Shall we leave anorexic women to starve to death?

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androbot2084
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16 Nov 2012, 3:45 pm

My sister in law never accused me of violating her will. If I let a poor mentally ill woman starve herself to death in my house I would have ended up in jail.



17 Nov 2012, 1:31 am

LizNY wrote:
Well for myself as a recovered anorexic.....I would say at that point in my life I felt intensely overwhelmed by everything. All of my anxieties were projected onto food as a way to cope with things my brain could not handle. I got out of it when things in my life improved and I no longer felt like a trapped animal being poked with a stick. Free from the things that previously tormented me, having an eating disorder started to feel like a prison in and of itself.

Perhaps think of things in your daily life routine that are technically not necissary but are done for emotional and psychological reasons? Done as a way to rebalance after feeling immensely overwhelmed? What aspects of your day would cause you to totally lose it if someone took them away?



A friend of mine who has suffered from anxiety and chronic depression for years struggled with anorexia as a teenager. What ended her bout with this condition was some very strong antidepressent medication. You are lucky your anorexia dissipated without the need for medical intervention.

Let's not forget Terry Schiavo, who suffered devastating brain damage due to a sudden cardiac arrest due to complications from anorexia nervosa. I read a heartening essay by a woman in hospice care because of irreversible organ damage she suffered from years of anorexia and when she finally started eating again it was too late to save her and upon learning this she became severely depressed upon realizing she's going to die prematurely.



ruveyn
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17 Nov 2012, 11:47 am

androbot2084 wrote:
My sister in law never accused me of violating her will. If I let a poor mentally ill woman starve herself to death in my house I would have ended up in jail.


Evict her first.

ruveyn



robo37
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18 Nov 2012, 5:01 pm

AspieRogue wrote:
LizNY wrote:
Hhmmmmm...I don't see how abortion is related to anorexia. I wasn't aware prolifers had a political stake in anorexia as well.


It's not. They don't. Bad analogy, robo.


My point is that there are obviously situations where it isn't right for a woman do choose what happens to her body, so the argument doesn't stand by itself. You cannot be truely pro-choice unless you adapt some solid, selfish principles. To make the "pro-choice" statement apply solely to aborbtions is even more absurd, this is permanently killing a developing-human being here, not treating some temporary disorder.



abacacus
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18 Nov 2012, 5:03 pm

AspieRogue wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:



Being a form of OCD, anorexia nervosa complete subverts the will. They are not making a decision to do it, they are compelled to starve themselves and they cannot control it. Don't you get it? Will power = PSEUDOSCIENCE! Brains make minds, and a compulsion is a feedback loop in the brain that exerts control over executive function and decision making.


I make choices every day and follow through with them. My own experiences is that I have the power to choose what I do.

Maybe you don't.

ruveyn



Well clearly you neither have OCD nor have you ever managed to get yourself addicted to drugs. Try snorting cocaine for at least 30 days(enough to get you high) and see if you can quit cold turkey. As for me, for me I have the power to choose what I do about 90% of the time. Free will is the ability to make a decision free of any constraints. But science has shown that there are constraints on our ability to make decisions; and one of those is the regional chemistry of our brains.


Why are you specifying cold turkey? A physical addiction (like cocaine) often requires help to break. The sensible decision in such a case would be to seek help.


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ruveyn
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18 Nov 2012, 6:47 pm

AspieRogue wrote:


Well clearly you neither have OCD nor have you ever managed to get yourself addicted to drugs. Try snorting cocaine for at least 30 days(enough to get you high) and see if you can quit cold turkey. As for me, for me I have the power to choose what I do about 90% of the time. Free will is the ability to make a decision free of any constraints. But science has shown that there are constraints on our ability to make decisions; and one of those is the regional chemistry of our brains.


I lit up my last cigarette 50 years ago. I decided to stop lighting up and I did. Cold turkey. I had a two pack a day habit then. Now I have a zero pack a day habit.

ruveyn



18 Nov 2012, 7:44 pm

ruveyn wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:


Well clearly you neither have OCD nor have you ever managed to get yourself addicted to drugs. Try snorting cocaine for at least 30 days(enough to get you high) and see if you can quit cold turkey. As for me, for me I have the power to choose what I do about 90% of the time. Free will is the ability to make a decision free of any constraints. But science has shown that there are constraints on our ability to make decisions; and one of those is the regional chemistry of our brains.


