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cubedemon6073
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11 Oct 2012, 1:34 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
marshall wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Of course, there are those who -- for some actual disability -- simply are unable to make do for themselves. These people do deserve some basic care ... but no special privileges, in my opinion. In any case, if you're receiving some form of governmental entitlement, then you have no reason to complain, even though you still have the right to complain.

:roll:

The one thing you do not seem to realize is that people who do receive some form of government help as their only means of modest existence are a bit frightened now that this countries debt is skyrocketing realizing they will likely be the first to be cast into the drink. Perhaps it would help you if they all just put a bullet through their f***ing skull so as not to be such a burden on you.


Maybe we should appoint Fnord the position of Decider of who has an actual disability or not....no that would be terrible.


Sweetleaf, if he did serve and was able to serve effectively then he developed tools to be able to do this and he has used these tools to function effectively in society. How was this man able to keep up with everything and everyone?

I do not believe I would've been able to serve whatsoever. I would be the guy who would mess up on the drills a lot. I would end up misunderstanding what the drill seargant says especially if I hear a noise. I may only hear a part of what he says. One time in fourth grade I forgot my lunch ticket. I asked my teacher if I could get my ticket. I thought he said go. He actually said no. We had a minor argument over this. This happens to me in my daily life a lot. Sometimes it can be whole sentences I think a person says one thing and they said something else entirely.

Fnord, did you experience what I am describing here? If you did, how did you manage to overcome this to be able to effectively function in the military?



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11 Oct 2012, 1:35 pm

I LOVE this whole us vs. them attitude! It's why military people are so easy to manipulate. They have been brainwashed to believe that their group is somehow special, that because they "sacrificed for their country" that they somehow have the right to look down on others and that no one else who hasn't "served" matters. It's why it is fairly easy for totalitarianism to rise up in many countries, after all they were just "following orders" while "serving". Thus, since they are part of this privileged group, they have the right to enslave others who are not. Disobey me? Well, you haven't "served", so I have a right to kill you! As to why I never "served"? I would get court martialed before I even left basic training because I see no reason why my CO has a right to order me around if I did not agree with his or her orders. With a job, I can walk out and quit. In the military, doing this would either get me shot or imprisoned. After all, most generals are likely not my intellectual equal, so I see no reason why they should be able to have life or death decisions regarding my life.


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11 Oct 2012, 1:51 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
marshall wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Of course, there are those who -- for some actual disability -- simply are unable to make do for themselves. These people do deserve some basic care ... but no special privileges, in my opinion. In any case, if you're receiving some form of governmental entitlement, then you have no reason to complain, even though you still have the right to complain.

:roll:

The one thing you do not seem to realize is that people who do receive some form of government help as their only means of modest existence are a bit frightened now that this countries debt is skyrocketing realizing they will likely be the first to be cast into the drink. Perhaps it would help you if they all just put a bullet through their f***ing skull so as not to be such a burden on you.


Maybe we should appoint Fnord the position of Decider of who has an actual disability or not....no that would be terrible.


Sweetleaf, if he did serve and was able to serve effectively then he developed tools to be able to do this and he has used these tools to function effectively in society. How was this man able to keep up with everything and everyone?

I do not believe I would've been able to serve whatsoever. I would be the guy who would mess up on the drills a lot. I would end up misunderstanding what the drill seargant says especially if I hear a noise. I may only hear a part of what he says. One time in fourth grade I forgot my lunch ticket. I asked my teacher if I could get my ticket. I thought he said go. He actually said no. We had a minor argument over this. This happens to me in my daily life a lot. Sometimes it can be whole sentences I think a person says one thing and they said something else entirely.

Fnord, did you experience what I am describing here? If you did, how did you manage to overcome this to be able to effectively function in the military?


What one person can do does not reflect what everyone else can do, I am glad for people who find good coping techniques or are able to over-come some of their difficulties I just find it difficult to deal with that some who have look down their noses at people who they perceive as weaker or whatever as though someone would willingly choose not to be able to handle things.

I know for a fact there is no way in hell I could be in the military, my friend who was in it even agrees I do find it strange my best friend was a sniper seems like it would be a hard and difficult job. He thinks this government is BS like I do though, for instance he served and basically got a big F*** U from the government hence the reason it took him so long to get the freaking SSDI for injuries sustained during that career.


