Belief that life continues after death more beneficial?

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Which is belief is more benefical to your psyche?
Life after death 31%  31%  [ 4 ]
No life after death 69%  69%  [ 9 ]
Total votes : 13

Tiranasta
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13 Jun 2012, 9:09 pm

Varies based on the individual. That said, I've never understood people who say that they believe something because they prefer to believe that, because I don't see how they could sustain what, to me, seems like voluntary willful ignorance without serious cognitive dissonance.



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13 Jun 2012, 9:11 pm

Tiranasta wrote:
Varies based on the individual. That said, I've never understood people who say that they believe something because they prefer to believe that, because I don't see how they could sustain what, to me, seems like voluntary willful ignorance without serious cognitive dissonance.


Once again some one on WP confuses me gosh I hate it when that happens :lol:



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13 Jun 2012, 10:02 pm

Thom_Fuleri wrote:
enrico_dandolo wrote:
Thom_Fuleri wrote:
The main advantage of a belief in an afterlife is comfort. Death is a scary concept and it helps a lot of people to think of it as a transition rather than an ending. It's also a very childish idea, and it does a lot of harm. You only have a certain amount of time in this life, so why waste it in readiness for another one that you have no proof actually exists?

Because there is little incentive to act virtuously all the time if there isn't a punishment afterwards. Of course, this can be exploited by the powerful, but it helps keep certain behaviours in control. It can be beneficial, on a societal level (keyword: can).


Ah yes, the paradox that Christians (the usual proponents of this argument) are less moral than atheists - some Christians seem to believe the only thing that stops them going on crime sprees and murdering people is the will of God. Atheists are divided from God and therefore have to restrain themselves by their own efforts...

The big issue with these beliefs is that they are so subjective. Do this and you'll be rewarded, do that and you'll be punished. But what are "this" and "that"? Will you be punished with eternal fire for blasphemy, or eating pork, or working on a holy day? Even Christian morality has shifted over time - Jesus was hot on giving up your riches, forgiveness and the destruction of out-of-season fig trees, but the bible happily condones slavery, incest and violence. Are there people in Hell for eating shellfish two thousand years ago while new believers are spared this torment? It's all very baffling.

And that's just looking at Christianity. What if the Buddhists are right and we just come back here?

On the subject of food, I believe the opposite: it was beneficial. Controling what could be eaten or under what condition makes sure that the food won't be toxic or dangerous. Obviously people don't go to hell for eating the wrong type of food at the wrong time, since hell doesn't actually exist, but that fear, false though it is, can be a good substitute for the true one: the food is dangerous, but people are too stupid to recognise it if it isn't spelled out as the will of God.

Evidently, the non-absolute quality of the principles defended by religion make them obsolete at times, like they are today. It may take some time before religions notices is food quality is scrutinised carefully enough that there is no need to make God come into the picture.

The point is, there is no objective benefit to always behaving virtuously, even though that behaviour might need to be encouraged because of its beneficial effects on other people. Saying that this or that is worth ten thousand years of purgatory can be effective. I, for myself, prefer to follow the best possible course from a (or my) consequentialist point of view. That does, however, take a lot of reflexion and a certain amount of self-denial. Some follow rules for the benefit of "the community", for their peers, their family, their colleagues, etc. In the end, even though it can be exploited by who makes the rules, as it often is, fear of punishment in the afterlife is just another such incentive, which has the benefit of being very easy to use for the common people. I don't see it as better or worse than the other, at least as long as people believe in it.



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14 Jun 2012, 6:18 am

Shatbat wrote:
Huh... I feel sort of like an intruder in an already established conversation :lol:


Me too. :lol:

I can't see how it is beneficial. Why waste what time you have here? The way I live would not change, regardless if the concept of "god" or whatever, turned out to be true or not.

As far as science can tell us now. we already know that energy is never destroyed or created, it just changes forms. Hence where we came from is more or less what we return to.

I highly doubt that in the process of energy changing forms, you somehow retain your consciousness, float up to heaven, only to be greeted next to the big pearly gates by saint peter. That just seems highly improbable to me.


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14 Jun 2012, 6:37 am

snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
SpiritBlooms wrote:
I can see positives and negatives to both sides, but there have actually been studies that show people are on the whole happier if they have some believe in an afterlife. Is it a foolish sort of happiness? Who knows?

I believe in an afterlife, but it's not a strong belief - I could be wrong, who's to say? I also don't think about it that much. I try to focus on my current life and live it well. I figure even if I am a spiritual being living a physical existence, there's got to be some purpose to the physical existence and I should do my best to make the best of it. Living for some future, heavenly existence while I'm here wouldn't make much sense.


If it enhances their life, how could it be foolish?


