Death penalty. For or against?

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Thank you.

You're welcome

I can't be bothered to read the whole thread, but I'm against it, in all cases.

I am all for the right to revenge though, so if someone kills the person who'd murdered their child/parent/spouse/etc I think the penalty should be only symbolic, like 5 years max.

Death is the permanent penalty box topic

I admit I am a tad uncertain. I know there are murderers I would like to see dead (Paul Bernardo), some already executed (Ted Bundy) and some who escaped the death penalty, thankfully (Hurricane Carter, and Steven Truscott), because they were either found to be innocent or there was a miscarriage of justice. This no doubt contributed what legislators had in mind when the death penalty was repealed--the possibility that an innocent person being executed.

There are those who have been executed and were innocent, and exonerated years later. An example is deserters from World War I who were shot due to cowardice. Now we know many were suffering from PTSD.

TallyMan mentioned the hideous scenario of the accused being able to taunt and threaten the victim's family in court. If this occurs, the trial should be suspended and the accused warned that s/he will spend longer in prison and that the trial will be postponed until s/he can behave. Also, if someone was really innocent then that person would not behave in such a manner, or is risking the judge's position of fairness.

At any rate, I believe that in the case where there is no doubt whatsoever the murderer should be placed in total solitary for the rest of his/her life, and given the option of ending it should this be too horrible to bear.

Ooooo Goodie lets have us a lynching

If you demand death, want death but are not willing to induce it, then yes, I think wanting something, screaming for it, demanding it greedily but being too fine or too afraid to do it yourself is pathetic.

It's a whole different thing to not want death or even to just not care and not be willing or be able to do it. That's being transparent and true to yourself. But I wasn't talking about it, so I am not going to assume that you are either.

To further clarify my point; to want and demand a punishment onto another done by others for you while you do nothing is just plain stupid.

If one cannot truly stand behind their demand - any demand - then why demand that thing? To demand it anyway is a sign of one of the hugest weaknesses in character. It means they're either foolish and arrogant or blatantly unaware of the consequences of their desires.

In either case, it's irresponsibility at its highest. And you don't need particular skill to be responsible.

just some good old fashioned vengance.

and I'm not opting for it to go unpunished either, if it was me I'd turn myself in immediately. but I'd still want to do it.

Human beings always want vengeance, retribution, redress. It is hardwired into us, which is why turning the other cheek and loving our enemies goes so much against the grain.

I'm against it because if you enact the death penalty you are sinking just as low as the murderer. Also, if someone is dead they have no chance at all of reforming and becoming a responsible citizen. Society can be protected from possible further murders by locking the murderer up, so killing is unnecessary, and in US states with the death penalty, the crime rate is often higher than in states without the death penalty. Basically, I think it's wrong.

Old fashioned vengance leads to wrongful convictions, so no.

If CP were about vengeance, it would not be nearly as systematic or methodical as it currently is. State execution is a science. Mob justice is pretty sloppy by comparison.

A science? You do not need a lot of "science" to kill someone - since millennia there a lot of well proven methods to do so. Even the deadly injection is not really "high technology" - and in my opinion it is even via the current method quite dump and could be done better and cheaper (eg. 150 mg is given as the lethal amount of morphine, so put 5000 mg into the veins and he/she will be dead certainly and will also have no pain).

who's talking about convictions? the state should not be the one who executes the vengance, that one I agree with.

This. However, I'd also add that there should be as much be tests as possible, to prove the suspect is the actual killer. Also, these tests need to be checked by unbiased qualified people, who know nothing about the case.

For the people saying the Death Penalty (like I described it together with Slowmutant) shouldn't belong in a civilized society, do you realize it's probably more civil than a life in prison? That's like psychological torture, which lasts until they die.

Then the prison system needs reform. That's not an excuse to end a human life.

Taking away someone's freedom IS taking someone's life.

Oh and sure, they could put several billions of money in the prison system, to give those people a good life. But honestly, would you rather have those billions spent on prisoners, or on research into things like cancer?