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11 Oct 2012, 1:53 pm

outofplace wrote:
I LOVE this whole us vs. them attitude! It's why military people are so easy to manipulate. They have been brainwashed to believe that their group is somehow special, that because they "sacrificed for their country" that they somehow have the right to look down on others and that no one else who hasn't "served" matters. It's why it is fairly easy for totalitarianism to rise up in many countries, after all they were just "following orders" while "serving". Thus, since they are part of this privileged group, they have the right to enslave others who are not. Disobey me? Well, you haven't "served", so I have a right to kill you! As to why I never "served"? I would get court martialed before I even left basic training because I see no reason why my CO has a right to order me around if I did not agree with his or her orders. With a job, I can walk out and quit. In the military, doing this would either get me shot or imprisoned. After all, most generals are likely not my intellectual equal, so I see no reason why they should be able to have life or death decisions regarding my life.


Though I agree a lot in the military or who have been are that way or behave that way but maybe don't actually think like that. I feel this is too much of a generalization for the entire group.


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cubedemon6073
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11 Oct 2012, 1:58 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
cubedemon6073 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
marshall wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Of course, there are those who -- for some actual disability -- simply are unable to make do for themselves. These people do deserve some basic care ... but no special privileges, in my opinion. In any case, if you're receiving some form of governmental entitlement, then you have no reason to complain, even though you still have the right to complain.

:roll:

The one thing you do not seem to realize is that people who do receive some form of government help as their only means of modest existence are a bit frightened now that this countries debt is skyrocketing realizing they will likely be the first to be cast into the drink. Perhaps it would help you if they all just put a bullet through their f***ing skull so as not to be such a burden on you.


Maybe we should appoint Fnord the position of Decider of who has an actual disability or not....no that would be terrible.


Sweetleaf, if he did serve and was able to serve effectively then he developed tools to be able to do this and he has used these tools to function effectively in society. How was this man able to keep up with everything and everyone?

I do not believe I would've been able to serve whatsoever. I would be the guy who would mess up on the drills a lot. I would end up misunderstanding what the drill seargant says especially if I hear a noise. I may only hear a part of what he says. One time in fourth grade I forgot my lunch ticket. I asked my teacher if I could get my ticket. I thought he said go. He actually said no. We had a minor argument over this. This happens to me in my daily life a lot. Sometimes it can be whole sentences I think a person says one thing and they said something else entirely.

Fnord, did you experience what I am describing here? If you did, how did you manage to overcome this to be able to effectively function in the military?


What one person can do does not reflect what everyone else can do, I am glad for people who find good coping techniques or are able to over-come some of their difficulties I just find it difficult to deal with that some who have look down their noses at people who they perceive as weaker or whatever as though someone would willingly choose not to be able to handle things.

I know for a fact there is no way in hell I could be in the military, my friend who was in it even agrees I do find it strange my best friend was a sniper seems like it would be a hard and difficult job. He thinks this government is BS like I do though, for instance he served and basically got a big F*** U from the government hence the reason it took him so long to get the freaking SSDI for injuries sustained during that career.


I will agree with you Sweetleaf. Instead of bashing folks why don't this man tells us his techniques?



outofplace
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11 Oct 2012, 2:03 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
outofplace wrote:
I LOVE this whole us vs. them attitude! It's why military people are so easy to manipulate. They have been brainwashed to believe that their group is somehow special, that because they "sacrificed for their country" that they somehow have the right to look down on others and that no one else who hasn't "served" matters. It's why it is fairly easy for totalitarianism to rise up in many countries, after all they were just "following orders" while "serving". Thus, since they are part of this privileged group, they have the right to enslave others who are not. Disobey me? Well, you haven't "served", so I have a right to kill you! As to why I never "served"? I would get court martialed before I even left basic training because I see no reason why my CO has a right to order me around if I did not agree with his or her orders. With a job, I can walk out and quit. In the military, doing this would either get me shot or imprisoned. After all, most generals are likely not my intellectual equal, so I see no reason why they should be able to have life or death decisions regarding my life.


Though I agree a lot in the military or who have been are that way or behave that way but maybe don't actually think like that. I feel this is too much of a generalization for the entire group.


It isn't intended as a generalization of the entire group, but rather a statement on how the OP seems to think. It was intended more to spark thought than anything. I probably should have made this more clear when I wrote it. I have known members of our military that I respect, even though I disagree with their opinions and politics. However, none of them say those who have never been in the military have no right to speak up about government policies that affect their lives. As I see it, all of our lives are of equal value and deserve equal consideration. No one, not a billionare CEO, nor a member of the military, nor a member of a minority group, nor an average person deserves any more consideration than the next citizen in determining matters of politics. They affect us all in some way and so we all have a right to speak up and be heard.