Pretending taxes don't exist would probably also enhance a person's life, though in reality it is a false sense of security that will lead to consequences. At least with the afterlife, there won't be any let down or consequences; unless one's belief about getting there involves killing


What does believing there's life after death have to do with taxes?

How does believing there isn't life after death lead to a false sense of security?


It is called an analogy. I also did not said anything about *not* believing in afterlife


I get that, and I don't get the connection. Reason being is that you are certain avoiding paying your taxes will get you in the end, and you're most likely right, even if you believe you'll be fine. And you compare it to believing in life after death, but you can't be certain about it. It's just a belief.

Bottom line. Bad analogy.


No, the infamous snapcap lack of comprehension is at play once again


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14 Jun 2012, 6:37 am

Joker wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
SpiritBlooms wrote:
I can see positives and negatives to both sides, but there have actually been studies that show people are on the whole happier if they have some believe in an afterlife. Is it a foolish sort of happiness? Who knows?

I believe in an afterlife, but it's not a strong belief - I could be wrong, who's to say? I also don't think about it that much. I try to focus on my current life and live it well. I figure even if I am a spiritual being living a physical existence, there's got to be some purpose to the physical existence and I should do my best to make the best of it. Living for some future, heavenly existence while I'm here wouldn't make much sense.


If it enhances their life, how could it be foolish?


Pretending taxes don't exist would probably also enhance a person's life, though in reality it is a false sense of security that will lead to consequences. At least with the afterlife, there won't be any let down or consequences; unless one's belief about getting there involves killing


What does believing there's life after death have to do with taxes?

How does believing there isn't life after death lead to a false sense of security?


It is called an analogy. I also did not said anything about *not* believing in afterlife


I get that, and I don't get the connection. Reason being is that you are certain avoiding paying your taxes will get you in the end, and you're most likely right, even if you believe you'll be fine. And you compare it to believing in life after death, but you can't be certain about it. It's just a belief.

Bottom line. Bad analogy.


Thus Snapcap has spoken.


Thus Joker continues jacking off through postwhore cheerleading


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14 Jun 2012, 7:24 am

Kjas wrote:
I can't see how it is beneficial. Why waste what time you have here?


Because that's what makes them happy. Why would you read a book? Why would I watch a movie? Because that's satisfying to the individual.



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14 Jun 2012, 9:12 am

Tiranasta wrote:
Varies based on the individual. That said, I've never understood people who say that they believe something because they prefer to believe that, because I don't see how they could sustain what, to me, seems like voluntary willful ignorance without serious cognitive dissonance.
I have never understood it, either. I think it would be disruptive to my creativity if you want to know the honest truth. Latching onto a belief makes me feel like I'm shutting down a lot of ongoing projects, and I get the thought, "my house is going to burn down!" Skepticism is more comfortable because it feels to me like a ready and prepared state, like I know I'm running on all four cylinders.



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14 Jun 2012, 9:15 am

Tiranasta wrote:
Varies based on the individual. That said, I've never understood people who say that they believe something because they prefer to believe that, because I don't see how they could sustain what, to me, seems like voluntary willful ignorance without serious cognitive dissonance.

I know people seem to do that, but I tend to assume it's something deeper than that. My own belief in an afterlife has grown out of several things. Reading about near death experiences when I was young, my experience of being with someone when they died, another experience that happened when someone related to me died clear across the country, reading about some fairly well verified cases of mediumship, and so on and so forth. It's an accumulation of things. Still, as I wrote earlier, it's not a strong belief. It's more that the accumulation of reasons makes me think that wow, this is all pointing in a certain direction and that is that there is a part of us that survives physical death.

But again I don't live my life for that. I live my life for what it is now. Certainly my spiritual beliefs, feelings, and questions about death affect how I live my life, but it's not as if I put more importance on what happens after I die than on what happens while I'm alive. I believe in living for today. To me death is a great mystery. Perhaps we have hints, perhaps it's a complete ending. No one knows. I don't fear death as much as I fear some means of death - or leaving something undone that I consider important, such as telling my loved ones that I love them, things like that. As cluttered as my life seems at times, I actually worry about leaving a mess behind for someone else. But I don't fear death. I see it as being like walking through a doorway. Behind that door is either nothing or something....

Shatbat wrote:
As far as science can tell us now. we already know that energy is never destroyed or created, it just changes forms. Hence where we came from is more or less what we return to.

I highly doubt that in the process of energy changing forms, you somehow retain your consciousness, float up to heaven, only to be greeted next to the big pearly gates by saint peter. That just seems highly improbable to me.
Is spirit energy? That's the question, isn't it? Is consciousness energy? We really don't know.



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14 Jun 2012, 9:16 am

I will tell you why not believing in a life hereafter is useful. If you realize that you only go around once and at best for a limited number of years (if you live to be 100 you will have only 36,525 days), THEN you will learn to use what little time you have as wisely as you know how. Counting the day is a sure cure for procrastination and laziness.

