How did you learn what racism is?

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Yeah, those captchas. I understand. I've never seen such nonsense. Who can we appeal/protest to. It's the stupidest board-wide policy I've ever seen. I've been putting up with it, but it's the worst nonsense I've encountered in a forum board. It makes me feel like a criminal. And what do they tell me? Run anti-virus software? I have anti-virus software. It automatically scans and updates. This is insanity. These captchas need to be removed!

Yes, we differ on details. Those details are important. I regret that these captchas are making that difficult to get to. Weird. It seems to me that you are minimizing these differences. The permanent underclass is real. It IS the problem. It is what makes the job of the police very real. It is not a big deal in some neighborhoods and a huge problem in others. Our neighborhoods are not East LA, or many other terrible areas. Let's acknowledge that reality, and have compassion for the cops who patrol those areas. It's not their fault that they patrol mini-war zones. The thin blue line has existed for as long as police have existed. Since ancient times. That's human nature. It's true of all jobs which entail violence. Police or military. As long as these war zones exist, we all need to acknowledge these dangerous areas and focus on making them livable. That's not the cop's job, it's OUR job. Chicago inner cities. NYC inner cities. We have to clean them up, not the cops.

I happen to have an absolute, real respect for the police.

I haven't been involved in too many traffic stops---but when they do happen, it's "yes, sir, no sir." And that is without sarcasm.

Sometimes, cops do go overboard, though.

On people of color. Not white people. Stop pretending it's your experience. It's not. Your skin color precludes you from having these experiences. Driving while black. No matter what neighborhood you drive through. You're white. Very white, actually, if your AV picture is you. My AV picture is not me, though I am that white. You can "yes sir" your way out of such situations. Recent experiences show that darker pigmented US citizens cannot. I don't see how you can't get that. That's racism in the USA.

If you read all of what I've written, I never stated that I have had the experience of "people of color." Obviously, I've had some advantages because I am white (how did you know that I'm white? But I am white LOL)

However, I have been roughly treated by cops at times.

One time, I was jogging near Prospect Park in Brooklyn, when all of a sudden a bunch of plainclothes cops start chasing me in a car. They got out, and put me on the ground. They thought I had gone into a "drug house" to get drugs. Luckily, I had my ID with me; otherwise, I would have been arrested for nothing.

Another time, I was running towards the beach in Far Rockaway. The cops thought I fit the description of a robbery suspect. He threw me up against a police car. He looked at my bag; it contained towels and bathing suits. He sent me on my way.

You seem like a really nice guy, and I don't mean to insult you, but I don't think you get it. How do you think your experiences with police (and I have similar experiences in my 58 years) would have turned out if you were a person of color? The same? Then you are self-deluded. They would likely been worse. There are many cops who would have ignored the color of the person they were dealing with, and an unfortunate number who would not. Those racist cops will always exist. No efforts to purge them have proved successful. They will exist as long as some areas, which are predominantly minority neighborhoods, exist. Poverty makes these violent areas, and as long as they are predominately minority, they will be treated unfairly. Poverty is the problem, not race. Any poor area which is historically more violent will be treated like this. Even when the violence rate goes down. Do you know why? They look terrible. Broken windows, you know? Have you ever worked in such an area? I have, in NY and Fort Lauderdale. There is no difference, despite the geographic disparities. C'mon, this is just human nature. "Broken windows" is real. It depresses people. It destroys dignity. That's what racism really is. A refusal to respect human dignity combined with an acceptance that poorly educated people without resources will suffer a loss of dignity.

Did I ever give any indication that I don't agree with the above?

Actually, I do agree with the above.

You should read what I've written in other threads.

Well I've read what you've written here. I asked a question, which you've ignored. Do you think your experience with the police would have gone the same were you African American or dark skinned Hispanic? Based on my own, similar experiences, my answer, for myself, is very possibly not. If you luck out, you're home-free. If you get a racist cop, a dark skinned person's experience will be very different from how that cop will treat me. If someone's in a tough neighborhood, their chances of encountering a racist cop will increase greatly. In other words, your anecdotal experiences with cops are irrelevant. Deal with the larger reality, not your anecdotal experiences. Do not refer me to what you've written in other threads. I would appreciate an answer to what you've written here, which frankly I don't think is reflective of what you really feel. I don't wish to be unfair to you, but what you've written here is wrong.

I didn't ignore any question. I just think you want a rhetorical debate.

In the case of the robbery situation, I believe a black/Hispanic person would have been released, too, for lack of evidence. I was in a tough neighborhood at the time: Far Rockaway, Queens. Mostly black.

In the case of the jogging situation, I was lucky I had an ID from my job; otherwise, I would have been arrested. The case would have probably been dismissed for lack of evidence; but I would have spent the night in jail. I was in a tough neighborhood at the time: Ocean Avenue adjacent to Prospect Park, near Parkside Avenue. About 90% of the residents are black West Indian in that area.

By the way, I'm married to a black West Indian.

Let me emphasize: There are racist cops everywhere, and black and Hispanic people are hassled MUCH MORE than white people. I am AWARE of that. And I'm aware of all of what you say, and agree with most...AND HAVE SAID THAT ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION.

I feel like you're just trying to have a little fun.

Well, Sir....go ahead and have your fun. But it ain't fun for me.

Last edited by kraftiekortie on 20 Jul 2016, 5:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

What is in it for them, if they stay???

No one is obliged to sacrifice his and his family well being for the General Good.

I had a seminal experience at age 11 in summer camp.

I went to a YMCA camp. At least 3/4's of the kids were black. I shared a bunk with three black kids.

We, in that bunk, bonded.

I learned, that year, that skin color doesn't mean beans.

Not only do I not like blacks, I don't like white people that much either.

Whites are the ones who tormented us.

Whites are the ones who humiliated us.

When I see a white person, I map their face structure in my mind and see if it fits some prior jerk that wronged me, then I imagine that person has that jerk attitude.

All my conflict is with whites.

The white guy across the street from me called the cops and told them I am ret*d. He didn't like my dog crapping on his lawn. So the cop came out and kept asking me if I was ret*d. He asked me like ten times.

Why did you let your dog crap on his lawn?

I was walking it, and it randomly picked that yard.

He made up a huge lie that it attacked him.

That is what a low class white is like, and why you want to avoid them.

This is the root of all racism. Excluding only white people from the phrase "people of colour" is inherently divisive.



This is how racism presents. One wonders how much your own preconceptions colour your interactions with white people.



Excellent advice. Now, how does one distinguish between a low class white and a non-low class white?

Next time, bring a paper towel so you can clean up after your dog.

A mistake a lot of people seem to make with racism is not understanding where the balance lies.

I think the first stage people get to after deciding racism is bad is actually some kind of weird positive racism.

You shouldn't really be thinking either positive or negative about someone on the basis of their race.

Something i notice liberals do right now is not being able to look after their own needs because of being overly concerned about racism. It's like they can't say no to them. They can't dislike them. They cant criticize them.

I've met many black people that i just didnt like, but it had nothing at all to do with their skin colour, and everything to do with personality traits that i wouldnt like on anybody no matter their race.

The day you're truly over racism you learn to stick up for your own rights no matter who you're dealing with. You're not unfair to them, you're not too generous with them.