Why do Americans love guns so much?

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By 1791 I was reffering to the year the second amendment was passed, not the year the military was formed.

You can take part in an armed rebellian against the government if you like but I don't like your chances of survival. It didn't work too well for the Confederates.

I know you'll say you have a good chance of defeating the goverment because of guerilla tactics, other tactics, etc but the thing is, it's very likely that neither of us will ever know who'd win because it's unlikely there'll be an american civil war in our life time, rendering the debate academic.

I get it. You don't want to face a lot of armed thugs without being armed yourself. That's perfectly reasonable.

Where I live I don't have easy access to a gun but neither do the thugs. The purpose of this, isn't to make it so civilians are unarmed and thugs have easy access to arms, the purpose is to keep guns away from the thugs.

I know it's been said many times that if you outlaw guns only outlaws will have access to guns but we outlawed guns and our outlaws don't have guns. I'm sure Aussie thugs want guns and would have no qualms about using them but majority just don't have access to guns. Black market guns are beyond the price range of most thugs. The proof is in the pudding. We haven't had a gun massacre in more than 20 years.

I certainly wouldn't want to fight a gun weilding thug while unnarmed but if I had a choice I'd choose both me and the thug being unnarmed rather than both of us being armed. Even if I lost I'd survive. This is not a hypothetical choice. We as a country made that choice.

I'm not telling you which laws you should enact in your country or saying the whole world should be like us. I get that a policy that's successful in one culture might fail in another culture. I get that smuggling things into the US is much easier because you have land borders with other countries. It's a good deal easier to keep out contraband when you live on a big island.

I love my shovel more than my gun.The gun is a nessecary tool and I had to use to twice in the last couple of months to put down two sick deer with chronic wasting disease.If I didn't have the gun they would have suffered needlessly.The gun was more merciful than beating them in the head with a rock or letting my dogs chew them to death.

I'm glad you didn't let the deer suffer. Would I be right in thinking you used a shotgun or rifle and not a handgun?

Maybe just have shotguns and rifles. They're too big to conceal about your person. There are certainly legitimate uses for guns such as hunting, putting down sick animals or home defence. If you're using it for a legitimate purpose there's no need to conceal it.

Handgun,I was close enough.Most hunters carry one to put an injured animal down.
Most people here have guns,for hunting and self defense.It's a very rural, sparsely populated area.It would take the police at least thirty minutes to arrive at my house.Longer other places,you are kind of on your own till they arrive.
They don't even patrol the back roads,just the main paved ones.Not very many of them either and they don't get paid much.$21,000 a year.Hardly worth risking your life over.They tried to get a raise but it got voted down.

I was wrong I get it. The police live far away. I don't know how long it would take them to get to my apartment because I haven't had to call them since I moved here. I have very little faith in the police but I just haven't seen any hint of violent crime in this neighborhood. I just don't need them.

I used to live in a higher crime neighborhood. I was victim to a few crimes but as none of them involved guns none of them were potentially lethal.

Anyway, I'll try to stop being judgemental of other cultures. I think I got sidetracked with hypothetical scenarios about who would a gunfight between X and Y. My question was "Why Do Americans Live Guns So Much?", not "Americans give up your guns", really I don't want to tell you want to do in your own country and I think you've answered that question.

Last edited by RetroGamer87 on 12 Mar 2017, 10:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yes, I understand what you were referring to----but, my point was that if the second amendment was made AFTER the military was formed, then they still felt a need for the PEOPLE to have a right, to form a militia (IMO, so that the people wouldn't fall-victim to a tyrannical government----I mean, afterall, that's why we left the king).


As for my chances of survival: I've been saying for, at least, all of my adult years, that I'd rather stand and die, then live on my knees----so, if I die in defense of freedom, there's no better way to go, IMO.

IMO, it's not about knowing who'd win, it's about being prepared, if need be.


You seem to have considered all angles / are really thinking----even though, some of your thinking may be a little off (like, you'd survive a fight with a thug----I don't know about that, unless you know how to "street fight"; IMO, it's not just about knowing how to cold-cock someone, it's about knowing their mind / the way they think)----so, now the question, is: Why did you ask, in the FIRST place. (wink)

For ME and many others, the bottom line, is: It's in our Constitution----and for many, it's our culture / ingrained in us, from birth (myself, included), and we're just not gonna give that up. I can understand not being able to understand such an extreme / deep-seated passion----especially, when it's one for which someone has no qualms about sacrificing their life----but, that doesn't mean it's wrong (NOT that that's what you were saying), it's just different.