People who think they will be with Jesus forever in heaven are not only kidding themselves, but promoting their own bad character traits.

Eternal Life is Eternal Boredom. It is worse than any Dantean conception of Hell.

ruveyn



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14 Jun 2012, 10:04 am

Vigilans wrote:
Joker wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
SpiritBlooms wrote:
I can see positives and negatives to both sides, but there have actually been studies that show people are on the whole happier if they have some believe in an afterlife. Is it a foolish sort of happiness? Who knows?

I believe in an afterlife, but it's not a strong belief - I could be wrong, who's to say? I also don't think about it that much. I try to focus on my current life and live it well. I figure even if I am a spiritual being living a physical existence, there's got to be some purpose to the physical existence and I should do my best to make the best of it. Living for some future, heavenly existence while I'm here wouldn't make much sense.


If it enhances their life, how could it be foolish?


Pretending taxes don't exist would probably also enhance a person's life, though in reality it is a false sense of security that will lead to consequences. At least with the afterlife, there won't be any let down or consequences; unless one's belief about getting there involves killing


What does believing there's life after death have to do with taxes?

How does believing there isn't life after death lead to a false sense of security?


It is called an analogy. I also did not said anything about *not* believing in afterlife


I get that, and I don't get the connection. Reason being is that you are certain avoiding paying your taxes will get you in the end, and you're most likely right, even if you believe you'll be fine. And you compare it to believing in life after death, but you can't be certain about it. It's just a belief.

Bottom line. Bad analogy.


Thus Snapcap has spoken.


Thus Joker continues jacking off through postwhore cheerleading


Your just mad cause Snapcap owned you lol



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14 Jun 2012, 11:21 am

Tiranasta wrote:
Varies based on the individual. That said, I've never understood people who say that they believe something because they prefer to believe that, because I don't see how they could sustain what, to me, seems like voluntary willful ignorance without serious cognitive dissonance.


I could see it being willful ignorance if there was actual proof to settle the matter, but there isn't, so I can't see how it is.


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14 Jun 2012, 11:24 am

Vigilans wrote:

No, the infamous snapcap lack of comprehension is at play once again


Yes.

I don't think Vigilans is up to expanding on his point better, maybe someone else could for him?


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14 Jun 2012, 11:37 am

ruveyn wrote:
I will tell you why not believing in a life hereafter is useful. If you realize that you only go around once and at best for a limited number of years (if you live to be 100 you will have only 36,525 days), THEN you will learn to use what little time you have as wisely as you know how. Counting the day is a sure cure for procrastination and laziness.


For some folk, it could be the opposite. They might not feel like their work is in vain if they just cease to exist. Also, if a group of people were being oppressed, and the group was divided by people that believed and didn't believe in an afterlife, which people would be more likely to fight their oppressors? The people who think this is it and enjoy it while it lasts, or the people that believe that there is a life beyond this, and their physical death here is just one of many. The people that believe in another life might be more spirited to make a move and try to over throw the people that control their lives in an undesirable way.

Quote:
People who think they will be with Jesus forever in heaven are not only kidding themselves, but promoting their own bad character traits.


This is just opinion. Not all Christians are bad.

Quote:

Eternal Life is Eternal Boredom. It is worse than any Dantean conception of Hell.

ruveyn


How do you know? If life after death is a reality, it's likely that you've been alive before. Are you bored now?


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14 Jun 2012, 12:16 pm

snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:

No, the infamous snapcap lack of comprehension is at play once again


Yes.

I don't think Vigilans is up to expanding on his point better, maybe someone else could for him?


What else can be said about it? It is not hard to understand. One can imagine any situation they want and accept it over reality but it always amounts to self-delusion

Joker wrote:
Your just mad cause Snapcap owned you lol


I'm not mad at anything, especially not snapcap's misunderstanding of an analogy. I find your posting pointless, semi-literate exercises in dilettantism, cheer-leading like a yappy little dog barking at the heels of its big buddy "YEAH YOU TELL THEM BOSS!! !"


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14 Jun 2012, 12:17 pm

Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:

No, the infamous snapcap lack of comprehension is at play once again


Yes.

I don't think Vigilans is up to expanding on his point better, maybe someone else could for him?


What else can be said about it? It is not hard to understand. One can imagine any situation they want and accept it over reality but it always amounts to self-delusion

Joker wrote:
Your just mad cause Snapcap owned you lol


I'm not mad at anything, especially not snapcap's misunderstanding of an analogy. I find your posting pointless, semi-literate exercises in dilettantism, cheer-leading like a yappy little dog barking at the heels of its big buddy "YEAH YOU TELL THEM BOSS!! !"


Yeah your mad don't like it when people gain up on ya ha :P