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Atheists Reason Rally in Washington, D.C., this weekend

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snapcap
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24 Mar 2012, 6:11 pm

Joker wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Joker wrote:
Havent you learn by now Vigilians its pointless to argue try using humor.


I can't wrap my head around why some atheists will say that, unless they want to fancy themselves as having superior thought, perched on a imaginary cloud above theists.


Umm snapcap I go to church every sunday and I am a youth group leader an on our churchs youth council go and mission trips help areas that get hit by natural disasters my opinon is if people do not believe in God then let them what harm are they doing?


I'm not sure what you going to church has to say with what I said.

I'm not trying to tell anyone to not believe in God, I'm saying that there isn't such thing as a non-position/belief.

Check out my OP sometime, it's on the bottom of page 1.



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24 Mar 2012, 6:19 pm

Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:

How so?


They don't feel atheism complements their life any longer so they feel they need to shed the belief for something else.


I do not actually think atheism complements my life right now. I do not deny people sometimes return to religion, but what does this have to do with atheism being a belief system?

snapcap wrote:
Quote:

Lots of people who believe in God/s do not go to church. Likewise some atheists go to church. Is there a code of behavior for being an atheist?


But I'd say being a theist increases your chances of stepping into a church. Do you think there is no difference what so ever?


Church is a community organization, some atheists feel they have to attend in order to be able to coexist peacefully with neighbors who would otherwise shun them, or because their families are religious

snapcap wrote:
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It is not something I consider a core part of my identity on any level. It is my opinion


And just like your belief, your opinion can potential change. You say it like atheism is a part of your core of who you are. How did that become so?


Opinions can change but it doesn't seem likely anything will be presented to me that will. In fact, even if there were God/s, my attitude would not change. I consider the concept irrelevant to my life. I will reiterate that I do not consider my pragmatic atheism/apatheism something that defines me as an individual

snapcap wrote:
Quote:
I don't know. I don't know what it's like living in a world that is devoid of the notion of Zeus or Posedion.


Quote:
This does not answer my question.


It's a sliver of it, I guess. I can't say that the concept of them had no gravity on my life at all. In that case, they might have well not existed, but of course they do.


That's fine, but your existence is not defined by your lack of belief in them

snapcap wrote:
Quote:

How do you get that?


Do you believe that not believing in God constitutes as a lack of belief, meaning that even the belief that God doesn't exist doesn't count as a belief?


I'm sorry but could you rephrase this in a way that makes more sense? I think I know what you're getting at but I don't want to jump to conclusions and give you an inappropriate answer


Methodists dont do those things we accept people for who they are not what their lifestyle or their beliefs are babtists are starting to come around to they even accept gay memmbers into their church an accept women as preachers now to in some babtists churchs.



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24 Mar 2012, 6:27 pm

snapcap wrote:
I don't understand why some atheists claim that their disbelief isn't a belief.


Fail.


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24 Mar 2012, 6:30 pm

snapcap wrote:
I don't understand why some atheists claim that their disbelief isn't a belief.


The lack of something is the not the same as a presence of something else.

If I don't believe X it does not mean I believe not-X.

ruveyn



snapcap
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24 Mar 2012, 6:30 pm

Vigilans wrote:
I do not actually think atheism complements my life right now. I do not deny people sometimes return to religion, but what does this have to do with atheism being a belief system?


Atheism is a belief system, because people have to have a reason to believe there is no God, they don't simply think that for no good reason.

Quote:

Lots of people who believe in God/s do not go to church. Likewise some atheists go to church. Is there a code of behavior for being an atheist?


The only thing I would expect from an atheist is that they don't believe in the existence of God.

Quote:
Church is a community organization, some atheists feel they have to attend in order to be able to coexist peacefully with neighbors who would otherwise shun them, or because their families are religious


Or they'd want their children to feel like they belong in a big community that they couldn't get without it.



Quote:
Opinions can change but it doesn't seem likely anything will be presented to me that will. In fact, even if there were God/s, my attitude would not change. I consider the concept irrelevant to my life. I will reiterate that I do not consider my pragmatic atheism/apatheism something that defines me as an individual


Even if God came up to you, you would still stay headstrong to your belief? Well, if God walked up to me, I don't think it would be so much about belief, but knowledge. "There is God", not "I believe that is God". Although, I'm not sure how you could test the claim.