I lit up my last cigarette 50 years ago. I decided to stop lighting up and I did. Cold turkey. I had a two pack a day habit then. Now I have a zero pack a day habit.

ruveyn


Nicotine isn't nearly as powerful as cocaine. And furthermore, the withdrawal symptoms of smoking are unpleasant, but they are not life threatening unlike they are for alcohol and other depressants. If you quite drinking cold turkey your cravings for alcohol will turn into seizures strong enough to require hospitalization.......Or else you will turn out like Amy Winehouse.

You still have yet to produce actual evidence in favor of the existence of free will. These anecdotes are meaningless and prove nothing. Besides, different people respond differently to addictive drugs.



ruveyn
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18 Nov 2012, 8:02 pm

AspieRogue wrote:

Nicotine isn't nearly as powerful as cocaine. And furthermore, the withdrawal symptoms of smoking are unpleasant, but they are not life threatening unlike they are for alcohol and other depressants. If you quite drinking cold turkey your cravings for alcohol will turn into seizures strong enough to require hospitalization.......Or else you will turn out like Amy Winehouse.


Did you ever have a two pack a day habit? If you have, have you quit.

Smoking is insidious. For seven years after I quit I had this vivid "smoking" dreams. I dream I lit up and I could actually taste the tobacco smoke while dreaming. Also learning not to eat too much. People who quit smoking sometimes go on a snacking binge.

It is a hard habit to break and many people who try to break it fail.

ruveyn



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18 Nov 2012, 11:50 pm

MarketAndChurch wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
MarketAndChurch wrote:
I've never taken the time to understand the condition. Why do people not eat? If its for looks, could we simply shame their ugly frail looking bodies into eating again? Incentivize them by glorifying a more realistic ideal to aspire to?



Lots of reasons. Fear of getting fat, obsession with diet and eating healthy so they cut out certain foods, forgetting to eat due to obsessions and being absorbed into things it does not occur for someone to stop and eat, no appetite, they want control so they use food because it's what they can control.

It's not always about losing weight. There are two different kinds of anorexia; anorexia and anorexia nervosa (sp).


So it's not only about looks or fear of their weight? I've never heard of anorexia nervosa, I'll have to check that out.



Nope. Even some here have mentioned they got an eating disorder and it wasn't even their intent to lose weight and they didn't have any body image issues either. Even I have been labeled as an anorexic by my own mother because I be too lazy to eat or not even think about eating because I be too busy with what I was doing online and also the fact I ignore my hunger pains because I don't want to quit what I am doing so I keep on procrastinating. I was also diagnosed with anorexia nervosa because I was doing it intentionally too all because I thought I was fat and I feared getting fat so I wouldn't eat and ate very little. I didn't quite meet the criteria for it but they diagnosed me with it anyway. They said I was underweight too but I don't think I was. I weigh less now than I did then and I am not underweight. I still got my monthly cycles too and I believe they are getting rid of that part from the DSM V for it if I remember correctly. I am doing better now and am not that bad anymore.


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19 Nov 2012, 12:11 am

ruveyn wrote:
Did you ever have a two pack a day habit? If you have, have you quit.

Smoking is insidious. For seven years after I quit I had this vivid "smoking" dreams. I dream I lit up and I could actually taste the tobacco smoke while dreaming. Also learning not to eat too much. People who quit smoking sometimes go on a snacking binge.

It is a hard habit to break and many people who try to break it fail.

ruveyn



That's correct. Which is why the tobacco industry is so huge: They create a product which most people cannot quit using and deliberately add nicotine in sufficient amounts to make ciggies addictive so that people can buy more.

As for me, I smoked up to 5 cloves a day at the max but it was usually 2 to 4. IDK if you've ever tried cloves but they are MUCH more potent they regular cigarettes and their effects last considerably longer. They smell nicer and you need not smoke as many to get a buzz. Djarum Blacks are the strongest and most nicotine potent tobacco products out there. It's a shame that tobacco is so deadly and unhealthy because cigarettes improve cognition even more than caffeine does.

Worst of all, the moderate stimulants that really help you think harder and stay alert longer are prescription only(schedule II): Like ritalin, benzadrine, dexedrine, and others.

The really powerful ones like cocaine and methamphetamine probably should stay illegal as they are too strong and trigger aggression and violence.



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20 Nov 2012, 12:31 pm

If they don´t want to continue starving, my answer would be: Help them. However, if they keep on starving even if you try to help the, let them die. It´s their (stupid) choice.


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20 Nov 2012, 12:40 pm

AspieOtaku wrote:
id say prescribe some medicinal marijuana that will help.


I'd have to agree.


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androbot2084
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20 Nov 2012, 1:43 pm

the religious right will never accept medical marijuana.