does he/she/it?!?!.

also

If Adam and eve only had two sons where did the sons get their wives? was the girls apes? or did they bread their mother for more children? its not Adam's children (girls) for if it was then the rest of his children would have been noted wouldn't they? and if he did have more children that was not noted then wouldn't those girls be the sisters of his other two sons?
hmmm incest and bestiality, are not those sins them selves? perhaps Adam and eve was not the only first ones god created, but then again if thats the case where did the others come from and why was they not mentioned? and that would mean that Adam and eve was not the first wouldn't it? because if they was then where the extra wives come from?
was others made from the clay of the earth as well but not mentioned in the bible? and if so what was their sins to be rejected from the garden of eden them selves? or was they not given a chance to be in eden because of Adam and Eve messing up? and if thats the case why blame them for others mistakes and if they made mistakes why make more imperfections?

Alas, this does not help with where the dinosaur's bones came from, perhaps they was just placed to throw us off track, and if so is that not a lie in its self? god sinning?!? hmmmm.

aspergian_mutant, exactly why you shouldn't believe everything you read, including the Bible.

It's called the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil and only God and the angels had knowledge of good and evil until Eve ate from it. I find the whole affair very intriguing.

I've only just recently tried to read the Bible. Only got partway through Genesis - it's so hard to follow.

lol, yes, but I think your over looking my point.

I got your point. I used to be hardkore anti. Now I just see the whole thing as an interesting story not to be dissed.

I mean, if some red-faced lunatic came upto me and being non-stop in-my-face about why I should be a catholic or muslim or whatever I'd kill him with an intellectual conversation heheheeee. But generally I find christians to be alright people.

I happen to be a believer in Jesus Christ, or to be more specific, I'm part of the Foursquare denomination, which is relatively close to baptist. I am not a believer that all the gods are one, because all those so called gods have different beliefs. I believe in God, who is the only God in my opinion that is existent. Plus, so many prophesies in the Bible have come true, and also no one ever in history has ever been able to prove it wrong; nor have been able to destroy it over the few thousand years God has created it. That is my reason, but my faith is also based upon faith, and not only phyical things, much like Thomas the apostle.

After many years of contemplation and the study of philosophy and religions I settled on the understanding that we are each a part of the whole, like we are each a part of a greater mind, parts of a big brain, when we die someplace out in this universe that extends forever is another almost like us, almost like we are an echo of them and them of us, keeping the memory's of what we learn.
At one time in my life I had a vision, I passed through a heavenly garden through a gate that took me into a space with NOTHINGNESS except for a raven who ate the lost souls....... at that time in my life /or soon before/ my grandfather on my mothers side died, it got me contemplating god and death, he was a preacher and a loving friend.....
do I believe in god? no, not like most do, to me the whole universe we live in is just a brain cell that grows and learns and evolves then passes passing the information and wisdom onto the next that becomes of its passing, nothing lasts forever, but our memory's in some way and the materials we are made of. if there was an individual god he/it would want only one thing from us, to know and love thy self, in knowing thy self he gets to know and love his /its own (alone?) self, there is no value in knowing what you already know unless its to know thy self better and to care for and love ones own self with reason. so in other words, free will is a necessity to growth and gain in the truth of how one feels about ones self, even god.
do you fear your ending to your own existence? perhaps thats a small taste of oblivion.. learn from it, nothing, even our souls last forever, or we would have always have been.., in a way we have, but not like you conceive it to be, argue with it in fear, it changes nothing of what is.
our whole multi-verse that we are somewhat aware of is like one big brain cell, we are but a small part of it, we mater not, yet we make the differences in what it learns and is all about,... grow, love thy self, become all that you can be, care for others, be happy, that is your purpose.
now, ask your selves, does it mater if i am right or wrong? alls that mater's is that in the end, be good unto your self and others and be all that you can be. let then the end take care of its self.

Last edited by aspergian_mutant on 04 Mar 2005, 9:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Wow! I really like your analogoy of the universe compared to a brain cell. I can't stop my mind from thinking abou this now. I too see the universe as one big whole with NOTHING being seperate from anything else. When I was very young (5) it struck me that I am the grass, the grass is me, god is the grass. As I got older, I thought about how even though I wasn't touching things, I still felt joined to them. Like there was something EVERYWHERE. I was taught at church that god is everywhere, so what ever it was that joined everything together became god to me.

When I was old enough to learn the concept of atoms, it finally made more sense to me. Everything is a bunch of atoms vibrating in unique relation to each other. And what it is that keeps them united is the ENERGY they create. So god became this ENERGY that keeps all things united. We too are a bunch of atoms and we have a magnetic energy field that is created from that. What ever we put into our energy goes out to the 'whole' as well.
So for me god does not have a personality. He is not a grey haired old man sitting on a thrown in heaven with a bunch of lightning bolts in his right hand. god is bigger than that to me. Much, much bigger than that. We live in a world of opposites. Things are either this or that or something in between. We can't imagine that white can be its opposite and its middle range all in the exact same moment. But to me they are. So this concept explains to me the meaning of the trinity. The all encompassing.