Quote:
That's fine, but your existence is not defined by your lack of belief in them


You mean my lack in belief of their existence? :wink:

I'm sure my existence has been defined by them more than you think. What if they never existed for the Romans/Greeks? Seems like that could somehow affect how events played out up til today.

Quote:
I'm sorry but could you rephrase this in a way that makes more sense? I think I know what you're getting at but I don't want to jump to conclusions and give you an inappropriate answer


Do you consider yourself part of the bandwagon of atheists that say atheism isn't a belief?



snapcap
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24 Mar 2012, 6:37 pm

ruveyn wrote:
snapcap wrote:
I don't understand why some atheists claim that their disbelief isn't a belief.


The lack of something is the not the same as a presence of something else.

If I don't believe X it does not mean I believe not-X.

ruveyn


"I don't believe that God exists, and that is my non-position."

The presence is of the concept of God, and I'm fairly certain everyone on this broad has been exposed to the idea, and based on their experiences and feeling and whatnot, they have to decide what to believe: Does God exist or not?

I guess it's just a curse for living in this world :lol:



Last edited by snapcap on 24 Mar 2012, 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

snapcap
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24 Mar 2012, 6:38 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
snapcap wrote:
I don't understand why some atheists claim that their disbelief isn't a belief.


Fail.


Hi.



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24 Mar 2012, 7:00 pm

snapcap wrote:
Atheism is a belief system, because people have to have a reason to believe there is no God, they don't simply think that for no good reason.


I have challenged many people here who make this claim to define what this unique atheist belief system is, and I have yet to see a real answer. So perhaps you might try being the first to enlighten me, a pragmatic atheist, in what his belief system is?

snapcap wrote:
Even if God came up to you, you would still stay headstrong to your belief? Well, if God walked up to me, I don't think it would be so much about belief, but knowledge. "There is God", not "I believe that is God". Although, I'm not sure how you could test the claim.


That isn't really what I mean. If I were to choose the most reasonable theism I would say is is Deism. I would probably think similarly to them in that it is an uninvolved God. Furthermore I would stop considering the concept supernatural and instead try to discover what the nature of this extraordinary being is, and what processes led to its evolution and eventual part of it's life cycle whereby it decided to create a new universe

snapcap wrote:
You mean my lack in belief of their existence? :wink:

I'm sure my existence has been defined by them more than you think. What if they never existed for the Romans/Greeks? Seems like that could somehow affect how events played out up til today.


That is not what I was asking you about

snapcap wrote:
Do you consider yourself part of the bandwagon of atheists that say atheism isn't a belief?


I am an individual who does not consider the supernatural explanations offered by various human beings for the nature and origin of the universe the best or most reasonable of available hypotheses.


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24 Mar 2012, 7:03 pm

I just can't get over the fact that some abstinent people still claim that they don't have sex. When it is obvious they have sex with nothing.


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24 Mar 2012, 7:07 pm

Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Atheism is a belief system, because people have to have a reason to believe there is no God, they don't simply think that for no good reason.


I have challenged many people here who make this claim to define what this unique atheist belief system is, and I have yet to see a real answer. So perhaps you might try being the first to enlighten me, a pragmatic atheist, in what his belief system is?

snapcap wrote:
Even if God came up to you, you would still stay headstrong to your belief? Well, if God walked up to me, I don't think it would be so much about belief, but knowledge. "There is God", not "I believe that is God". Although, I'm not sure how you could test the claim.


That isn't really what I mean. If I were to choose the most reasonable theism I would say is is Deism. I would probably think similarly to them in that it is an uninvolved God. Furthermore I would stop considering the concept supernatural and instead try to discover what the nature of this extraordinary being is, and what processes led to its evolution and eventual part of it's life cycle whereby it decided to create a new universe

snapcap wrote:
You mean my lack in belief of their existence? :wink:

I'm sure my existence has been defined by them more than you think. What if they never existed for the Romans/Greeks? Seems like that could somehow affect how events played out up til today.


That is not what I was asking you about

snapcap wrote:
Do you consider yourself part of the bandwagon of atheists that say atheism isn't a belief?


I am an individual who does not consider the supernatural explanations offered by various human beings for the nature and origin of the universe the best or most reasonable of available hypotheses.


