Douchebags - An article everyone should read :)

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Do you suggest that white people who live in say Detroit - though just 10% of the city population - are unfairly seen as "safer" by black police officers, and this is the basis for the "privilege"?

If so, I would think you would want to inquire why people think this way, rather than only looking at it superficially?

While this phenomena could be called a privilege or really an "honor" - there are causes. People believe what they believe for a reason. So far, it does not appear you have addressed why - according to you - white people are given this honor, and some black people are not.

Yes they certainly are, and I am put into the racial group of white even though I am part native american....its interesting to be a mix of white and native american actually and has some of its own challenges. I feel like white people are also stereotyped, I don't want to be associated with rich douche-bags for my skin color is my point. But yes I have seen people being pushed into racial stereotypes and I think its kind of stupid, for instance within listening to a lot of metal and rock I have heard the myth that it is 'white people' music....well music doesn't have a color its for everyone, yet I have even talked to black people who feel pressured to listen to rap and hip hop to fit some stereotype when they'd rather just listen to what they like to give a real life example. Anyways I'd agree racial stereotyping is a major problem.

And I guess I don't understand how a minority could strive to be a rich 'white' douchebag if they aren't white since their skin color wont change if they become a rich douchebag, but whatever, though maybe now white refers to some identity and not a skin color...it all seems very confusing. Though I also think with the advances in like online communication and what not there is more verbal dialogue between people from different places, backgrounds ect....so with that is going to come discussing uncomfortable issues, which can hopefully lead to solutions or people coming to understandings but maybe I am being too optimistic.

yes, actually. That comes from what is known as internalized oppression.


A big part of this is the basic assumptions everyone starts out with.
It is assumed that whites are safe and law abiding. But for blacks, the assumption is that they are dangerous and probably guilty of something... That is another example of white privilege, yes.

There's also another thing at work here. It's called the Thomas Theorem. The Thomas Theorem states "If men define a situation as real, it is real in its consequence."
That has a great deal to do with how blacks and the police interact.

BUT, I'm sure that's not what you're getting at. So, why don't you explain to me how all the blacks in Detroit really are dangerous criminals...

I know for a fact people do not consider me safe/law abiding or even human at first glance.....I have seen people very obviously go out of their way to avoid me, when I am just minding my own business, perhaps that would happen even more if I had inherited darker skin like my dad and sister and some cousins but I look white. So I don't know I am in a rather weird position since native american is considered a minority and white isn't and I am both so yeah. All I know is people with white skin can face discrimination for various reasons....seems like sometimes when white privlege is discussed it comes off in a manner that seems to imply if you have light skin you wont be discriminated against. Also that people of minorities are only discriminated against due to race. Thing is discrimination in general is a problem its not limited to racial discrimination though that is an important part of it.

Also in my area its more like if you look poor the police act like you've done something regardless of skin color, but I also do not live in a predominantly white area either.

The honor of white people being viewed as less dangerous is based on perceptions that associate black people with inner city ghettos, violence, crime, drugs, and gangs.

Yeah, what you're describing is what sociologists call intersectionality. Light skin gives you certain advantages (this also happens among African Americans). Being a young woman gives you certain disadvantages. Your social class also gives certain advantages or disadvantages. Even your taste in music can give you a disadvantage (e.i. if you dress like a metalhead).

This sort of thing happens to everyone. I'm mostly Irish and Native American. I have pale skin, but I have dark hair and eyes and native features. As a kid I was called Chinese and gook because my eyes seem vaguely Asian. As an adult I've been described as "that pale Mexican" more than once...

When I was a kid, late teens/early twenties, I was into grunge and metal. I used to wear ripped up jeans and flannel shirts with the sleeves cut out. I came from a fairly middle class family but I certainly didn't look it. One day my mom sent me down to the county sheriff's office to get something. She was a social worker and she used to do lots of charity stuff with the sheriff's association. Anyway, it was summer, and I was working as a landscaper. I went into the office in my dirty, ripped jeans, flannel shirt, all sunburned and sweaty. The lady at the front desk ignored me for a long time as she and a coworker conversed about 'white trash.'

After I finally said, "Excuse me, but I need to get back to work," she rolled her eyes and asked me what I needed in a very sh***y manner. After I told her my name and why I was there, she got this panicked/embarrassed look on her face and told me how sweet my mom was as she got me her stuff.

Privilege has to do with how many traits you share with the dominant class. The more you share, the more privileged you are.

Rich, attractive, tall, fit, WASPish men are at the apex.

Even now, in school I often get written off as being dumb. I'm in the process of applying for a very competitive professional program at university. I went to see the undergrad director because I needed to get a extension for a volunteer requirement because I was in the hospital and couldn't do it on time.

He basically told me that it was impossible and discouraged me from continuing my application. I told him that I'd already read the policy and that I knew it was, in fact, VERY possible (in a nice way). Then we chatted for a few minutes and I reminded him of a project I did for him in an online class. After this, he remembered who I was and his whole attitude changed because he was judging me on my work instead of my appearance.





edited for typos

Last edited by GoonSquad on 08 Nov 2014, 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yes, I don't disagree with that at all.

