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yelekam
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02 Aug 2013, 7:35 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
Raptor wrote:
You believe that healthcare is a right and not a service.


I haven't heard the Conservatives whining about Obamacare in quite some time. Seriously, not even the Faux News crowd. That must mean that its rollout is going splendidly.


I may not be a conservative per say, but I watch fox news and they complain about Obamacare every day. And Obamacare is stumbling over its own weight. Max Baucus, one of the guys who wrote the Obamacare law has said that they screwed up on making this law and that its a train wreck waiting to happen. Three Major left wing unions have switched sides and are now against the law, because, by their own statements, Obamacare has devastated business, is ruining the forty hour work week, and by consequence hurting the power of the unions. When Republican members in congress tried to pass a law requiring that the congress and their staff would have to go on the Obamacare exchanges, the democrats voted against it. The head of the IRS, the organization that's going to enforce Obamacare, says that he and his colleagues don't want to be on the exchanges either. So what can you saw of a healthcare plan when the people who created it and the people who enforce it don't want it to apply to them. As well as that congressional republicans plan on using the battle over the continuing resolution to try to defund Obamacare. Obamacare will likely crash and burn over the next few years.



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02 Aug 2013, 7:51 pm

Oh, okay. We just haven't heard much lately from the local Fox News cult members. What do normal news outlets have to say about it?



Kraichgauer
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02 Aug 2013, 7:54 pm

yelekam wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
Raptor wrote:
You believe that healthcare is a right and not a service.


I haven't heard the Conservatives whining about Obamacare in quite some time. Seriously, not even the Faux News crowd. That must mean that its rollout is going splendidly.


I may not be a conservative per say, but I watch fox news and they complain about Obamacare every day. And Obamacare is stumbling over its own weight. Max Baucus, one of the guys who wrote the Obamacare law has said that they screwed up on making this law and that its a train wreck waiting to happen. Three Major left wing unions have switched sides and are now against the law, because, by their own statements, Obamacare has devastated business, is ruining the forty hour work week, and by consequence hurting the power of the unions. When Republican members in congress tried to pass a law requiring that the congress and their staff would have to go on the Obamacare exchanges, the democrats voted against it. The head of the IRS, the organization that's going to enforce Obamacare, says that he and his colleagues don't want to be on the exchanges either. So what can you saw of a healthcare plan when the people who created it and the people who enforce it don't want it to apply to them. As well as that congressional republicans plan on using the battle over the continuing resolution to try to defund Obamacare. Obamacare will likely crash and burn over the next few years.


Max Baucus had been trying to weaken Obamacare from day one by preventing the establishment of single payer, so he's hardly the most unbiased commentator on this subject - neither is Fox.
And while I disagree with the stance of those Union leaders who had switched sides on this matter, I have to ask, why do you suppose they are motivated only by keeping their power?

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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02 Aug 2013, 7:58 pm

Conservatives are so not PC that they can get offended by you just saying Happy Holidays.


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02 Aug 2013, 8:00 pm

"Obamacare" is a Keynesian capitalist nonsolution for a problem which can only be fixed through spiritual transformation and socialist collectivization.


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ArrantPariah
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02 Aug 2013, 9:11 pm

Coverage at normal news outlets doesn't seem so negative.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100932111



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02 Aug 2013, 9:46 pm

nominalist wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Conservatives, unlike liberals, don't get up on soap boxes and screech endlessly about equality and diversity, either.


Are you saying that equality and diversity are bad things? Or that anyone who talks about equality and diversity is a hypocrite?

I think we’ve reached a plateau, for lack of a better term, in equality and diversity and the liberals have run out of a purpose in life. Now all they are doing is re-doubling their efforts to no affect but to stir unnecessary and unwarranted resentment.

nominalist wrote:
Raptor wrote:
I can guess why and it goes back to what I and others have been saying in this thread and others.


You can guess why? So you know why my sibling is a very private person? What else do you know about her or him?

I’m guessing that your sibling of undisclosed gender is doing is what most liberals do when they express their hatred of Israel; looking at the situation between the Israelis and Palestinians with blinders on.

nominalist wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Right wingers tend not to be PC.