SURE, there is!! If more people in that Colorado theatre would've had a concealed gun, maybe that "Joker" guy wouldn't've been able to take out so many people----and I feel taking HIM out, would've been legitimate!!

If only there had been some way to James Holmes from obtaining guns.

So, you've never heard of someone killing someone else, with their bare hands----or, accidentally killing them, when they threw them down on the ground and they hit the side of their head on the steps----or, intentionally killing them, by bashing their head in, with a rock or brick?

There was/IS----IIRC, he was a certified nutcake (had been seeing a psychiatrist), and it wasn't reported, or whatever should've been done.

This conversation has now gone in the direction that I feel it SHOULD go in----determining what is BEHIND why so many people get killed by guns, in this country. IMO, it's not about the implement chosen to kill someone (as I've already said, someone can kill somebody else with almost ANYTHING), it's about WHY someone would want to kill people!! How do these people who commit murder, BECOME such nutcakes??! ! Is it violent video games, violent TV/movies, absent parents, un-guiding parents, disorders, drugs, mis-use of prescriptions, poverty----or, what? THAT'S what I feel conversations / campaigns should be about, when there's gun violence!!

First of all, a question: is the basic premise of gun control not to make a safer haven for people by eliminating a potentially dangerous element? Was this not the same basic premise of banning marijuana, to eliminate a potentially dangerous mind-altering substance to make the place safer for everybody? Marijuana IS a mind-altering substance, if it did not alter how your mind worked, people wouldn't be using it. What kind of effects it has and to what degree is different for each person, but it is mind-altering. And yet, here we are seeing first-hand that legalizing marijuana can actually eliminate several dangerous elements that were precipitated by banning it in the first place! It is a perfect example of "Meeting one's destiny on their path to avoid it". Couldn't banning an item from society bring about the very same potential problems in society that the item would have caused had it not been banned?

"Those who trade liberty for security will have neither" Thomas Jefferson
"It is far better to live a day on your feet, than to live a life on your knees" Emiliano Zapata

Also, the whole gun debate is not, and has never really been only about guns, per se. Making the issue about guns has been a fairly Leftist straw-man type tactic of misrepresenting the issue. The real issue has always been the ability of an individual to defend their life and their property, and by extension, utilize whatever tools they need to do so. A gun is simply another type of tool that one can use to defend themselves. And like all other tools in this world, it can be turned around and used offensively to attack somebody else. In some way, having a gun is not jsut a "right", it is an ability. Somebody telling you that you are not allowed to own, carry, or use a gun, is nothing other than somebody trying to restrict how you are able to defend your life and property (you could make the argument that it is to make the area safer, refer to previous paragraph). Obviously this has other implications, such as "What else can that person/people do to you when you have nothing with which to defend your life and you family?" For me, specifically, owning and carrying a gun is partially about the expression "Nobody can take advantage of you, unless you let them". Having the confidence to physically defend your life and the peoples around you in a very quick, effective, and decisive manner, even if 99% of the time the gun is never removed from the holster, goes a long way towards people being able to go out in public and live in their homes, without fear, and focus on more important issues, now that the physical safety of your life is fully in your own hands. It is about responsibility, clear thinking and focus, consequence, and trust.
Not to mention, gun control laws in this country, as well as others such as Australia (Don't quote me on that one though) have a very controversial history or racism, for disallowing black people and hispanics to own firearms.

1. Welcome aboard
2. Yes, the genesis of gun control in the US is racism based (i.e. Jim Crow laws). Ironically, the people that screech the loudest in favor of gun control also screech the loudest against racism.

True those things are very possible but why make it easy for them. Have you ever tried to kill someone without a gun? It's really hard.

It's pretty hard to kill someone with your bare hands and even cutting someone's throat takes a lot of force.

I feel like it might be time to revive my gun control challenge, it's been a while since we culled this herd.

Depends on the circumstances. If you're taking your victim unaware, a quick stab through the carotid artery into the vocal cords would take relatively little force, and minimise the chance of them alerting anyone nearby.

Hypothetically, of course. This is purely informational and not at all advisory.

True but hypothetically this unaware victim wouldn't be any better off if he had a gun, if he gets taken unaware that is.

If an unarmed victim was aware of the stabber it would more difficult for the stabber to gain access to the victim's carotid artery. He could block. Even if his arm gets slashed that's more survivable than being stabbed through the carotid artery.

Of course neither one of us can no for certain. No one's ever attempted to murder me with a knife and it's very likely no one's ever attempted to murder you with a knife either.