I will say this Vigilians isnt like most atheists that I have talked to on WP I have not bashed his beliefs or opinons why because the world is full of people that believe and think diffrently from each other its a good thing to we dont all want to believe in the same thing life would be super boring that way.



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24 Mar 2012, 7:11 pm

Vigilans wrote:
I have challenged many people here who make this claim to define what this unique atheist belief system is, and I have yet to see a real answer. So perhaps you might try being the first to enlighten me, a pragmatic atheist, in what he believes in?


What is your reason for being an atheist, and I'll tell you.

Quote:

That isn't really what I mean. If I were to choose the most reasonable theism I would say is is Deism. I would probably think similarly to them in that it is an uninvolved God. Furthermore I would stop considering the concept supernatural and instead try to discover what the nature of this extraordinary being is, and what processes led to its evolution and eventual part of it's life cycle whereby it decided to create a new universe


Sounds like a challenge.

Quote:
I am an individual who does not consider the supernatural explanations offered by various human beings for the nature and origin of the universe the best or most reasonable of available hypotheses.


But you accept that it is your belief?



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24 Mar 2012, 7:29 pm

snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
I have challenged many people here who make this claim to define what this unique atheist belief system is, and I have yet to see a real answer. So perhaps you might try being the first to enlighten me, a pragmatic atheist, in what he believes in?


What is your reason for being an atheist, and I'll tell you.


I have never been religious. I identify as a human

snapcap wrote:
Quote:
That isn't really what I mean. If I were to choose the most reasonable theism I would say is is Deism. I would probably think similarly to them in that it is an uninvolved God. Furthermore I would stop considering the concept supernatural and instead try to discover what the nature of this extraordinary being is, and what processes led to its evolution and eventual part of it's life cycle whereby it decided to create a new universe


Sounds like a challenge.


Which is what separates the faithful from reality

snapcap wrote:
Quote:
I am an individual who does not consider the supernatural explanations offered by various human beings for the nature and origin of the universe the best or most reasonable of available hypotheses.


But you accept that it is your belief?


I don't "believe" anything, I do not know what the truth of the universe is, and refuse to pretend to have this knowledge


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24 Mar 2012, 7:37 pm

Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
I have challenged many people here who make this claim to define what this unique atheist belief system is, and I have yet to see a real answer. So perhaps you might try being the first to enlighten me, a pragmatic atheist, in what he believes in?


What is your reason for being an atheist, and I'll tell you.


I have never been religious. I identify as a human

snapcap wrote:
Quote:
That isn't really what I mean. If I were to choose the most reasonable theism I would say is is Deism. I would probably think similarly to them in that it is an uninvolved God. Furthermore I would stop considering the concept supernatural and instead try to discover what the nature of this extraordinary being is, and what processes led to its evolution and eventual part of it's life cycle whereby it decided to create a new universe


Sounds like a challenge.


Which is what separates the faithful from reality

snapcap wrote:
Quote:
I am an individual who does not consider the supernatural explanations offered by various human beings for the nature and origin of the universe the best or most reasonable of available hypotheses.


But you accept that it is your belief?


I don't "believe" anything, I do not know what the truth of the universe is, and refuse to pretend to have this knowledge


No one does its all a mystery.



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24 Mar 2012, 7:57 pm

Vigilans wrote:

I have never been religious. I identify as a human


But you are also a human that is an atheist. Why is that?

Quote:
Which is what separates the faithful from reality


Well, you say it like you could do it, but in reality you only believe you could.


Quote:
I don't "believe" anything, I do not know what the truth of the universe is, and refuse to pretend to have this knowledge


But you have to have a belief regarding God. It's not possible not too. The only way it would be possible is you were never exposed to the notion.

You don't know everything there is to know about the universe, but you can still take a guess.

I think being human entails being curious about things we don't know, so we form a belief, no matter how primordial of one.



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24 Mar 2012, 9:25 pm

So who's going?



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24 Mar 2012, 10:09 pm

I'm going to go and hold a sign up that says, "I do not believe in God and that is my non-position" :lol:

Then later, I'm going to jump on a chair and exclaim, " Who here believes that God doesn't exist, give me an AYE! Make some noise!!" :lol:

8)