We need to stop labeling dissidents as "conspiracy theorists
Fnord wrote:
The_Znof wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Dissidents need to stop being conspiracy theorists.
Once, shame on me, Twice, Kant get fooled again!One addresses the dissident's identity, while the other addresses their behavior.
Do try to keep up.
well the identity is a result of the behaviour right?
Mona Pereth wrote:
Brictoria wrote:
You may want to revise that claim...Asymptomatic doesn't appear to be an issue (according to a study published by the CDC).
Pre-symptomatic, may be, though.
Source: https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/4/20-4576_article
Pre-symptomatic, may be, though.
Quote:
We determined secondary attack rates (SAR) among close contacts of 59 asymptomatic and symptomatic coronavirus disease case-patients by presymptomatic and symptomatic exposure. We observed no transmission from asymptomatic case-patients and highest SAR through presymptomatic exposure. Rapid quarantine of close contacts with or without symptoms is needed to prevent presymptomatic transmission.
Source: https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/4/20-4576_article
Thanks for the info and documentation. Yes, the people to worry about are the presymtomatic people, not the ones who will never have symptoms.
No worries... I've found there are people who like to focus on minor quibbles (spelling mistakes, badly chosen word, poor analogy, etc.) in order to avoid addressing the subject under discussion, so figured I should let you know about this recent study (I believe the theory of asymptomatic tranmission had been considered suspect for some time).
Mona Pereth wrote:
Nades wrote:
It's becoming more and more apparent that getting a double vaccine isn't going to be enough to for us to be fred from these idiotic, draconian lockdowns.
Just wait for your second dose and ignore all restrictions afterwards. If a guard tells you to put a mask on in a shop just ignore them.
Just wait for your second dose and ignore all restrictions afterwards. If a guard tells you to put a mask on in a shop just ignore them.
Why? What's so "draconian" about wearing a mask?
At least the shop is allowed to be open.
Until the vast majority of the population has been vaccinated, requiring everyone in the shop to wear a mask makes sense. Otherwise, the shop would need to pay someone to do nothing but keep an eye on everyone in the store to make sure that everyone who isn't wearing a mask has a vaccination card. Requiring everyone in the store to wear a mask is much simpler and less costly.
The problem is that it's now everyone that needs a vaccine. Before we were told that only key, at risk groups needed the vaccine for restrictions to be lifted and now people outside those key groups.
Fully vaccinated people coming from amber list countries who test negative also need to self isolate.
By all means vaccinate people, but behaviour that strongly implies that the vaccine is ineffective like I mentioned above only encourages millions of people to give up with restrictions as no acceptable alternative to the vaccine has been put forward.
funeralxempire wrote:
Nades wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Nades wrote:
Mountain Goat wrote:
Mountain Goat wrote:
A good example is what is on the news recently.
With all the obvious lies being pushed about this vaccine, it is no wonder why people don't want it.
If the news concentrated on speaking the truth and not trying to manipulate people, more people would have the vaccine as they would not be so cautious.
With all the obvious lies being pushed about this vaccine, it is no wonder why people don't want it.
If the news concentrated on speaking the truth and not trying to manipulate people, more people would have the vaccine as they would not be so cautious.
I will quote myself to explain something that our news keeps saying which are complete lies.
"Get the vaccine so one is not a danger in spreading the virus to others."
Now vaccines do nothing to stop one spreading viruses. They never have and they never will. All it means is the one who has had the vaccine has an immune system that is or should be better able to cope with the virus or disease that one is vaccinated against. Even if they were able to 100% vaccinate the whole worlds population, the virus would still survive and be passed on from person to person. It just means that the people have a head start if they catch the virus.
Another lie I heard on our local Welsh news several months ago when they were reeling out the vaccines like mad was that they stated that they had already been able to vaccinate 78% of the population and they urged the rest to come forwards when called.
Then a few days ago they said "Only 40% of the population of Wales has been vaccinated and there were concerns that people were not coming forwards".
So what is it? 78% or 40%? Were they lieing before and telling the truth now? Or were they telling the truth now and lieing then?
The problem is when we keep being lied to, we then start to believe there is a hidden agenda behind it.
It's becoming more and more apparent that getting a double vaccine isn't going to be enough to for us to be fred from these idiotic, draconian lockdowns.
Just wait for your second dose and ignore all restrictions afterwards. If a guard tells you to put a mask on in a shop just ignore them.
Sounds like a good way to get kicked out and banned.