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11 Oct 2012, 2:05 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
I will agree with you Sweetleaf. Instead of bashing folks why don't this man tells us his techniques?


Indeed, however then there is the paradox of what techniques work for one person may not work for another.


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cubedemon6073
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11 Oct 2012, 3:28 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
cubedemon6073 wrote:
I will agree with you Sweetleaf. Instead of bashing folks why don't this man tells us his techniques?


Indeed, however then there is the paradox of what techniques work for one person may not work for another.


I agree. Maybe it could give us ideas at least.



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11 Oct 2012, 3:37 pm

DerStadtschutz wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Everyone who whines and complains about the problems faced by this sick society is not doing so because they are sitting on their lay butt not trying to earn a living(just to point out a little fact you seem to have missed). Plenty of people working their ass off are having a hard time making a living, disabled people who cant work are working their asses off in various ways trying to get help so maybe they can function.

Not to mention many who b***h and complain about these issues cant exactly afford to leave, you certainly have the right to demand that they do though I just wouldn't expect any real results. Also its not like the U.S is some great savior of the world even half the military probably knows that I only base that on opinions of people I've met who have been in the military.

You sure complain a lot for someone who b*****s about other people bitching and complaining, anyways carry on.


Exactly. If I could afford to get out, I would.


This assumes other countries would even take us in. The US will not let us leave or give up our citizenship if we do not have another country to live in. Let's say another country doesn't take you in, then what Fnord? You're argument of love or leave it becomes moot. What are the immigration polices for the other countries? Our mobility is restricted to whomever lets us into their nation. How are we free to up and just leave Fnord?



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11 Oct 2012, 5:50 pm

Quote:
I LOVE this whole us vs. them attitude! It's why military people are so easy to manipulate. They have been brainwashed to believe that their group is somehow special, that because they "sacrificed for their country" that they somehow have the right to look down on others and that no one else who hasn't "served" matters.


That's what basic training is for - brainwashing. Lack of sleep and extreme exercising create physical exhaustion. This, coupled with emotional abuse and stress make the mind maleable. Do you think drill sargeants scream and call recruits names for no reason? Fraternities use these techniques during pledging, and some religions use them as well. Veterans should be de-programmed before they return to civilized society.



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11 Oct 2012, 6:11 pm

There is a reason behind military training and it is called discipline and to be able to follow orders in a combat situation, etc.

I admire anyone willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for their country and I am proud to be from a country where the military is an all volunteer force.

As the famous saying goes:
Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.


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11 Oct 2012, 6:25 pm

Looks like Fnord is off his medications again...

I have a hard time taking things that are essentially an accident of birth seriously. These include nationality, race, gender, sexual orientation, and default religion. Hell, 15 miles further south and I would have been born a Mexican citizen.



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11 Oct 2012, 6:31 pm

jdbob wrote:
Looks like Fnord is off his medications again...

I have a hard time taking things that are essentially an accident of birth seriously. These include nationality, race, gender, sexual orientation, and default religion. Hell, 15 miles further south and I would have been born a Mexican citizen.


When I moved around as kid and lived overseas it made me appreciate being American. Nothing like a different perspective to help you appreciate what you have, not to mention being homesick for anything American when you are overseas. I lived overseas in the 70's when there was not McDonalds and Starbucks everywhere outside America.

Is it true once a country has McDonald's they generally get along with America very well and do not go to war? 8O


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11 Oct 2012, 6:44 pm

Quote:
There is a reason behind military training and it is called discipline and to be able to follow orders in a combat situation, etc.


Brainwashing isn't about being able to follow orders. It's about being unable to not follow orders.



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11 Oct 2012, 7:11 pm

"The notion that a radical is one who hates his country is naive and usually idiotic. He is, more likely, one who loves his country more than the rest of us, and is thus more disturbed than the rest of us when he sees it debauched. He is not a bad citizen turning to crime; he is a good citizen driven to despair."--- H.L. Mencken



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11 Oct 2012, 7:17 pm

Gazelle wrote:
jdbob wrote:
Looks like Fnord is off his medications again...

I have a hard time taking things that are essentially an accident of birth seriously. These include nationality, race, gender, sexual orientation, and default religion. Hell, 15 miles further south and I would have been born a Mexican citizen.


When I moved around as kid and lived overseas it made me appreciate being American. Nothing like a different perspective to help you appreciate what you have, not to mention being homesick for anything American when you are overseas. I lived overseas in the 70's when there was not McDonalds and Starbucks everywhere outside America.

Is it true once a country has McDonald's they generally get along with America very well and do not go to war? 8O



McDonald's was in Belgrade in 1999...