Oh, no? What about discussing evolution (but not creation) for many conservative evangelicals? Or what about discussing LGBTQ rights in a public school? Many individuals from various points on the right get absolutely livid over that topic. Or what about medical doctors discussing abortion with a patient (without also bringing up adoption or encouraging the mother to keep the child)? That certainly seems like PC to me.


Liberals are PC
Conservatives are not PC
Your definition of political correctness must be different but whatever….

That's it for me clarifying things for you up to this point. If that’s not good enough just ask another right wing fanatic what I mean and I’m sure it’ll be close enough…..
=============================================================================================================
yelekam wrote:
I may not be a conservative per say, but I watch fox news and they complain about Obamacare every day.

I usually just watch a few minutes of local news and that's it. I will admit that I do watch Fox news more than before I started on this forum, thanks to all the butthurt Fox has caused this forum's left wing. I figure anything that burns their asses that much has to be good. I knew "Obamacare" was a piece of s**t when it was passed a few years ago. Anything any news agency says about it pretty much goes in one ear and out the other since my mind has already been made up about it. You cannot polish a turd or say anything to make it worse than it is.
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nominalist wrote:
"Obamacare" is a Keynesian capitalist nonsolution for a problem which can only be fixed through spiritual transformation and socialist collectivization.

Sounds like a nice way of saying we’re collectively going to be screwed.
=============================================================================================================
ArrantPariah wrote:
Coverage at normal news outlets doesn't seem so negative.

Normal being liberal, I take it….. :roll:


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02 Aug 2013, 10:11 pm

When you occupy the lonely corner of the far right, of course everything else will look left wing


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02 Aug 2013, 10:28 pm

Ooh! Ooh! I want to try! Here goes....

You know you're a member of a political group I don't like if:

- you are a terrible person
- I am much smarter than you
- you are a ridiculous hypocrite
- you are a worthless insect
- your ideas are really bad and terrible and hypocritical
- oh my god I cannot believe how stupid you are
- seriously you are a terrible person
- please change your political opinions as a result of me insulting you
- idiot


....well, that was productive.



LKL
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02 Aug 2013, 10:40 pm

Raptor wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I was referring to those conservatives who base their Pro-Israel stance on their evangelical religion.

Ah, the ones the left calls "Christ-o-fascists". :D

aka 'Christian Taliban.'



Raptor
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02 Aug 2013, 10:43 pm

Declension wrote:
Ooh! Ooh! I want to try! Here goes....

You know you're a member of a political group I don't like if:

- you are a terrible person
- I am much smarter than you
- you are a ridiculous hypocrite
- you are a worthless insect
- your ideas are really bad and terrible and hypocritical
- oh my god I cannot believe how stupid you are
- seriously you are a terrible person
- please change your political opinions as a result of me insulting you
- idiot


....well, that was productive.


You forgot to include this one on your list:
-you are a troll

No internet insult should be without the accusation of trollery.


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nominalist
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02 Aug 2013, 10:52 pm

Raptor wrote:
I think we’ve reached a plateau, for lack of a better term, in equality and diversity and the liberals have run out of a purpose in life. Now all they are doing is re-doubling their efforts to no affect but to stir unnecessary and unwarranted resentment.


I can't speak to what liberals think, but I do recognize an ad hominem fallacy.

Raptor wrote:
I’m guessing that your sibling of undisclosed gender is doing is what most liberals do when they express their hatred of Israel; looking at the situation between the Israelis and Palestinians with blinders on.


More ad hominem. Why are you judging someone you have never met? You are also assuming (incorrectly) that my sibling is a progressive. He/she watches Fox News Channel regularly. Could it be that coming from a dysfunctional family, with an Autistic father and an Autistic brother, had something to do with it?

Raptor wrote:
Liberals are PC
Conservatives are not PC
Your definition of political correctness must be different but whatever….


Factually incorrect. I and one other poster demonstrated that. You simply dismissed what we said without addressing it.

Raptor wrote:
That's it for me clarifying things for you up to this point. If that’s not good enough just ask another right wing fanatic what I mean and I’m sure it’ll be close enough…..


If you are a fanatic, that is an issue you need to deal with on your own.