I better stop there because this is my life long obsession. I don't ever mean to say that any concept I contemplate is the truth. If I was to stop and beleive what I know, I would stop allowing that concept to grow. I used to get very stuck in what I thought I knew, and life would respond with a quick swift kick in the bottom.

ElfMan

I Am a Christian, Catholic to be exact, i read the bible but there is one thing i dont understand, in Exodus, where the commandments are, it said not to idolize anyone or have a 'god' other that Him.However we worship Jesus, granted he is the Son of God, but not God himself. What's the deal?

On another note, many protestant fell that Catholics 'worship' Mary, we do not, we merely give her great honor and respect for giving birth to the Lord. Just in case any heretics were wondering

I too find it hard to follow, how do the bible thumpers do it?

I think they call it "interpretation" (i.e. completely ignore what's written and stick whatever you fancy in instead).

But if that is true, then you will never understand the christian religion. You might be overlooking the most important part and not know it.

Aww, poor Satan. Nobody loves him. You'll make cute Satan cry!

Hee, no offense. I know full well you mean the demon that is the destructive side of society, not the demon of any particular book. There are those who call "The Underdog" archetype demon though, so beware of rejecting all that associate themselves with "evil."

What's to understand?

Supposed peace-loving hippy dude (who genuine historical sources suggest was actually anything but, but anyway.....) gets nailed to a tree for (allegedly) just wanting everyone to be nice to each other.
Dodgy, power mad self-interest groups rewrite, corrupt and endlessly "interpret" his (alleged) story to fit their thoroughly machiavellian intentions.
Countless millions are killed, intimidated, humiliated, tortured and just generally made to feel bad about themselves (exact level of severity of said treatment modfied to suit prevailing social wind of the time) for 2000 years to keep said evil power groups in wealth and power, all in the name of said hippy dude.
Evil power groups twist in the wind in a desperate attempt to keep "current" as level of education and public awareness shines an uncomfortable light on all this cobblers they spout.....

Religion Twists in the Wind - a one act play by T. Kash (reprinted courtesy of Samuel French Associates):

Setting: Interior of some church or other. Evil religious guy #1 is center stage.
Evil religious guy #1: "The earth is the centre of the Universe, and this is a fundamental pillar of our Christian belief.... After all, God wouldn't send his first born son to just anywhere now, would he? Anyone who suggests otherwise is a heretic and will get awfully nasty things done about his person, because that's what Jesus wanted us to do (in our interpretation of what he actually meant when he said 'love and peace for everybody, dudes... Violence is like, real bad karma, man.... Sitar solo!! !! Na-na-na-naaaa-na-nah..... Naw-na-naw-na-naaaaaa...... Bl-i-i-i-i-i-ngggg!! !').
Copernicus: enters L carrying a filofax and with a smug look on his face "But the earth isn't the centre of the universe - look at all this proof that I've collected by means of my scientific curiosity and ingenuity"
Evil religious guy #1: "Heretic!! !! ! Burn for your sins!! !!" throws Copernicus in a big roaring furnace that's in the church for some reason the author can't be bothered to flesh out right now
Copernicus: "Ouch - My, that does smart rather, actually..... Ooooh, that'll ache come the morning....." dies feeling in a bit of a strop, all things considered
Evil religious guy #1: "Mwah-ha-ha.... I'm just so evil!! !!" crosses himself and chants "Dominus, viscous, limited slip differe-nnnn-tial......"
Slightly less Evil religious guy #2: enters DS "Errmmmm - actually everyone agrees with old Copernicus now that the great unwashed are all more educated and aware, and given that the evidence is, after all, incrontivertible - If we keep claiming otherwise everyone will see us as fools and desert us, and we'll have no more followers to intimidate to make us feel like big men, and no more money to buy big poncey robes and gold candlesticks with, and we'll have to get proper jobs down Tescos......"
Evil religious guy #1: "Ohhh..... Oh, well never mind..... Errrrmmmm.... That whole "centre of the Universe" thing was never that important to our beliefs anyway, was it?..... Ahem..... <cough>" shifts about from foot to foot uncomfortably
Slightly less Evil religious guy #2: "Shall we go and victimise some homosexuals or something to make ourselves feel better, then?"
Evil religious guy #1: jumping up and down and clapping with excitement "Ooh! Ooh! Me! Me! I wanna speak out about the evils of 18 rated movies! Please can I mister, please? Mary Whitehouse said I could.... honest....." exeunt omnes

Curtain

Just found this thread, but thought i'd add on my bit.
I am Pagen, to be precise i follow the northern tradition or Heathenry, I started out on this because i couldn't find a link with what i was bought up with (church of England).
Now i have found an extended circle of friends and many people who i would think of as as close as family, also i am doing an awful lot more for the environment including looking after an area of woodland to make sure that it stays as beautiful as it is.

I don't care what religion other people are, but before the shouts start this is because it makes no difference to me what people beleive as long as the are happy doing so and are happy for me to beleive what i do.

baby

xx