The problem here is one of generalization. Many whites are violent, criminals, and drug users, but thanks to white privilege they get the benefit of the doubt.

Many blacks are law abiding, nonviolent, and drug free, but thanks to latent racism and things like the Thomas Theorem they don't get the benefit of the doubt. That's wrong and it has consequences.

Just ask Trayvon Martin or Michael Brown... oh, wait...

I'm commenting a little late here, as the conversation seems to be drifting away from the article, but I for one - -

GIVE IT MY STAMP OF APPROVAL!

I hadn't thought of it before, but yes, the word douchebag best describes overbearing 1%'s and those who want to be them. While I don't exactly agree that Bruce Wayne is a dbag, I think the author is spot on that Tony Stark is, while Peter Parker, Clark Kent, and Captain America are not.
Funny thing is, with the description of the hipster as artsy, over educated, and under employed, I thought, "Hm, sounds very familiar." Not that I make any such claims on that identity myself, as hipsters have too many social rules to follow, I much preferred the label of bohemian.

These different privileges that people speak of, they don't overwhelm everything else is life you encounter, but that doesn't mean they have no effect either. Belonging to certain groups makes it less likely we'll be subjected to certain treatment. Belonging to certain groups makes it more likely shortcomings or failures will be overlooked or treated leniently. In the US and Canada there are benefits socially to being white, to being male, to being cis-gendered, to being heterosexual, to being NT, to fitting societal beauty norms and so on (many of these apply outside of Anglo-America, but in other societies other categories find favour). These benefits are mostly unperceived unless one is actively trying to spot them, the people who benefit from them did nothing to cause the circumstances, so why would they be hated for not having been subjected to additional hurdles? Having a different life experience (which is what all these different privileges added up really amount to) doesn't impact your value as a person (why would I, as a (mostly)white hetero cis male argue against my value as a person?)

Really, the main thing all of this means is that we should be certain to listen to members of these various groups when wanting to understand their life experience. It shouldn't be unreasonable to say that an autistic will better understand the experience of life as a person with autism, blacks better understand the life experience of a black person, transgendered individuals better understand the life experience of a transperson and so on. When members of disadvantaged groups discuss disadvantages they've encountered there's a high probability they might actually have a clue what they're talking about.



Class undeniably bring privilege too. There's many ways they may be read, with a number of elements that colour their perception This is true with every individual, I wouldn't try to argue otherwise. But, that said, it's undeniable that race is one of the elements of ourselves that people use to make blanket assessments of our value as individuals. People who appear and identify as white on average tend to receive different treatment from society in a number of situations. It's not that people's entire life experience is defined by race, but race is one of the aspects of one's identity that impacts one's life experience.

As a comic geek, I cannot pass this post up...

I some incarnations Bruce Wayne ACTS like a douche, such as in the Nolan films... Remember the hotel fountain scene?

In the comics, especially these days, he's much less of a douche. He's usually portrayed as a well meaning, if pampered, philanthropist.

Agreed.

But I thought the whole point was not to have a strict set of social rules to follow and dislike of modern mainstream 'culture'....not that I know anything about such topics.

got a little tiring when it started talking about white privilege. I'm sorry, but white privilege only exists in the places it's meant to, right in the middle of white dominated cultures. Our place in the world basically. Im sorry but thats just a reality of existence. English speaking whites dominate english speaking white cultures. Everyone needs their place in the world where their ethnic group comes first and gets special treatment, and equality comes from the fact that we all have something like that, all of us, providing we werent silly enough to move to some other cultures special place in the world.

The reason why white insults dont work is because he's using them smack in the middle of a white country. The whole country is at their back and it makes the insult meaningless.

Call someone something to do with being white when you're right in the middle of a non white country and the effect is completely different. There's menace to the word gringo when you're in the middle of mexico. Call a white a gaijin when he's in japan and the word hurts.

Then try and stand in mexico or japan and call either a mexican or a japanese person some name connected with their ethnicity. It falls completely flat.

The power of words change as your location changes. And that's the simple reason why white insults dont work on american soil but can be just as offensive when you're in a different country and you really are the outsider and considered inferior because you're not one of the locals.

It's the same as how you can get laughed at when you're in the company of a load of rednecks for saying something intelligent, but then you're in the company of intelligent types and theres a lone redneck getting insulted and the red neck is the one that stands out.

Last edited by dimwit79 on 08 Nov 2014, 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Congratulations. With your examples you just illustrated the entire point of the article. AND, you didn't even have to read it!

Hey everyone! Check out the big brain on dimwit!


And just to be clear,

this is EXACTLY what white privilege is in the context of the article...

Last edited by GoonSquad on 08 Nov 2014, 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Dude, I'm not sure what the eyeroll's for, but I WAS being sincere.
You got it right.