american shootings

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Funny you should say that...

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp4831748.html#4831748



I've had the challenge up for nearly a year and a half, and all I've gotten was accusations of stacking the deck, since apparently asking for supporting data is considered uncouth by the gun control crowd.

Yeah, it's almost as pointless as trying to drag clean stats and an unemotional argument out of an ignorant anti-gunner.

Anti-gun people don't use facts and logic. If they did, they wouldn't be anti-gun. They base their views on emotion and they typically take their immediate gut feeling on issues and refuse to think further, Guns on college campuses! That's a horrible ide! That's their first reaction and, obviously, they fail to think about it any more for even five seconds.

And don't forget how they love to capitalize on mass shootings to make their point, not that they really have a point. A year ago this week we had treads started after the Sandy Hook shooting that lasted for a month. Gotta ride that wave of emotion for all it's worth.

Yes they are. Want me to find some evidence and post it here?


Learn at least something about the subject of which you speak.


Actually, it IS a right of all free citizens. It's just that not all governments observe that right.


I'm sure there's lots of things we don't "need" but I'll leave peoples needs up to them as individuals.
It's one of those silly freedom things.

Really, you people make it too easy.

How about murder rates in general for humanity?

Humans are the only ones murdering other humans.

Anyone can dress it up however they like, but it's humans doing the murdering.

Putting a pretty facade on it and calling it a developed nation is pointless. Using statistics to manipulate the data is pointless.

It's still humans murdering other humans.

Humanity hasn't even had guns all that long, and has been killing each other much longer with other means.

Humans right now are the only ones that murder humans.

Only what? Only species?

I think you hardly can compare other countries with US people. When US people are speaking of their officials and governments its very often "What THEY do..." "THEY against my rights..."...

It seems for me, that for US citizens, their government seems to be a far away organization, that they have no influence on, so its some mystical organisation, that comes and try to influence their lives.

While if you live in an smaller country, you dont get that THEY feeling. So you dont feel that scared of them. I live in a country with 8.000.000 citizens, so its no anonymous "THEY" doing that stuff, but its the guys we voted to do what we told them, what we want them to do, after we agreed in myjority on what we want them to do. There are no anonymous "THEY" people coming, doing weirdly something "THEY" decided, without even asking us. But its our officials coming, doing the job, that we told them to do. There are no "THEY"´s penalting me if I drive to fast, but there are some guys, that have been told by ourselves to let us pay, if we decide to drive too fast. ^^

I think the US are simply so big, that because of the tons of burocracy and organization between the citizens and their government, there simply has been lost the feeling of them being connected to each other, and which causes this great phobia and suspicions against their own government.

From my oppinion, if its like that, I´d care less about that external minor problems, but simply care more for a change, to give citizens back that ""WE" = "OUR government" feeling. As long as there is no trust, there wont be much negotiation.

I don't get your two questions. What are they referring to out of what you quoted from my statement?

Are you seriously trying to claim that humans are the only species that kill one another?

Not sure what he means by this either.

He could mean:

1) Humans are the only animals that kill humans.

Or:

2) Humans are the only animals that kill their own kind.

The latter is not true. There are other kinds of animals that kill members of their own species.

The first is not exactly true. But it is true that humans are a greater threat to humans than are other large animals . Thousands of humans a year are still killed by hippos, crocodiles, cape buffalos, and tigers. But far more folks are killed by human criminals, in war, in gulags, and so forth (not to mention suicide as well).

But yes-the main threat to humans today is not other big animals eating you.

LITTLE things eating you (insects,parasites, and disease causing microbes) is a bigger threat, as is the threat of other humans.

NO. MURDER, not Kill. There are many deaths of humans by non-humans all the time. People still get killed by wild animals.

Murder is a human construct. Murder is what we're talking about is it not? Humans are the only ones who murder other humans. Killing though, lots of things kill. Technically the absence of things can also kill depending on the circumstances. But Murder is Murder and only humans murder.

If we're in actuality confusing killing and murdering in this thread then we should stop. There is a difference. The difference is much like a rectangles and squares. All squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares. All murder is killing, but not all killing is murder.

What defines murder is killing for something other than self-preservation (defense, food, etc). And yes, other species do that to each other.

Murder is a legal construct by humans. No other animals on Earth have a way or function that allows them to make a legal distinction as to how one way of killing results in murder and one does not.

a) this is completely off-topic. I don't see any way, *at all*, that this relates to a gun thread.

b) The concept of murder is uniquely human, but the definition can be applied to other species just as easily.

Someone was nitpicking the use of statistics and comparing different nationalities and their incidents of murders involving gun crime.

I called them on their attempt of using nationalities as obfuscating the matter at hand that humans use guns to murder people. And now you call my calling someone out on their use of an appeal to small details as an appeal to distraction?

I'm okay with that. I didn't mean to really detract from the main convo that much. I'm really laughing at myself inside. I'm at work and can't really laugh out loud due to not wanting to draw undue attention.