If half of people in the shop do it they're in for a handful.
They can call police to remove people who are trespassing if they won't leave on their own accord after being informed they're no longer permitted entry.
They can, but stand no chance is hundreds of people an hour do it
Nades wrote:
By all means vaccinate people, but behaviour that strongly implies that the vaccine is ineffective like I mentioned above only encourages millions of people to give up with restrictions as no acceptable alternative to the vaccine has been put forward.
The vaccines were never claimed to be 100% effective. If I recall correctly, Pfizer and Moderna are said to be 90% effective, whereas J&J is said to be 70% effective.
So it only makes sense to continue with masks and social distancing until the vast majority of people are vaccinated. Hopefully this will take just a few more months?
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Mountain Goat wrote:
Vaccines do not prevent viruses from spreading. They spread anyway regardless if one has had a vaccine or not.
But only among those who have not been vaccinated. Why do you think smallpox no longer exists in the wild?
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Mona Pereth wrote:
Nades wrote:
By all means vaccinate people, but behaviour that strongly implies that the vaccine is ineffective like I mentioned above only encourages millions of people to give up with restrictions as no acceptable alternative to the vaccine has been put forward.
The vaccines were never claimed to be 100% effective. If I recall correctly, Pfizer and Moderna are said to be 90% effective, whereas J&J is said to be 70% effective.
So it only makes sense to continue with masks and social distancing until the vast majority of people are vaccinated. Hopefully this will take just a few more months?
They are never 100% effective but in the UK they make no distinction between the unvaccinated and fully vaccinated.
All the vulnerable adults have been vaccinated now where I live at least so I see little point in carrying on with any restrictions regardless of how small. I had my first dose about a month ago and I'm only 30. People in work who were 27 and 28 had theirs a week after. They're mopping up the last people in their 50s with the second doses.
Freedom is apparently on the 21st but the Indian strain has now brought that into question. Sadly viruses mutating into other strains is just a fact of life and I have no idea why it's being used as a strongly implied excuse for holding back the lifting of restrictions. We were promised vaccines were the road out of this mess but contempt is growing rapidly here.
The government either needs to admit the 100% vaccine they seem to be hoping for will never exist in which case they need to ease all restrictions or they need to admit they're being paranoid and ease all restrictions. They can only do one or the other in the next month.
Failing to lift all measures on the 21st here will just force people to go down the heard immunity route and intentionally spread the virus and get it over with.
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Its about control
Ridicule is a powerful weapon and they use it because it works to control people.
Ridicule is a powerful weapon and they use it because it works to control people.
Not really. You just dig your heels in and become more tribal. Also, you are being controlled. You're a tool of oligarchy, manufactured through 40 years of right-wing propaganda. You're just in denial.
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On the heels of some of what we're talking about - ie. education, progress, deconstructing the power game in ways to allow social flourishing, and the liminal space we're stuck in 'between regimes' or 'between worlds':
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Nades wrote:
China in coming years will become desperate with their huge social care costs, they'll be desperate to make or save money and the people higher up are not to be trusted. In China they have a well known idiom called "Neng pian jiu pian" which translates to "scam whenever you can" so never, ever underestimate what the Chinese government might do. Saving face is just as important of appearing successful in Chinese society and it's not hard to see them resorting to such utterly ruthless and callous behaviour to do so.
I think I can be called a superb Chinese speaker, even by native speaker standards. At least in the range of standard Mandarin, my native dialect and even a part of classical Chinese.
No, it haven't. I have never heard of it.
I searched it on China's internal network, and the search results correspond to that some Chinese students accused a professor of Penn State University of racial slander in his courseware.
Nades wrote:
Their economy will shortly stagnate due to their idiotic one child policy and they're known for being untrustworthy with business and money.
It is full of disputes on the execution process, intensity, and end nodes.
But it is absolutely not idiotic.
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salad wrote:
China is overpopulated, even the death toll in China is easily replenished.
Really? With China has a fertility rate comparable to that of South Korea? We are facing the most serious population crisis in the world.
I think you mistakenly confused us with some South Asian countries.
Then, China has adopted(one of)the strictest control measures in the world to defend its own biological weapons used to destroy its own population?
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With the help of translation software.
Cover your eyes, if you like. It will serve no purpose.
You might expect to be able to crush them in your hand, into wolf-bone fragments.
Dance with me, funeralxempire. Into night's circle we fly, until the fire enjoys us.
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