Raptor wrote:
Sounds like a nice way of saying we’re collectively going to be screwed.


Keynesian capitalism (unfortunately), along with World War II, allowed capitalism to survive after the Great Depression.


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03 Aug 2013, 12:36 am

As for Raptor's critical charge that liberals are PC, it should be remembered Keith Olbermann was a liberal firebrand who never was afraid to discard political correctness - and yet, conservatives could never say enough attacking how mean spirited he was. Go figure.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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03 Aug 2013, 1:45 am

nominalist wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Sounds like a nice way of saying we’re collectively going to be screwed.

Keynesian capitalism (unfortunately), along with World War II, allowed capitalism to survive after the Great Depression.

And that analysis has merit as far as I'm concerned but I don't care to deliberate on it very much.
That being the case, the only logical thing to do to rescue the economy now is to start WWIII.

Kraichgauer wrote:
As for Raptor's critical charge that liberals are PC, it should be remembered Keith Olbermann was a liberal firebrand who never was afraid to discard political correctness - and yet, conservatives could never say enough attacking how mean spirited he was. Go figure.

Yes, but it’s not uncommon to hear a liberal say or do very non-PC things.
One example: One of the most liberal people I know I overheard saying over the phone that he would never trust a “n**g*r” with his money. Those were his words, and this is someone who been known to screech incessantly about racism.
It’s not uncommon to hear other racial, sexist, or homophobic comments from the mouths of died in the wool liberals in addition to acts (when no one’s looking) that are not very progressive.
I guess they figure it’s okay since they are more “enlightened” or whatever. Even if they do mean it they figure no one would believe they’re actually like that.


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03 Aug 2013, 1:57 am

Raptor wrote:
nominalist wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Sounds like a nice way of saying we’re collectively going to be screwed.

Keynesian capitalism (unfortunately), along with World War II, allowed capitalism to survive after the Great Depression.

And that analysis has merit as far as I'm concerned but I don't care to deliberate on it very much.
That being the case, the only logical thing to do to rescue the economy now is to start WWIII.

Kraichgauer wrote:
As for Raptor's critical charge that liberals are PC, it should be remembered Keith Olbermann was a liberal firebrand who never was afraid to discard political correctness - and yet, conservatives could never say enough attacking how mean spirited he was. Go figure.

Yes, but it’s not uncommon to hear a liberal say or do very non-PC things.
One example: One of the most liberal people I know I overheard saying over the phone that he would never trust a “n**g*r” with his money. Those were his words, and this is someone who been known to screech incessantly about racism.
It’s not uncommon to hear other racial, sexist, or homophobic comments from the mouths of died in the wool liberals in addition to acts (when no one’s looking) that are not very progressive.
I guess they figure it’s okay since they are more “enlightened” or whatever. Even if they do mean it they figure no one would believe they’re actually like that.


I more than concede there are racist buttholes in every group - including political liberals. But you seem to imply that most liberals in general are guilty of this. Are you sure there wasn't some other reason for this sort of racism among those acquaintances of yours - such as perhaps the part of the country they had been raised in?

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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03 Aug 2013, 2:31 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Yes, but it’s not uncommon to hear a liberal say or do very non-PC things.
One example: One of the most liberal people I know I overheard saying over the phone that he would never trust a “n**g*r” with his money. Those were his words, and this is someone who been known to screech incessantly about racism.
It’s not uncommon to hear other racial, sexist, or homophobic comments from the mouths of died in the wool liberals in addition to acts (when no one’s looking) that are not very progressive.
I guess they figure it’s okay since they are more “enlightened” or whatever. Even if they do mean it they figure no one would believe they’re actually like that.


I more than concede there are racist buttholes in every group - including political liberals. But you seem to imply that most liberals in general are guilty of this.

/\ I said not uncommon, not most.

Quote:
Are you sure there wasn't some other reason for this sort of racism among those acquaintances of yours - such as perhaps the part of the country they had been raised in?

Having actually lived in more than one region of the United States and visited even more, I can assure you that at least racial epithets and homophobia are alive and well outside of Dixie. We've been over this before.
And these "acquaintances" come from all over. It's fairly common for people to move around a little during their lives.


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