Lessons from Universe 25

Post Reply New Topic

Has anyone seen the Mel Gibson movie Apocalypto about Mayans? I know it's just a movie and it's fictional, but the scenes depicting the Mayan civilization are interesting. I recall scenes of the city Chichen Itza and members of a Mayan cult and they looked literally possessed and were covered in makeup. The movie is about the decline of this city, more or less, or a fictional account of it. Those cult members, now that I think of it, remind me of certain behaviors in the Mouse City. Even though we think of it as a cult and members are acting that way because they are in a cult, it could be thought of as a group that engages in disorganized behavior, kind of like what some of the mice were doing in Universe 25.

What are your thoughts on that? Anyone seen this film and recollect these scenes? One could argue the sacrifice of men to gods is another form of this behavior. It is more complicated than the mouse behavior. It is more like the human version of it.

As the city faced more problems, this disorganized activity, ie; the sacrifice of men to the great serpent/dragon Kukulkan increased and so did this delusion it would cause a positive change and solve the problems plaguing the city.

Goonsquad,
I have been studying John B. Calhoun and his research a bit more. Here's a paper I found useful. Hope you can access it.

http://www.lse.ac.uk/economicHistory/pd ... madams.pdf

One thing this paper discusses is the possibility of anthropomorphism which some have accused Calhoun of. We have to keep in mind, the experiments involved rodents, not humans, so to take the information from the rodent studies, applying it directly to the human population is a form of anthropomorphism and might not be entirely accurate.

Another thing it discusses is that Calhoun, despite all the attention being paid nearly exclusively to Universe 25 and it's gloomy outcome, he did other experiments determining how he could prove therapeutic support for his captive rodent populations. One thing he did was not feed them in the same spot where many of them crowded together since this conditioned them to associate being with other mice and food and this created the infamous Behavioral Sink. He found he could perform simple manipulations that eliminated these overcrowded chambers although the infant mortality rate still festered and was incredibly high, just not as high as it was in the Behavioral Sink chamber.

It is a fascinating subject though, but it is not hopeless. I still advocate focusing on the youngest members of a community because they are the ones that can benefit most from therapeutic approaches like early intervention and the schools shifting from being solely learning institutions to Nurturing Then Learning Institutions. It would require hiring more teacher's aids and they really would fulfill the role of a mother or father, fore example, providing a hug when the child is upset about something. People take for granted how important that is for healthy development. I wonder if the way kids spend so much time in schools without these much needed interactions accounts for so many today who lack nurturing instincts and ability?

I do think the large, project style high rise is the MOST detrimental environment for families and are the source of much desperation in the cities. This is prime example of the inability to form community you see in your neighborhood, Goonsquad, and I suspect you are referring to this type of urban planning as being destructive?

What I think eroded the parental role is the phenomena of over population and something I call the Ruthless Structure, which is like a boundary that sorta dictates certain realities about living in a closed society. It begins with the oldest members establishing themselves, feeling threatened by ever increasing numbers of younger members, and reacting very sternly and harshly toward them, an overreaction, which kind of stunts the younger ones and harms their development. That is just the beginning of the Ruthless Structure. Then you see the other outcomes, one possibility is the insidiously detrimental Behavioral Sink that really consumed and harm a great number of the mice.

Calhoun also talks about Pathological Togetherness, another interesting sociological concept. It just means people want to be with others just to be with them, even if it is to their own detriment. He noticed this in rodent populations in his experiments. They did the same sort of thing. They flocked together in sub groups even if it meant abuse, harm or destructive behavior.

It's also mentioned in the link I provided, the release of adrenaline in over crowding situations and how that can cause groups to ban together, like gangs, for instance, with a heightened sense of aggression. Before I read more, I suspected the bodily chemicals and hormones the rodents released might have also played a role in short circuiting them. Their bodies constantly encountered these chemicals at all times in the enclosure, they couldn't escape them, and this might have had an effect on their mental state and moods.

OAnaO, great article.

They went for the money. Changing culture to change behavior was rejected in favor of drugs for symptoms, and putting about three million people in jail.

Our cages have not been rebuilt to be less stressful, or rebuilt at all.

Back when this was written, Detroit, Saint Louis, Memphis, were still functioning cities. There are more, Cleveland, Buffalo, most of Pittsburg, now in decay.

He is projecting a World Brain to save us, we got the internet, with porn and cat videos.

He was right a few times, it was outsiders who built the digital/computer.

It is also on us to build the World Brain. The Old Rats think everyone dying is a good idea.

So do I, but an intelligent population could reduce their numbers.

We still have the problem of bad parenting, with the worse damage being done before age two, which also fits the rise of the Autism Epidemic. He mentions Autism as a response to hostile conditions.

Studies say it cannot be undone, all the Autism Studies have no results. Nurturing Schools would do no better.

Like Fetal Alcohol Syndrome, Crack Babies, what is done is done forever. They are minority identified, studied, proven connection. Autism is showing up in upper class educated white families.

The signs that we are rats are all around us.